John

If you don't know how to find the great parts of the city, you miss something special. If you really feel you don't like the city - simple stay away - we can get by without you. If you want history, great food (S. Philly, Olde City, Center City), and lot's to do (museums, sports, outdoor activities, etc.) welcome to Philly!

trustme

I first want to respond to me (again, reading your post the first thing that came to mind was you should be mad at your tour director not the city of Philadelphia! Why would it be the citys fault that the bus driver and tour guide had not researched the parking, loading and unloading details prior to arrival? You also said you had spent the day on historical tours with no mention of any major problems, cities are not about their 100,000 plus event centers most of which are new additions and usually not very well planned in their locations. I was born in Phila, and lived there for many years, I currently live in St. Louis and trust me Philly has much more going for it. I have found that in all the different cities I've lived in (Austin Tx,Denver,st.Louis, D.C. area,Phila) and visited (vast amount) the worst tourists are those whose main reason for travel is a sporting event!

x

I am so surprised! I stayed in Philadelphia in August and I thought it was a lovely city, clean, loved the museum,the parks,the shops,the food. Is this perhaps someone who just had a bad time and it blaming the city for it? Maybe Rex is from the country and is not accustomed to the way things are in cities, I know that driving into any city, you go through the worst neighborhoods first, could that be the reason for this post or how about this question-how many cities has Rex been to in order to make this comparison?

jal

You list St. Louis as ugly??!! I think it is truly attractive, lots of parks, the Riverfront, the Arch, trees & neighborly neighborhoods...makes me wonder about your criteria!!

njgirl

I thought St Louis was pretty too.I think there are some runners up at least for ugly cities in NJ-most of Newark,Elizabeth,Union,yuck, that is what gives NJ a bad name, drive past them and you want to keep going! I live in NJ, so I am allowed to bash it --I live in one of the pretty spots~

Jace

I have a really good idea for you if you are so concerned about how ugly Philly is: Get a life!

erin

I'm using this thread selfishly--I'm apologizing ahead of time! I grew up in the suburbs of Philly and am now planning on moving to center city (I love Philly, obviously). There is an area of the city that I have heard mixed opinions about, and I need more input. The area around 12th/13th and Chestnut--I've heard it's full of strip clubs from someone; also heard that it's a business district that virtually shuts down at night; others say it's a great place to live. I'm going to go check it out myself but I would love to hear from more experienced Philadelphians. Thanks so much.

Jim

I Love Philly. There are ugly looking crime ridden parts in every major city,just don't hang out there.
Was there last week to see the Thomas Eakins show at the Philadelphia Museum of Art,wonderful.
Then had a great dinner at Brasserie Perrier also wonderful, though a bit too expensive.

Susan

Where are the unsafe areas around UPenn? Specific areas as my daughter is looking for off campus housing? Thanks from worried mom

David

Susan,

This board is not going to be a good source of the information you're looking for...too many people make blanket statements on topics they know nothing about.

I am a Penn alum who lived off campus for 2 years, but it was more than 10 years ago. I assume your daughter is an upperclassman..she should be able to make a good judgement on what areas are safe based on what's been happening in the past year or two.

In general, the closer she lives to the core areas of campus, the safer it is. This is for two reasons:
1) her neighbors are most likely to be other students
2) the area will be patrolled by both Philadelphia and University police

If there is any doubt, you can easily find out what boundaries are patrolled by the University police.

Also, some streets and routes are better lit at night than others. Again, it's been a while since I was there, but you could encourage your daughter to consider this factor when choosing where to live.

You should know that all my friends lived off-campus for 2 years...it's very common...I don't anyone who was the victim of a crime.

deb

I thought the ugliest over arted city was New Orleans. What a dump!

s

Philly is a great city. I have only seen it from a tourists point of view but I have been to far worse places, like Deb said, New Orleans - The pits of the earth

Maureen

Rex and me again - Are you two crazy? - Rex you are going to judge the entire city by a drive from Abington through North and West Philly PLEASE!!! This area is not representative of the entire city and suburbs and I know since I have lived in this area 25 of my 42 years of life. Rex next time drive through the historical sections of Philly and then take Lancaster Pike and drive through the western suburbs and the main line area and see some of the prettiest areas around including Valley Forge. Like most cities, Philly has many beautiful places to live. Me again - you are going to judge the entire city by your one experience at a sporting event. You must not travel too much. I've lived in many different regions and when the opportunity presented itself, I jumped to move back to this area.

elle

Oh, Puh-leese! Don't invite these Phillyphobes to come back for a second look--they are exactly the type of folks we don't want here (we don't have enough Shoney's for them)!

The people who love Philadelphia are generally those who have experienced the world--those who value things like four centuries of extraordinary architecture, a sensible and yet aesthetically pleasing urban plan, world-class performing and fine arts, vibrant and diverse neighborhoods, the natural beauty of horticulturally significant urban parkland, and some of the most adventurous and renowned restaurants in the nation.

It's true that the drive from Abington to Center City takes one through the heart of the inner city (although if you truly ended up in West Philadelphia--which is no where near Abington--you were lost, as well as misguided) and would give all but the most hardened urbanite the willies. The answer, however, is not to be found in the pasteurized tracts of Vanilla-nova.

Philadelphia is a real city, not a Disneyified one. Most of Philadelphia--from Rittenhouse Square to the Art Museum Area from University City to Old City--is quite beautiful (think of Toulouse--Philadelphia is America's "ville rose") and quite safe. Then there are areas with a gritty charm that are perhaps not for everyone--the Italian Market and Northern Liberties come to mind--but if you are capable of opening your mind, you will find wonderful treasures there. Just the other night we enjoyed a first-rate meal and evening at Pigalle, a colorful new bistro in Northern Liberties. The previous weekend, we had a wonderful meal at Avenue B, then saw Maurizo Pollini with the Philadelphia Orchestra at the Kimmel Center, followed by drinks at the Ritz Carlton. In the week in between we enjoyed rollerblading and cycling by the river and caught two new films that haven't even been released in some other markets.

Ugly cities--don't get me started. Houston would be at the top of the list, with Dallas and Fort Worth not too far behind. Atlanta, Miami, Tampa, Orlando, Phoenix.

For the mother who's worried about sending her daughter to Penn--University City, once rather down-at-the-heels and scarey, is Philadelphia's comeback neighborhood, with great restaurants such as Pod, Zocalo, and the White Dog scattered among scads of good but inexpensive Indian, Thai, and Ethiopean restaurants. There are arts venues of all sizes. I would feel perfectly comfortable sending my child to school there.

Why did the Republicans hold there convention here? Perhaps because our Democratic mayor was shrewd enough to give them the best deal for their money!

And what you all call rudeness goes under the sobriquet of "attitude" here and is generally considered an asset . So bite me.

Tom

Since we are on the topic of ugly cities, I would agree with New Orleans being a dump, but I also found San Francisco to be quite dumpy as well when I was there on a recent business trip. Lots of homeless people, mostly in the tourist areas and even in some of the nicer neighborhoods as well as hookers. I think Philadelphia is a great place. And to those who think otherwise, your input is not welcome, and please do not come back here.

Howitzer

I was walking through downtown philly late this afternoon. i happened to pass a demolition site where an old building was being torn down. the site was a pile of broken girders..bricks and stones. in the midst of all that mess were large beautiful masonry sculptures of lions and other images that were once part of the facade..they were just lying about the ruins. Anyone with some strength and a truck could have made off with them. (philadelphia is not a city where you see too many fences) philadelphia is an embarassment of historical and architectural richness. yes..sometimes though it takes some keen observation to find the gems amongst the ruins but the city is full of them indeed. NOW, CAN WE DROP THIS THREAD ALREADY?

Gail

Elle,
As a native Philadelphian, I LOVED your post. You go girl!