Clifton

I don't know why I'm finding that planning out this trip is proving to be so confusing. If there are any knowledgeable NY folks out there, who can offer a little patience with dumb questions, I'd appreciate the help. I think the mental block comes from the fact that we aren't planners. We just did a much longer independant trip all over Romania and didn't book anything ahead. It seems though that this trip calls for knowing what we're doing and actually making some decisions ahead of time.

Ok, this is just a four day weekend trip the end of February for our anniversary. I don't really remember anything, as I was very young last time, and my wife has never been. Have visited a dozen web sites, each with lists of stuff as long as my arm. I think info-overload is part of the problem.

We have a flight booked (from Memphis), a modest by positively reviewed hotel in Midtown East reserved and have bought tickets online for The Producers for our first night (discounted). We kind of figure that we'd like to do the crass tourist thing, see the Empire State Bldg, Statue of Liberty (never saw it), key museums, and generally get in everyone's way on the sidewalks.

The Questions:

How do first time travelers get around when budget is a concern? (always saving for that next trip) Are cabs expensive around Manhattan? The subway system seems overwhelming on paper - I can imagine trying to figure this out in a massive crowd.

Is the Circle Line the best way to get a view of the Statue of Liberty or is there a better choice?

Are reservations pretty much required around Midtown if you're ever going to get into eat somewhere? Thinking mostly simple eats, maybe splash out for a special meal once. Definitely somewhere that doesn't have a gift shop on premises. It's awfully hard to make decisions about what one is going to want for dinner a month from now, but it sounds like if you don't reserve, you don't eat. True? We're not terribly trendy people, but would really rather not end up at the Hard Rock cafe somewhere.

Sorry, as I said, it seems like planning a short trip in your own country would be easier than some we've already done, but I think my brain is full.

Gekko

Your transportation alternatives are:

* walk -- the best way to see NYC and also the most affordable

* taxi -- for two people, it's often cost-effective for short trips when traffic is light

* subway -- often the most economical and the fastest way to travel; it's not that confusing -- you'll figure it out and don't hesitate to ask for help

* bus -- economical, but often slow.

You can get a great view of the Statue of Liberty and lower Manhattan on the Staten Island Ferry -- and it's FREE!

Midtown is great for tourist attractions, but lame for dining/nightlife. For better value and atmosphere, go downtown. Take the subway to Union Square, for example; there are several great restaurants in the vicinity.

Finally, please relax. You can't and won't see it all.

rjw_lgb_ca

Gekko is right; although you might want to see EVERYTHING in NYC the first trip, it's just not possible. Relax, see a few highlights, and know that you will be back.

I'm in agreement that Midtown is not the place to try to find the ne plus ultra in really fine dining. Head downtown, absolutely. And my favorite places in Manhattan have always been the ones I've basically fallen into, without preconceptions or plans. The wait at the bar can be a wonderful way to get a taste of the neighborhood scene. I think you should just empty your schedule and go with the flow. It's more of a real adventure that way!

nancy161

Clifton, I agree with the above posts.
It is a lot easier than you think to navigate the subway/bus system, and very convenient to use the metro card. you can find more information on "pay-per-ride" or "unlimited ride" metrocards on the website www.mta.nyc.ny.us/metrocard/mcgtreng.htm
If you like to people watch from the comfort of a bus, I think the M5 or M6 bus is good. all for only $2 a ride!

I second the Staten Island Ferry suggestion. good view of the statue, and it is free.

Speak of the Hard Rock Cafe, not worth it. however, there is a great restaurant cross the street, fabulous. sorry I forgot the name.

Chinatown is a must! and when you are browsing the shops in the crowded narrow streets of Chinatown, be sure to drop by Joe's for their famous "soup dumplings" . (on Pell street). THE BEST!!

bamakelly

Clifton,
I feel your pain! It's hard to plan a trip to a city with so much to do, and not spend a fortune sipping back and forth between all the fun places! I am no expert on the city (I am sure mclaurie and howard and nytraveler will give you better suggestions) but I have planned several 4-day trips there and I have left feeling very happy that I'd thought ahead at least a little bit.

If I were you, I'd plan an event each morning and each afternoon and then leave the rest of the morning/afternoon to just tool around that part of the city. (or go back and relax in your hotel, for that matter!) For example, go to the ESB first thing in the morning, and then walk back up 5th Ave towards Central Park, window-shopping, stopping for lunch, etc. By the time you get to Central Park you can do some of the things there in the afternoon. Then maybe the next day go to a museum in the morning, have lunch, then in the afternoon go see the Statue of Liberty, leaving you the rest of the afternoon to explore that area, pay respects at Ground Zero (walking distance), etc. You'd be downtown then, and could go straight to dinner after that. ...you get the idea. Gives you a little structure to minimize your transportation costs, without having to follow a strict itenerary.

Now, as for specific recommendations:
--Staten Island Ferry offers a primo view of Statue, and is a nice one-hour round trip relaxing ride. Unless you are interested in Ellis Island and the immigration info, this is your best bet, and it's FREE.

--the subway is easy. Cab fees can vary anywhere from $7-17 (ballpark) depending on traffic. They are great for quick or timely trips.

--get dinner reservations. Call well ahead of time for your big night out; more casual places can usually accomodate you the day before or even the day of. Concierge in hotel can help too.

--Get your ESB tickets online ahead of time. Saves a ton of waiting in line, and you are not bound to the exact time and date that you estimate on the ticket (but double check me on that).

--Buy (preferably before you go) a pop-out map of NYC. Here's a link to my favorite, with a very easy subway guide on it. Entire map fits in your pocket. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&n=507846

HAVE FUN!

Clifton

Thanks for all the help. I'm guess I'm not as wound up as the title sounds like, even though there is so much to choose from. You're all right of course. No way could we see everything, even if we had 10 times as long.

The Staten Island Ferry sounds like a great option. Free is good. Maybe we'll give the subway a try. I don't come from a city with much public transport, but we managed with the system in Budapest, Boston and Melbourne ok. Those are nowhere near as complex (concern in those places only for finding the right line, not so much that the next train is going where you hope it's going) but hey, if we get lost enough, maybe we can stay. The metro card sounds very promising.

Also, thanks for the heads up on getting the tickets ahead of time for the ESB.

I'll check out some places for the Union Square area. So many of the places I've seen so far have been very... impressive. Actually though, my favorite kind of places have been the sort of intimate, easy going places like some of the family-run Italian restaurants on the Hill in St. Louis. Someplace with good food (same as fine dining?), not particularly self-conscience. We'll scout around. Not having plans is definitely our style.

EmilyC

Another thought is to purchase the 48 hour ticket on the double decker bus. This will give you unlimited transit to all the sites for 2 full days. If you do the tour on your first full day, you will then have a good overview of what you want to go back and spend more time seeing. The tickets vary and some include pre-payment on the ferries to Ellis/Statue and some include Empire State. You may also avoid some lines by being with the group. If you don't know the city, it's a good investment IMHO.

nytraveler

Relax! Breathe slowly!

NYC is really very simple. Just realize you'r not going to see everything - pick out a few must sees - and then filoll in with whatever looks interesting at the time.

For transport - walk if at all possible. We've had a very mile winter so far - and apparently based on the el nino pattern they expect it to continue. But - you never know. If its too cold to walk take the subway (download the interactive map and study it - it's really easy to use - the subway and the map). Just remember to follow the number of the letter of the train you want - and know if you're going uptown (higher street #s) or downtown (lower st #s or street with names). (In NYC streets run east/west and avenues - the main streets - run north and south).

And if you find you're going the wrong way - just get out and take the next train back - there are so many stations you can;t get really lost.

Buses are also a posibility - but they can be excrutiatingly slow (slower than walking) in rush hour or bad weather.

Staten Is land Ferry is a great idea to view the Statue of Liberty - since you can really see very litttle if you go to Liberty Island anyway. You may want to consider the Ellis Island Immigration museum - to which you take the same boat that goes past the Statue - its incredibly moving and demonstrates the true diversity of NYC and the US.

For lunch - no resies needed. Just pick someplace that looks likely wherever you are. If its full of locals it should be OK. Avoid anything that looks at all like a chain of any kind - most NYC places are so much better.

Agree that for good, esp less expensive food you need to get out of midtown. Downtown is more trendy. The upper west side is more of a middle/upper residential neighborhood - but has tons of great inexpensive ethnic restaurants. If you are spending any time at the Museum of Natural History - or the Met (both open late Fri night) you may want to see on the UWS. Most places do not require resies - since they are really neighborhood places (a lot of people here eat out ALL the time). Just stroll up and down Columbus, Amsterdam or Broadway and pick a place that looks busy - and had a good menu.

If you provide info on preferred cuisine and buget people can make recos for a special dinner.

Hope you have a great time.

HowardR

You've already gotten some good suggestions. Definitely put the Staten Island Ferry at or near the top of your list. It provides a magnificent view of the Statue of Liberty.
Take a look at the 3-day NYC itinerary right here on the Fodor's website. It's a good one and should be a big help in your planning.
As for dinners, definitely make reservations on weekends. If you give us a idea on price and types of food, the recommendations will certainly come flowing.

Leona

I think it's a little short-sighted to say that midtown is lame for dining. There are many very fine restaurants all over NY. Check with your hotel concierge. They always have a lot of varied dining suggestions.

Gekko

Midtown dining has its attractions -- most of which are wonderful "expense account" or "take the parents" restaurants. But in terms of value and atmosphere? No way. In general, midtown restaurants are overpriced . . . or offer seriously mediocre "tourist trap" food . . . or both.

leahinsc

We were just in NYC in early Dec - supposedly one of the busiest times of the year, and the only things we planned were plane reservations, dinner one night, show tickets.
You can find lots of help w/ restaurant recommendation on www.menupages.com as well as www.chowhound.com.
We walked almost everywhere and took the subway which was very easy to figure out. People were VERY friendly and if someone saw us looking at a map we inevitably got at least one person offering to help us. If you are planning to eat out on a Friday or Saturday nite at a nicer, upscale restaurant it would probably be in your best interest to make a reservation so you don't have to wait.
Have a blast!!

vivi

I was NYC neophyte and then all of a sudden I went 4 times in 2004! I always feel like I have attention deficit disorder when I am there!

My main goal is to see as many plays as possible, so every time I go I have theater tix booked for every night of my trip. That leaves the days free til about 7:30PM. I am also a museum-goer, last time I had advanced tix for MOMA so I didnt have to wait.

I have a friend who lives there, we meet for a pricey meal once during each trip, this is the only time I eat in a proper restaurant. (Have been to 21, Palm Court at the Plaza, Union Square Cafe, the Algonquin).

The Staten Island Ferry is a great idea, its free and not as time-consuming as Circle Line.

Mostly I just walk and walk and walk in NYC. In the AM I will eyeball a map and inevitably I will eventually stumble across everything I want to see. I love walking thru all the neighborhoods, it is really almost impossible to get lost there. WHen I am beat I hop on a city bus and ride (great way to sightsee as its warm in the winter and cool in the suumer on board) or duck into a deli.

TWice I have taken the subway to Brooklyn and waclked back towards Manhattan across the Brooklyn Bridge. In December I walked from Brooklyn to my hotel near Times Square, zig zagging and meandering... it took all day but it was a wonderful time (and I came across Law and Order being filmed! )

MFNYC

WHen in the Union Square area, head south. There are dozens of restaurants to choose from, all kinds of food, all kinds of price ranges. The E. Vaillage I think is particularly good for value. Reservations are need for popular places, but there are many to choose from otherwise. Check out menupages.com. You can search my neighborhood, type of food, etc. It has menus posted and also user comments.

mclaurie

Hi Clifton. I think you've gotten answers to all your questions. I would suggest the River Cafe as your one splurge meal, whether for lunch or dinner. It's in Brooklyn with a view back to the Manhattan skyline and the food is terrific. Rivercafe.com

Using the nywatertaxi.com as a hop on/off tour ride is another option to consider, depending on the weather. At minimum, consider taking it over to Brooklyn. Walk a block to Grimaldi's for pizza, and then walk back to Manhattan over the Brooklyn Bridge for some great views.

Cabs are relatively inexpensive.

Happy anniversary!

Litespeed_Chick

Sounds like you have some good answers, here are are few more observations from a tourist who has learned to navigate the big city fairly well over the years.

But the Streetwise Manhattan map. NO other will do. It is laminated and folds up neatly every time. The streets and landmarks are clearly marked, but most importantly, the subway stops are marked and color coded. The subway is pretty easy. The first trip when we used the subway we only took the N&R which shot us from uptown to downtown in an easy straight line.

But at night when you go out, take a cab. My husband always wants to take the subway because getting a cab at the dinner hour can be difficult. However, your wife will be dressed up, probably wearing heels, her hair will be fixed, and she does not want to shlep down the street to the subway and rattle down to dinner. Call your doorman in advance to get you a cab.

Speaking of dinner, here are two places I recommend: Babbo and Bouley. Both terribly romantic, highly regarded by the most serious of foodies, and not all THAT expensive. Babbo is boisterous and fun, not stuffy at all, it's Italian so the food is approachable.

At Bouley, it's a little more formal, but beautiful rooms and beautiful French food. $75 for a tasting menu. Consider what it costs to have apps, salad, entree, and dessert and most midscale restaurants and see that it's not that much more for a very highly regarded chef.

Both of those restaurants have websites where you can scan the menus and the wine lists in advance and feel more comfortable when you arrive.

Another idea is Little Italy. The food will not be as good as many other Italian restaurats in NY, but it's an experience strolling down the jam packed street, and the food is certainly better than what most people can find in their towns.

Bring comfortable shoes. You will walk farther than you ever planned.

Leave plenty of time for wandering around gawking...do the things you want to do most in the morning, then save the negotiable stuff for afternoon. Time flies when you're having fun.

wliwl

I would really urge you to buy a Zagats NY restaurant guide. Try to plan a couple of dinners (using that as a guide) in advance, so that you make reservations. Then you can wing everything else. The Zagats book is well worth the money I think. Even for a 4 day trip.

Patrick

So many good ideas above, I don't have a lot to add except that you should try to time your Staten Island Ferry trip so that you go by while it is light, just before sunset, and by the time you turn around and come by it again it will be twilight and lit -- kind of a two for one deal.

Also, get over the horrible notion that there is anything "crass" about doing the tourist thing including the Empire State and the Statue of Liberty!
You're a tourist, don't miss the best New York has to offer, because you're embarrassed or ashamed of that fact.

TC

Clifton: Relax -- you're going to have so much fun. Get a copy of the guidebook, ACCESS New York. It makes everything so easy. The book is laid out by geographic areas rather than by subjects. So if you are in Midtown or SoHo you simply find your location on the section map and read what is surrounding you - street by street. There are corresponding numbers on the map. Its wonderful. We have found so many wonderful little local restaurants using this book becaue we were hungry, in the neighborhood and picked the best sounding place that was nearby. The book lists food, shopping, hotels, and places of interest -- all color coded. This is my very favorite NY guidebook.

And like all the others -- don't worry about the subway system. It really is easy to figure out. Get the unlimited ride pass. Worse case -- you get on the wrong line (we've done this many times) you just get off at the next station and get on the right line. No big deal. It happens to everyone. Don't hesitate to ask. NYers are really helpful.

Here's one of my favorite little romantic restaurants. In a great location in SoHo.

www.provence-soho.com/frameset.html

Happy Anniversary!

Clifton

Thank you all so much for the suggestions and comments. There are quite a lot of really great ideas and resources here. The River Cafe looks like a great night out, but then so do the others. I'm sure we'd do well with any of the choices, really. The Provence looks especially interesting, I thought.

As to the budget question, well... we aren't quite sure, we're somewhat flexible, but it would be nice to work in some hearty inexpensive lunches on a cold day for under $20-$25 per, so that we could devote a little more to dinner. Cuisine? Initially, I was thinking what I associated with NY, and Italian came to mind (well, right after sidewalk hot dogs). But since really good Italian is so available back in my hometown (there's a big authentic Italian neighborhood), it makes sense to try something that isn't normally available.

I think we'll likely spend at least a meal or two wandering around, seeking out ethnic spots that we don't have at home. Anyone heard of Mandoo Bar? A Korean dumpling place that caught our eye. There was a tapas place I saw too somewhere in Chelsea that looked interesting called Tia Pol. Spanish and Korean are not really found where we are, so it makes sense to give things like this a try, we thought.

Patrick, really good point about the timing on the ferry. I'll check sunrisesunset.con to work that out. Thanks very much for that. As for the tourist thing - well, that was actually tongue in cheek. Self-effacing midwestern humor. In my special world, I actually believe I'm funny. Naw, I always say I'm a tourist. Well... I am!