EMERGENCY! Kea Lani or Four Seasons?
Jun 21st, 2002, 05:46 AM
#21
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Christine:
Both hotels have good beachfront locations. However, the FS fronts Wailea beach, which is a longer and nicer beach than Polo beach, which is in front of the Kea Lani. However, Wailea beach is shared with the Grand Wailea, so it is more crowded.
Jay and Tom, calm down. All the Wailea hotels are first rate (including the Outrigger). You both have good points. I am glad that someone else thought it was odd to get charged for an "ocean view room" that was only a partial view. On the other hand, the FS Wailea is not expensive RELATIVE to other well-known beach resorts. For example, it is cheaper than Caneel Bay on St. John, where you don't have room service and the food is only mediocre. In my view, where the FS really stands out is service. Anything you want, and it's handled cheerfully. When I expressed bewilderment over the beach cabana situation over Easter break, they offered to pick out one for me and told me that the situation would improve soon because many families were checking out (which turned out to be true).
Both hotels have good beachfront locations. However, the FS fronts Wailea beach, which is a longer and nicer beach than Polo beach, which is in front of the Kea Lani. However, Wailea beach is shared with the Grand Wailea, so it is more crowded.
Jay and Tom, calm down. All the Wailea hotels are first rate (including the Outrigger). You both have good points. I am glad that someone else thought it was odd to get charged for an "ocean view room" that was only a partial view. On the other hand, the FS Wailea is not expensive RELATIVE to other well-known beach resorts. For example, it is cheaper than Caneel Bay on St. John, where you don't have room service and the food is only mediocre. In my view, where the FS really stands out is service. Anything you want, and it's handled cheerfully. When I expressed bewilderment over the beach cabana situation over Easter break, they offered to pick out one for me and told me that the situation would improve soon because many families were checking out (which turned out to be true).
Jun 21st, 2002, 06:05 AM
#22
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Thank you, larry.
My point exactly.
Sure the FS Maui is not cheap.
But "expensive" and "cheap" are relative terms.
Expensive compared to what? Red Roof Inn in Detroit?
Well, it seems to me that the discussion here is about high quality tropical type vacation resorts. And in that arena, the FS Maui is not overpriced at all. As I said, as larry said, check the Caribbean or Tahitian rate schedules.
You'll find that the FS Maui holds up quite nicely price wise.
And again, if you're used to spending $50 a night for a Fairfield Inn, the FS seems highly overpriced. But if you're used to staying at nice resorts worldwide, it's not.
All depends on which direction you're approaching this from.
I have no interest in, or need to, impress you, tom. Don't take yourself quite so seriously. My point is simply as stated. If you compare FS Maui to all resorts in its category, it's very fairly priced.
You were implying it was overpriced. I believe that's untrue.
If you compare apples to apples I believe you're wrong.
My point exactly.
Sure the FS Maui is not cheap.
But "expensive" and "cheap" are relative terms.
Expensive compared to what? Red Roof Inn in Detroit?
Well, it seems to me that the discussion here is about high quality tropical type vacation resorts. And in that arena, the FS Maui is not overpriced at all. As I said, as larry said, check the Caribbean or Tahitian rate schedules.
You'll find that the FS Maui holds up quite nicely price wise.
And again, if you're used to spending $50 a night for a Fairfield Inn, the FS seems highly overpriced. But if you're used to staying at nice resorts worldwide, it's not.
All depends on which direction you're approaching this from.
I have no interest in, or need to, impress you, tom. Don't take yourself quite so seriously. My point is simply as stated. If you compare FS Maui to all resorts in its category, it's very fairly priced.
You were implying it was overpriced. I believe that's untrue.
If you compare apples to apples I believe you're wrong.
Jun 21st, 2002, 09:06 AM
#23
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Jay,
I completely agree with what you are saying. Everything can be relative to something and in this case we're talking about luxury resorts. The 4S is a wonderful place and could be a lot more expensive (and would be if not for the competition in the area.) Take advantage of the situation IF you're looking for a luxury place. With the Beauty and service of the resort, you'll have a hard time going wrong.
I completely agree with what you are saying. Everything can be relative to something and in this case we're talking about luxury resorts. The 4S is a wonderful place and could be a lot more expensive (and would be if not for the competition in the area.) Take advantage of the situation IF you're looking for a luxury place. With the Beauty and service of the resort, you'll have a hard time going wrong.
Jun 21st, 2002, 09:11 AM
#24
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They're both excellent hotels. I've been to Maui and Kauai several times. I've always stayed at the FS and once in a while walked and dined at Kei Lani.
I'll be there next Thursday again. Their service in excellent and they always treat you like a celebrity. The concierge has been working with me on my 4th honeymoon itinerary. They took care of everything for me. They'll even bring my rental car at the front entrance the next morning. We were always upgraded and we get a lot of extra special like menus to all restaurants and map will be handed to you on you way out. You don't need a big room if there's only the two of you. We're never in our room during the day anyway. We were absolutely pampered from start to finish. I would also recommend Princeville hotel ocean view room in Kuaui - its very romantic. FS is perfect for honeymooners and anniversaries. There will be more children in Kei Lani and Grand Wailea bec. of their pool facilities. Call FS and negotiate for at least a partial view ocean room with the 5th night free promo. They'll accommodate you if you tell them your dilemma. Hope this works for you! Enjoy. Also Feast of Lele is the best luau.
I'll be there next Thursday again. Their service in excellent and they always treat you like a celebrity. The concierge has been working with me on my 4th honeymoon itinerary. They took care of everything for me. They'll even bring my rental car at the front entrance the next morning. We were always upgraded and we get a lot of extra special like menus to all restaurants and map will be handed to you on you way out. You don't need a big room if there's only the two of you. We're never in our room during the day anyway. We were absolutely pampered from start to finish. I would also recommend Princeville hotel ocean view room in Kuaui - its very romantic. FS is perfect for honeymooners and anniversaries. There will be more children in Kei Lani and Grand Wailea bec. of their pool facilities. Call FS and negotiate for at least a partial view ocean room with the 5th night free promo. They'll accommodate you if you tell them your dilemma. Hope this works for you! Enjoy. Also Feast of Lele is the best luau.
Jun 21st, 2002, 02:59 PM
#25
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Sorry but I have to disagree with Jay. My spouse and I spend around 25k per year on travel. With 10 wks off there's a lot of time to vacation when you're w/o kids. The highest we've ever spent on hotel rooms is 450/nt - going to 4seas. in a few weeks. I think going over 500/nt. is just throwing money away and will not translate into better service/all that nicer of a room. When paying several hundred per night I expect good service and if I don't get it I stay at another hotel the next time. If Tom's rate said 600 for a full ocean that's what he should get ; )
Jun 21st, 2002, 10:19 PM
#26
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So what's your point 2cents?
Are you saying 4Seasons does NOT provide good service?
Are you saying that above $450/nt it's impossible to provide good enough service to justify the rate?
BTW, try finding a luxury room (even one with mediocre service) in Bora Bora for less than $550/nt.
In some areas of the world you either pay up, stay at a mediocre place, or don't go.
Are you saying 4Seasons does NOT provide good service?
Are you saying that above $450/nt it's impossible to provide good enough service to justify the rate?
BTW, try finding a luxury room (even one with mediocre service) in Bora Bora for less than $550/nt.
In some areas of the world you either pay up, stay at a mediocre place, or don't go.
Jun 21st, 2002, 10:27 PM
#27
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I'm saying if Jay paid $600 for an "ocean front" room & didn't get it than that is bad service. The front desk should have fixed the problem innediately. Coincidentally, I have stayed in an overwater bungalow already in Bora Bora I won on an auction at approx. $450/nt which I won by bidding on Luxurylink. I go to many of the best hotels and never, ever pay rack rate.
Jun 21st, 2002, 10:38 PM
#28
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Sorry, and to answer your third ?. I have stayed in suites before 5 star when I was not paying and didn't ever find the experience to be out of the ordinary. The rooms are bigger, you get a living room, bowls of fruit, etc, but nothing can justify the price. I shop vacations as a hobby and have an excellent TA that always lets me in on good bargains.
Jun 21st, 2002, 11:46 PM
#29
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Jay, do you REALLY think that someone who pays $50 a night (or whatever) at a Fairfield Inn is really going to stay at the Four Seasons Maui, even in the least expensive garden view rooms? NO, I don't think so!! And I really don't think you'll find many people "crossing over" from a Holiday Inn either, at least not MOST of them. It just doesn't happen! I think, generally, we're talking here about people like you, myself, and others who ARE used to staying in 5-star hotels/resorts. I mean, if you really want to get into the "comparison game," I once had a summer rate of only $215 a night for an ocean front room at the Ritz-Carlton on St. Thomas and the property was, in my opinion, more beautiful than the 4S Maui! I also once paid a summer rate of $350 a night for an ocean front room at Cap Juluca on Anguilla. So I just might ask you the same question: Where in Hawaii can you find ocean front accomodations for those rates at any of Hswaii's 5-star hotels at any time of the year? There aren't any! I had found truly great VALUE at those two resorts and felt the prices were very fair and reasonable! But then again, I have to honestly admit that I would NOT return to either St. Thomas or Anguilla because both islands simply do not compare to Hawaii by a LONG shot!! However, I AM expecting a much better experience at the new Ritz on Grand Cayman when it finally opens!
Jun 22nd, 2002, 08:33 AM
#30
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Ahhhh, now we're reaching common ground, tom.
I completely agree with you about your examples, Ritz STT and CJ Anguilla.
Those are great resorts IMO. (I haven't been to the RC STT but have been to STT. CJ is a favorite of mine).
BUT: your last point was that some Caribbean resorts offer great rooms and settings at a fair price, why not the FS Maui?
Well first off, the Caribbean has a very well defined low season (hurricane season June-October/November), when tourism drops off quite a bit. In order to fill rooms most resorts have to entice travellers with lower rates. And STT is not an island which tends not to attract the most discriminating of travellers in the first place, much like Jamaica, St. Martin, Puert Rico. (Not that they are devoid of discriminating travellers, it's just harder to attract them there versus, say, Anguilla or the BVI's).
So Ritz Carlton has to try to be competitive at the STT property, and I will wager that it is one of their less profitable hotels.
Cap Juluca offers very fair summer rates versus other resorts in its class in other parts of the world. But not so in winter.
So what about the FS Maui?
Well, first off, it has no off season when they need to make deals.
Second, the place is almost always booked to capacity whether they are offering package deals or not.
Again, I believe the main reason they don't charge MORE is that there are so many nice resorts in the vicinity that they must remain at least somewhat competitive to stay at capacity.
So Maui and the Caribbean are very different environments as far as variability of room rates, and in terms of number of travellers willing to spend big $$ at all times of the year.
If your main gripe is that you can't find seasonal deals at FS Maui, I also agree with you there. It's annoying that there is no low season at that hotel. BUT, I still feel very strongly that they offer an excellent return on the $$ invested to stay there RELATIVE to other great resorts worldwide.
As for my2cents, I would agree that with careful planning, prep and a little luck, you can often find better rates at great places. And good TA's can certainly help on occasion.
But if you have a specific week or two set aside for a vacation, and then try to fit the destination to your dates, you limit your ability to shop. I think that's the situation most people are in.
I like a deal as much as anyone, but I work hard, make a great income and have 9 weeks of vacation. So if I want to go someplace during high season and the rates are exorbitant, sometimes I just go anyway. More often, I try to find some type of deal. (I was pricing the LuxuryLink Bora Bora deals a couple months ago as well).
And I agree that when you ARE paying top dollar, you should expect the best. One thing I have always found to be true though, is that the best resorts ALWAYS provide great service in the end. Do they ever screw up? Yes. Is my promised room sometimes unavailable? Yes. But they always make it right in the end. Upgrades, free dinner, a couple free nights next stay have all been offered as apologies in the past. And I consider the balance sheet even at that point.
But for the timid or inexperienced traveller who doesn't know how to get compensated when shortchanged, not all high end hotels bend over backwards to make the first peace offering, so they may leave getting nothing, feeling sold out. No question there.
I completely agree with you about your examples, Ritz STT and CJ Anguilla.
Those are great resorts IMO. (I haven't been to the RC STT but have been to STT. CJ is a favorite of mine).
BUT: your last point was that some Caribbean resorts offer great rooms and settings at a fair price, why not the FS Maui?
Well first off, the Caribbean has a very well defined low season (hurricane season June-October/November), when tourism drops off quite a bit. In order to fill rooms most resorts have to entice travellers with lower rates. And STT is not an island which tends not to attract the most discriminating of travellers in the first place, much like Jamaica, St. Martin, Puert Rico. (Not that they are devoid of discriminating travellers, it's just harder to attract them there versus, say, Anguilla or the BVI's).
So Ritz Carlton has to try to be competitive at the STT property, and I will wager that it is one of their less profitable hotels.
Cap Juluca offers very fair summer rates versus other resorts in its class in other parts of the world. But not so in winter.
So what about the FS Maui?
Well, first off, it has no off season when they need to make deals.
Second, the place is almost always booked to capacity whether they are offering package deals or not.
Again, I believe the main reason they don't charge MORE is that there are so many nice resorts in the vicinity that they must remain at least somewhat competitive to stay at capacity.
So Maui and the Caribbean are very different environments as far as variability of room rates, and in terms of number of travellers willing to spend big $$ at all times of the year.
If your main gripe is that you can't find seasonal deals at FS Maui, I also agree with you there. It's annoying that there is no low season at that hotel. BUT, I still feel very strongly that they offer an excellent return on the $$ invested to stay there RELATIVE to other great resorts worldwide.
As for my2cents, I would agree that with careful planning, prep and a little luck, you can often find better rates at great places. And good TA's can certainly help on occasion.
But if you have a specific week or two set aside for a vacation, and then try to fit the destination to your dates, you limit your ability to shop. I think that's the situation most people are in.
I like a deal as much as anyone, but I work hard, make a great income and have 9 weeks of vacation. So if I want to go someplace during high season and the rates are exorbitant, sometimes I just go anyway. More often, I try to find some type of deal. (I was pricing the LuxuryLink Bora Bora deals a couple months ago as well).
And I agree that when you ARE paying top dollar, you should expect the best. One thing I have always found to be true though, is that the best resorts ALWAYS provide great service in the end. Do they ever screw up? Yes. Is my promised room sometimes unavailable? Yes. But they always make it right in the end. Upgrades, free dinner, a couple free nights next stay have all been offered as apologies in the past. And I consider the balance sheet even at that point.
But for the timid or inexperienced traveller who doesn't know how to get compensated when shortchanged, not all high end hotels bend over backwards to make the first peace offering, so they may leave getting nothing, feeling sold out. No question there.
Jun 22nd, 2002, 09:54 PM
#32
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As some other people said, the Four Seasons Maui was a terrific hotel. When I go back for one of my anniversary trips I would not even consider another place.I agree with others that for kids/family, etc the Kea Lani looked like a great place. I am sure you would have a great time there should you decide to stay ( I know friends who raved)- and besides Maui is just a terrific island. I stayed at the Four Seasons for a portion of my honeymoon a couple of years ago and I could not say enough about the stay. We did not even have an ocean front room, but some of the ocean front balconies actually face one another. They are still fairly private, but not as private as the mountain view balcony we had, which was very tranquil and had a terrific view. The pool is very nice- the bar/food service is very good -as well as the service at the beach, which was great as well. There is a walk way by the beach connecting all the hotels on Wailea- so you can easily eat dinner/visit any of the other hotels. As another person said, I heard some of the restaurants at Kea Lani are good as well. If you stay at Four Seasons, be sure to order breakfast in the room one day- they even keep the bread warm and bring up a toaster. I did not find anyone stuffy; if you are on an anniversary trip you will most likely be focused on your husband anyway. I think most people tend to splurge on trips to Hawaii- so that people who normally would not stay at The Four Seasons (like myself) do so for that occasion. Either way, enjoy Maui and spend some time on land exploring the island. Skip the luau on Wailea Beach at the Outrigger. If you want to go to one, choose the one in Old Lahaina. I have heard it's more traditional, with a better show and the grounds are very nice ( I have seen pictures from friends).
Enjoy!
Enjoy!
Jun 24th, 2002, 06:26 AM
#33
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Tom:
Quite throwing around the term "5-star" when referring to maui's hotels. Mobile gives out the "star" rating. They do not rate Maui's hotels or resorts. AAA does, and they gave the four seasons maui a 5 diamond rating, but in general Mobile is more picky compared to AAA who gives out the 5 diamond rating like no bodies business.
Quite throwing around the term "5-star" when referring to maui's hotels. Mobile gives out the "star" rating. They do not rate Maui's hotels or resorts. AAA does, and they gave the four seasons maui a 5 diamond rating, but in general Mobile is more picky compared to AAA who gives out the 5 diamond rating like no bodies business.
