jnn1964

I'm sure there are a lot of 18 year old soldiers in Iraq who would be bemused by this thread.

placeu2

I do have kids in this age bracket.

It amazes me that adults, parents or otherwise, have the opinion that just because some kid turns 18 or 21 that they are instantly capable of making adult decisions. I thought that I was at that time...I was wrong.

My kids are great, neat, responsible young adults. They have been/are away at college now. Mom and Dad still know best and have every right to say no. They still need guidance and in some cases, supervision. If my 19 year old college son wants to go within the US for spring break with some friends (and pay for it himself)...I will give him some advice and wish him well. There is no chance that I would agree to that prior to college.

By the way gambling can, in some cases, take place at Indian casino's only if no alcohol is served. Drinking can and does take place at bars in Mexico for under age types.

To each their own.

TxTravelPro

My 18 (almost 19) year old wanted a room for New Years. I got her one but they would have rented to her no problem.
She simply wanted to be next to the place they were going so she would not have to drive home. They were not drinking, they were going to dinner, a movie and Gameworks. Innocent stuff...
There were 3 of them... NOT all kids are irresponsible.

beachbum

I was a very young, naive, 19-year-old when I took my first trip alone. I and a buddy bought a one-way ticket to Europe. He stayed three weeks. I stayed 11 months, and returned home a much wiser and more mature 20-year-old.

I now have a son graduating from high school this spring. He's talking about piling into a car with a couple friends and driving from Portland, OR to Los Angeles for spring break. His one mention of a senior trip has been a possible (booze) cruise (from LA I suppose) to Costa Rica. When you're in international waters, I'm guessing there's not much that's illegal......

Will I let him go? Can't really stop him! Other than by example, I figure he stopped learning from me 6-7 years ago. Now, it's mostly by experience. So, I'm giving him a lot of rope. Hopefully he makes enough bad choices while still under my care to know not to make them when he's not.

And, one word of caution from personal experience. It's often the well-behaved, seemingly self-directed/motivated, good kids who become the biggest partiers when the choices become theirs to make.

JJ5

jnn1964, that is wrong and is detestable. 18 or 19 is too young to be in Iraq. And you need a parent to "sign" to get you in young. Ugh!

And that's only one reason why liability laws have to change even further. And/or maybe voting age too. My brother is over there right now, and that is the only thing that he has really bitched about in emails since he got there. No 18 or 19 year old has enough prior life experience to move to that arena by choice. They are going by the guidelines of 100 years ago, when a person had adult responsibility and heavy work starting at about 14 to 15.

You have no idea how much BAD news comes out of these kinds of grad trips. I have been on the giving message end of having to tell a parent that they rolled the car in Wisconsin and that their daughter was not going to make it.
(Take your time, but drive briskly as they need you to sign for her organs.)

The statistics aren't good, and there is no reason to not wait a few years- after having some "out of the home" life experience.

atilla

OMG JJ5, Heavens didn't ask your permission to let her daughter travel, she asked some very speciific questions that you obviously don't have the answers to, back off already.

Heavens is going to do what she sees fit whether you like it or not.

JJ5

And she or very few of you know that liability laws in the USA do make the parent responsible for damages in nearly every state, especially property damages.

And that death/disability/property damage to all of the rest of us, especially in the 17-19 year old DUI category is not good, despite Mothers Against Drunk Drivers etc. We all pay.

And you can say no, beachbum. Yes, you can. To quote Bill Cosby "I brought you in this world, and I can take you out again."

Don't give anybody enough rope, ever- let alone one of your own kids. I don't care who likes my answers or not. Heavens, you don't even realize that damage costs recur to you and not your daughter, unless she is emancipated. If she is on your income tax, she is not.

Suzie

Gambling at Indian casinos is 18 ONLY when there is NO alcohol served on the premises. If the casino has decided to serve drinks, the age is raised to 21.

beachbum

"I brought you in this world, and I can take you out again."

Except that we didn't, JJ5. He's adopted. And we suspect that surrounding issues are a partial explanation as to the challenges in parenting him. That aside though, Cosby's comment fails to consider that there is no one fits all parenting model. Even though it's resulted in sleepless nights and a few calls we'd rather not have gotten, it's what seems to work best for him.

Cassandra

First of all, make a distinction between "rite of passage" and "right of passage." "Rite" refers to a traditional ritual and usually involves a social group of several generations. "Right" is something one is entitled to and that the law guarantees. That doesn't apply here, does it?

I'm not just giving you a spelling lesson here -- it's an issue about how to think about this. This business of something being a "right of passage" is really shaky, imho -- no one "needs" a cruise or a car or a trip to a casino as an inevitable result of turning a particular age and/or doing pretty much what they were supposed to in high school. And if it's a "rite," maybe it should involve another generation -- not necessarily you but a responsible "elder."

You want to tell OD you're proud of her, great! She wants to go off with peers doing seriously adult-level things, expensively, without accompaniment? I say there's no obligation whatever to make that possible. There's a REASON car rental companies, bars, etc. don't treat 19-yr. olds as adult customers.

I have a seriously good kid, too, who couldn't have made me prouder with grades, college acceptances, extra-curriculars, judgment, etc. But that doesn't mean he didn't start some experimentation (no, not drugs or alcohol; other stuff) that scared me to bits sometimes; and I knew I had to let him do it. But a step at a time -- e.g., once he was in college, nothing to stop him from going on all kinds of trips with peers, etc. And he did have fun (I hate ski boarding without wearing helmets...)

But the moment they aren't 17 anymore? Did the Wisdom Angel and the Luck Fairy bop her over the head at midnight and make her smart and invincible?

Congrats on having a kid you're proud of and trust. Don't blow it at the last minute.

Barbara

JJ5, you don't need a parent to sign to join the military at 18 and there are a awful lot of 18 and 19 year olds in Iraq.

Heavens, I agree with your thinking that a chaperone would be good. Maybe you could find something where the girls could have quite a bit of freedom to do their own thing, BUT you are there to make sure that their own thing is OK. You don't have to go everywhere with them.

FainaAgain

My mom went off to college at 17. Her parents worried sick about a sheltered girl being on her own.

I went off to college at 17. My parents worried sick about a sheltered girl on her own.

Luckily I didn't have daughters With my husband we worried (and still worry) about our sons going off to colleges at 18. And to Europe at 19.

Is there the same pattern in your lives?

nytraveler

I agree that many 18 and 19 year olds are shockingly naive compared to the way we were. But sheltering them further is really not the answer. They need to be allowed - or if necessary forced/encouraged to grow up. (This was a major bone of contention between my beau and his ex - he insisted the girls grow up - have part time jobs, take part in school trips and volunteer activities - rather than remain babies.)

Granted this is easier in NYC than many other places - since reality has a habit of intruding. But perhaps those living in suburban/rural areas need to ensure that their kids get some city polish before they're 18 - after all my friends and I did things in the City by ourselves from the time we were 12. And a little sophistication/worldly wisdom certainly didn;t hurt us.)

As for rules and supervision at college - I have recently been back to my alma mater - a major state university for a reunion - and my stepdaughters are now in college - one in a state university and one in a private school. And while there are certainly a lot more support mechanisms available than there were when I was in school - there is literally no supervision of students at any of these schools. Granted in two places resident freshman are required to live in dorms rather than in private housing - but this no effect since dorms are for students only - there are no faculty or housemothers or ??? Each dorm has an RA (resident assistant) or equivalent - but these are administrative posts - not substitute parents - and believe me - no one is controlling - or even aware of what any of these kids is doing.

If you child is so naive when starting college (and since when did this get to be 18 - my friends and I were 17 when we started) they are going to grow up very fast one way or another. It seems to be a better choice - with a much lesser chance of dangerous mistakes - to mature them before hand as much as possible - rather than throw them in to sink or swim at the magic age of 18.

Patty

Heavens,
Double check the cruise thing because I'm pretty sure that most lines require at least one passenger in the cabin to be over 21. To answer your other question, I took my first solo trip abroad (Paris) when I was 19 and had a great time. Having traveled a lot when I was younger, I'd like to think that I was already pretty travel savvy by that age. I even used my own FF miles to get to Paris.

wantsomesun

I did a Senior trip BY MYSELF, and had a great time.

I would suggest Nassau, Bahamas as a great destination. Staying at the Wyndham, on Cable Beach, or at the Nassau Beach Hotel, they are right on the beach, have lots of restaurant options close by, so they don't have to go far, they can drink and gamble at 18 there, and have a great time.

You might call the hotel to see what requirements for credit card they have, but I don't think it should be a problem. If it is please let me know and I can make a couple of calls.

Hope they have a great time.

GoTravel

Okay Heavens, I'm going to add my two cents from a hotel's point of view and hopefully OliveOyl will also chime in.

Any hotel in a resort or tourist destination that you would feel comfortable letting your daughter stay in WILL NOT allow 18 year olds to check in without a chaperone over the age of 25.

In my former hotel, and this is the case with most hotels (again, in a resort destination) the minimum age limit is 25 years old.

There is no across the board rule and individual hotels make their own rules but the above is pretty much industry standard.


Just food for thought and I know you said your girls don't party BUT, when kids get around kids, they tend to go with the pack.

I would not and did not let my stepkids go on senior trips unless chaparoned by their father, mother, or me.

They do in fact need a chaparone.

amwosu

Packing kids off on an unsupervised senior trip does NOT make them more mature and NOT letting them go on an unsupervised trip does NOT mean they are sheltered.

I will not be sending my midwestern suburban children off on an unsupervised senior trip and I do not think I am depriving them and I do not shelter them. My 16 yr old has a drivers license and a job, gets excellent grades, has awesome test scores, is involved heavily in music education and has traveled alone on several trips to attend music training in other states. He often has to fly alone to catch up with the rest of the family for vacation as he has last minute musical engagements. He has stayed in hotels alone, stays at home alone, and has flown alone to meet us in other states. My 14 yr old navigated the Paris Metro alone many days this summer and has made intercontinental flights solo. I trust them about as much as you can trust two teenaged boys. They make me very proud. But I will still be limiting their freedom on vacations based on my comfort level and my own experiences in the world. That is all any of us can do.

Forgive me if I come off as telling others what to do. Chances are great that nothing bad will come of most senior trips. But don't you all think it helpful to know what others think and what others do, even if we disagree? BTW, I wouldn't send my kids off to Iraq unsupervised either.

padams421

Just because the drinking age is 21, I don't think you should assume that the girls can't drink. You shuold assume that they will drink.

Also, while 18 year olds go to Iraq and go off to college, the purpose of the military and college is not to party 24/7. Military duties and college classes and studying cut into the time for partying. The only purpose of a senior trip is to party 24/7. If you want to reward a child for graduating, there are lots of other gifts you can buy besides a senior trip.

When I was a senior in high school (I was the model, perfect kid- great grades, didn't drink, didn't do drugs, etc.), my parents let me board an airplane and travel 700 miles away by myself to go look at a college. I acted completely responsibly the entire trip.

A few months later, my parents naively let me go on a senior trip with equally responsible friends to Lake Geneva, Wis. when I graduated from a suburban Chicago high school. Of course, my friends and I drank even though I had never had more than a glass of wine before then. We drove after we drank, too. A drunk platonic male friend suggested that we "get together". Thankfully, I had my wits about me and could say no. I had no business being with a group of 18 years olds, 2 hours from my house, unchaperoned and with no other purpose than to "travel to and see" Wis. What were my parents thinking we were going to do?

I don't understand parents who say that they can't stop an 18 year old from going on a senior trip. Where is the 18 year old getting the money for the trip? The money for college? If you child is fully self supporting and you don't claim her as a dependant on your income tax, then I think you can't stop her from going on a senior trip. None of the teenagers I currently know would qualify for being independent.

At 18, my husband did qualify for being independent financially. He traveled extensively arond the world by himself between the ages of 18 and 21. He stayed in hostels. He had a wonderful time.

sydney0723

Depending on where she ends up going, she can do most of the things you listed, and some you didn’t. I went on my senior trip in 03’ to the Bahamas with a group of friends. We did a package through a travel group (I can’t remember which one, but there are tons) and everything went well. There were loads of kids, our age and older, all over the islands. In the Bahamas you can drink and gamble at 18. Other friends of mine went on cruises others went to Disney world. Everyone seemed to have fun, whatever they did, they all got hotel rooms.

joan

This thread is surreal. I am the parent of an 18 yo and a 20 yo. I am the ONLY parent I know who insisted my 18 yo freshman live in the college dorm, as opposed to the new trend of living off campus in a "grownup" apartment. Not only did I have to defend this to my own daughter (who later admitted she was glad!), I had to call and discuss (unconvincingly apparently) with the other freshman moms. So there is reality: most (99%) of parents today will let their kid do anything they want, and they'll even pay for it. Yet the vast majority of posters on this thread wouldn't DREAM of allowing their 18 yo on a trip by themselves (even though they did the same thing themselves and love telling stories about it). Something does not ring true here...I guess it's the anonymity of the internet, because my experience is that most parents are incredibly guilt-ridden and over-permissive, yet almost every parent here is stricter than I...