Tom: the massive homeless problem in SF did start with Reagan. I wasn't trying to say that SF was some sort of paradise with absolutely NO homeless. UC Hastings is "at the other end" of the Tenderloin, which was a problem area even before Reagan. Nevertheless, there's a direct link between the nonfunding of community care for the mentally ill and the increase in the numbers of the homeless. SF's homeless problems have also been aggravated by the increase in aids and in the increase of single-parent-mother families - aside from the good weather which invites the homeless here because it's easier to sleep in the streets when there's no snow nor ice to deal with.

I've been to many large cities around the world and, God willing, will visit a few more before my arthritis takes over completely. San Francisco is my favorite city, problems and all. No big city is without its problems and it's fine with me that some visitors see the problems more than they see the charm of the city. To each his/her own.

Honestly, Tom, I don't understand why you should have a problem with Handsome Gavin Newsom. At least, everyone knows he's a fourth generation San Franciscan, so there's no fighting over where he was born.

(Sorry, SAB, couldn't resist!)

Maybe we should reciprocate the OP by pointing out the problems in Los Angeles.

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There is no question.

easytraveler: Well before I went to law school - I was familiar with the Tenderloin - east, west, south, north, whichever part you want to highlight. And you do know how it got it's name, right?

Anyhow - I not only commuted through the tenderloin - on the bus system - from Pacific Heights and the Marina - to downtown - but there were some good deals at established restaurants there - such as Original Joes, who made a great frittata type dish - called Joe's Special. http://www.originaljoes.com/ and http://www.sfgate.com/neighborhoods/sf/tenderloin/

And I repeat - before anything former President Reagan did - there were plenty of "homeless" in SF, which included street types such as alcoholics, addicts, people standing in line for their methadone doses, drug and alcohol offenders falling out of other programs such as Delancey Street, etc etc.

What happened is the well described "laizzez faire" - or benign enforcement - attitude adopted by the politicians - encouraged the "homeless" to spread to other parts of SF - after more of them had gravitated there - due to the open arms policies shown by cities such as SF - and also to a lesser degree - here in downtown San Diego.

And yes, I would agree - Gavin Newsome is a poster boy for what is wrong with today's SF.

sf7307: I thought you said you were oblivious to the homeless problem?

"I'm sure I overlook the homeless problem because I live here (I've been told by people on this forum that I'm oblivious to it). "

Rosalyn Carter never got the credit she deserved for making massive headway in the care for mental illnesses in our country.Reagan made a big mess of it.

Thats not to say that all of the homeless are ill. But sick people shouldn't be dropped on a street corner.

OMG: Rosalyn Carter - haven't heard her name in public in a long time. She and the peanut were a pair to draw to.

The hotel suggestion might have gotten lost, so I'll mention that I also always stay at Cow Hollow. It's not "fancy" or pretentious--but it's not expensive, either. The rooms and decor are older--but they're fine for me--and I like the free parking. I love the area and love being able to walk to the beach and watch the tons of people playing with their dogs with the bridge as a stunning backdrop. It's like the Westminster Dog Show at the beach ;-)

I'm not a foodie, although I always enjoy the Asian and other ethnic foods in SF. (There's a great Italian deli a couple of blocks from the hotel--but can't remember the name. Also, some good diner-type places for fantastic breakfasts.) My understanding is that it is equally impossible to get prime reservations at the top NYC restaurants unless they are made FAR in advance.

I have never had an issue with homeless or vagrants in SF--and have never felt the least bit unsafe in the Cow Hollow area. I don't have any reason to go to the Union Square area--but I'm sorry to learn it's become so unpleasant.

I certainly hope this post won't scare anyone away from one of my favorite cities in the world. Now you've got me thinking about my upcoming trip this fall. Can't wait!!!

My suggestion: don't even think of staying away from San Francisco; just don't stay at Union Square. Sausalito's a great alternative.

Amen Songdoc: Love the Cow Hollow and adjacetn Union St. area.

You know why they called it Cow Hollow don't you? Years ago - the dairy cows were kept in the area between the Marina and Pacific Heights.

It's a great place to stroll, dine, pop in a winebar, check out a chocolate shop, cheese shops, etc - and here is some more info: http://www.unionstreetshop.com/ and http://www.unionstreetsf.com/ and http://www.unionstreet.com/

and here is a map if it cuts and pastes: http://tinyurl.com/6txesna

BTW - we lived for years on the same block as the Octagon House. Loved it - as it had a cute little park where you could play frisbee, sunbathe, yada yada.

http://www.unionstreetsf.com/Pages/h...%20hollow.html

Uno mas: By "the beach" - I assume you mean the Marina Green. Always loved the Marina Green - and used to jog by it daily - out to Ft. Point - and people were always out - flying kites, playing touch football/frisbee, running their dogs, taking in the sun - all kinds of good outdoor stuff.

And the "little" Marina green was my favorite. Sometimes for lunch - would pick up a proscuitto sandwich at a little deli on Chestnut St (back then - it cost no more than a regular ham and cheese) - and go to the "little" Marina Green - and sit on a bench - and look across the bay at Sausalito, Alcatraz, and sometimes - watch windsurfers in the bay - and there were usually ships sailing all about.

>>

Probably Molinari's. Or maybe Lucca.

Tom, I will reword my statement - I am frankly mostly oblivious to the homeless people on the streets of San Francisco (not that I am oblivious to the existence of the "homeless problem").

and:

"State mental hospitals were taken away by Governor Reagan in the seventies, and federal mental health programs were later taken away by President Reagan in the eighties. Funding was cut for federal institutions which resulted on closures throughout the country. Homelessness in California grew throughout the seventies, a direct result of Reagan closure of mental institutions. I still see the results of that here in California, mentally ill people out on the streets with nowhere to go and noone who cares."

I think the Argonaut is a nice hotel....

I am still waiting to hear about the other part of your trip up and/or down the coast. This is YOUR thread. I'd love to hear about Carmel, Santa Barbara and Napa. Please continue.

Tom: please, one more time - I've never claimed that SF didn't have its share of large city, urban problems.

And I don't mind traipsing down memory lane with you, but before we do that, you should know that a branch of my family still lives in San Francisco, right in the heart of the Tenderloin, right in the same house that they've been in for generations and I'll bet I have more relatives buried upright in Colma than you have. I also have a whole lot of relatives buried horizontally in Hawaii and another whole lot of relatives - also buried horizontally - in the Central Valley - but we digress.

I not only commuted through the tenderloin... When was that? The First Ice Age or the Second?

Seriously, Tom, you should realize that SF, like the rest of the world, has undergone some major changes since the 1970s.

We all have different memories and different impressions of any particular place, but some aspects are historical fact. IMHO, people in government should carefully consider the aftermath of their actions - the homeless that littered the streets of San Francisco after the federal funding was stopped - that was shocking, because we had not seen so many bodies lying in the streets of this beautiful city before.

I am not saying that poverty did not exist before in SF. Have you ever been to the Western Addition? Ever seen the housing projects out there? (I'll give you a hint: they're pre-Reagan)

http://www.friendlyneighborhoodguide...stern-Addition

I gotta go: but "Original Joe's"? Never like it. My sister used to drag me over there from time to time and I'd suffer through their "food". Loved the Astro Burgers in LA, tho.

One last thing: for those who keep recommending those motels along Lombard Street with their free parking - you should also mention that Lombard Street is also Highway 101, very busy and VERY NOISY. There's a reason why the parking is free. Visitors are entitled to get all the facts to help them make a decision suitable for their situation.

I'm a bit skeptical that one has visited San Francisco every year (or every decade for that matter) when one's information/advice about the Bay area is so out of date.

tileaftilly has it right. I'd also like to hear about the rest of the trip.

Others: Please continue your discussion about the social ills of S.F. in the Lounge. It's a good discussion but it doesn't belong here.

We were in San Francisco last year for the third time and the homeless population seemed much more abundant than on our previous visits.

We stayed at the Handlery Hotel in Union Square which abuts the tenderloin area if you walk one block away. Upon check-in, the front desk gave us a map and said when you exit the hotel, walk right don't go left. They even put a big red X by the area to avoid.

Upon leaving the hotel to get to the airport we drove left and we saw not one but two shelters within a two block radius lined around each corner fully with homeless people waiting to get a meal. Years ago we had stayed at the Handlery and it was perfectly fine. This time we did not enjoy San Francisco as much either. It was depressing to see.

Didn't see Bowspirits post. Yes, please continue about the rest of your trip so we can hear the good parts too.

We loved Yountville in the Napa region and the Alexander Valley--it was like a world away from the city of San Francisco yet so close.

We stayed at the Orchard Garden Inn about a year ago and really liked it. It's right by the Chinatown entrance and very convenient. You wouldn't want a car though....ditching it and doing a day rental would be the way to go.