Chapter 11

I see on the board that a lot of people are thinking of cancelling tours and flights for which they have paid. In some cases, the companies are issuing credits, sometimes good for a year or more.

In deciding whether to cancel, consider this. These airlines and travel companies have suffered huge losses as a result of this tragedy. The airlines are openly discussing bankruptcy, and their stocks have tanked. If they declare bankruptcy, you will probably never see your money.

Factor this into your decision of whether to cancel a trip due to your fears, as you may lose out entirely.

Also, if you are planning on making reservations or buying tickets, make sure you use a credit card so you can stop payment if the company folds before you receive the service.

L

Chapter 11, get REAL. Check your newspaper. Like Chrysler, the largest carriers will be bailed out through a temporary tax and/or loan, or possibly a "gift" in the interest of airline transportation. Mineta is already meeting with industry exces about this issue. Stop with the gloom and doom. We keep Amtrak in business with annual payments of federal dollars. We give operational and construction subsidies, mortgage guarantees, plus coastwise protected cargoes to non-competitive US flag ships. We're going to stand by and allow airlines to belly up??? Take a breath. Ciao

Anne

Chapter 11 I think that you do have a good point. So far I believe 1 airline has gone bankrupt as a result of tuesday-Midway wasn't it. Why can't anyone make a post on this forum without getting personally slammed for their opinion?

Doug Weller

People get slammed for posting false information and, in this case, for spreading unnecessary doom and gloom and in effect helping the terrorists.

Midway filed for Chapter 11 over a month ago. You should check your facts first. Nothing to do with the terrible events of last week.

Doug

L

Well, Anne, why do you believe Chapt. 11 has been slammed? Do you wish to hold up Midway as an example of why his claims are reasonable ... Midway? Is this the same carrier that folded its tent in Raleigh-Durham 2-3 weeks ago? Do you really believe the US is going to permit its airline industry to just disappear? Am I being too optimistic perchance? I think not. Ciao

Chapter 11

Well, if I were an airline executive, I'd want some relief from all of the contracts I have for things I no longer need. Obligations to buy or lease planes I no longer require. Union contracts that now look overly burdensome. Minimum purchase obligations for fuel and other supplies. These obligations are the things that airlines will have trouble funding due to the steep drop-off in cash receipts, and bankruptcy laws are tailor-made for this sort of relief.

So I would declare bankruptcy, THEN obtain my aid package, which I would use to fund operations going forward.

I'm not saying it will definitely happen that way, but people should understand the risks of cancelling as well as the risk of taking a credit instead of cash back.

But if you're so sure the airlines won't go bankrupt, you should buy loads of their stock immediately. You could make a killing!

Anne

Spreading unnecessary doom and gloom, well thats everywhere from the newspapers to the T.V. As far as midway airlines I may have been misinformed I guess that I cant belive everything I hear on the T.V. news so shoot me.

Gregory Robb

I have seen on the CNN Travel web site that while Midway filed for Chapter 11 several weeks ago , it ceased operations on the 12th September. The refund arrangements on

www.midwayair.com

Chapter 11

My understanding is also that Midway filed before the attacks. After the attacks, they decided not to attempt a reorganization and decided to fold the tent instead.

Doesn't impact anything I've said.

L

You know, Federal policy is a lot more complicated than you might think ... thus, why would the government accept bankruptcies, then bail them out? This is not a dollars and cents situation. When public policy is developed, a lot of facets are considered. Such as impact on markets, people's views and behaviors, and many other long-term issues. The impact on the USA as a whole. I doubt you'll see this Administration allowing an airline to belly up right now. Watch Congress rush through an aid package and Bush sign it. The public will support it. Perhaps we ought to be thinking in the neighborhood of loan guarantees, tax add-ons to your tickets, and some direct payments from Treasury. In return, airlines will stay in operation, unions will behave and suppliers will not gouge. And hopefully John Q. Public will get off its behind and stop trembling, and get back to travelling. People have to understand the nature of risk ... it's always out there. Time to travel again and get our economic engine in gear. Ciao

Chapter 11

Maybe, L. Maybe.

Put your money where your mouth is and load up on airline stocks, then.

BTW, I heard that when the stock market opened, there were a ton of sell orders on airline stocks, but no buy orders for a while. Those sellers need you, L!

Most people don't know much about how bankruptcy works and are shocked when a bankrupt company suddenly doesn't honor its obligation. I thought I'd give a little heads up. People can make up their own minds.

L

My views are not consistent with financial suicide, but thanks anyway. Anyway, I prefer to support the airlines in their preferred fashion ... namely through the solemn and holy practice of the ticket purchase. Consequently, I'm going to make all my trips as scheduled ... and that will pump at least five grand their way by year's end. I have tickets I'm going to keep ... and wowwee, I plan to buy some more in the near future. So, I hope to see all of you onboard, and we'll go flying. That's one of the real turn-ons of the USA, don't you think. Ready to fly when you are, as they say. Ciao

Arabella

Anne, you get slammed because you're an idiot. I just read your posts about NYC and can't believe anyone could be so heartless. Do you THINK before you type?

Sal

I, for one, am not going to fly during a time that my safety cannot be reasonably guaranteed, all in the name of saving an industry that has long lost touch with its customers. If those in charge had been more accountable for security, we might not be having this discussion. This tragedy should be a wake up call; sadly, the cost is too high to comprehend.

Chapter 11

One more thing, L. My suggestion about bankruptcy goes for tour operators (not just airlines), who are suffering a lot of cancellations also. I hardly think tour operators are going to receive a government bailout, so people should think a bit about how they want to handle their dealings with tour companies.

x

I'm sorry, I've got to side with Anne. Doug implies that by not knowing when Midway went bankrupt Anne is spreading false information which is helping the terrorists and that's absurd.

Who the hell cares exactly when Midway applied for Chapter 11? We all understand that Chapter 11 does not necessarily mean "out of business", right? The point is they ceased operations on September 12 "in order to preserve the value available for Midway's interest holders and with the regognition that following the recent terrorist attacks demand for air transportation is expected to decline sharply." That sounds like a direct result of September 11 to me.

I didn't make that up; that's right off their website. Look it up.

Now of course Delta, Continental and American aren't Midway, and there should be little to worry about in their regard. The smaller, start-up carriers are another story.

Look, lots of things are going to be different around the country in the coming years and we all need to support our government and each other, and not sit around playing armchair quarterback and oneupsmanship.

Anne

Arabella you obviously did not read all of my posts, or mabye you are the one that is heartless.In case you hadn't noticed I am no longer in that thread.You are like a dog with a bone.Looks like Jackie brought out the beast in everyone.