wildblueyonder

Hi all

I’ve promised something which I’m not sure I can deliver on. My hub and I have taken our eldest (still living at home) son with us four times on road trips to the USA (from the UK). Our last one (last month!) wasn’t really a road trip, but to Hawaii. But, on our other trips, we have seen a good deal of the USA and love, in particular, the western states.

My problem is that I’ve gone and promised my other son and his wife that I will take them to the USA next year. One problem is that I don’t know if I’ll have the money – but I will try to pay for their flights, at least – although that will mean that we will not be able to pay much for accommodation.

But I’m going off-topic. I don’t know WHERE to go! I want to show them what we love about America – the national parks, the diners, the supermarkets, quaint B&Bs etc. But our youngest son and dil love laying on the beach and eating. We have never been to Florida, but we really don’t fancy going there. They also love shopping – so I guess they might like the supermarkets! Seriously, I think they would probably love Vegas, but I HATE it. I asked where they might like to go and son said ‘Universal Studios’, which is somewhere we’ve managed to avoid in the past!

So I am looking at the maps and thinking along the lines of San Fran-San Fran – taking in Yosemite and then 4-5 nights in a rental house (with pool) in Vegas (so that I can just swim, while they pace the Strip) and then to LA for a couple nights before driving back up to San Fran, via Big Sur (not been there before, or to Napa Valley). But I would only be able to afford about 2 weeks maximum and somehow I would have to fit Grand Canyon in there somewhere. And I would so love to show them the Utah parks and the cacti in Arizona … and on and on. But then there is another hitch. Neither son or dil have ever driven ‘on the other side of the road’ before and I don’t think they are keen to. Grrh.

Any ideas folks? I want (a) to give them a good time, but (b) enjoy it myself!

Thanks!

Anonymous

You can probably show them a wonderful time without going to Vegas. Surely there are enough activities and places you all can enjoy.

wildblueyonder

HI anonymous - I so agree. Trouble is dil's eyes lit up when I mentioned Vegas!! I wouldn't actually mind staying there, as long as it was in a house in the suburbs! The rentals are very reasonable and would work out cheaper for us as a family of 5, than hotel rooms. Plus, it is a 'gateway' to the parks - and one of the places hub and I haven't been, is Death Valley and we'd really like to.
It won't be until September 2010, btw - I'm starting looking early in case we need to book somewhere in the national parks!

HKP

Try San Diego - a little of everything there, including the beach. Zoo, Gaslamp area, old California-type communities, nice waterfront, etc.

And I wouldn't rule out Florida - there's much more there than DisneyWorld/theme parks and Miami Beach. You might find you really enjoy some of the communities both on the Gulf Coast (Sarasota, e.g.) and inland in "horse country" - areas of "old Florida" that people don't normally think of. You might be surprised. And Sept. is a very nice time - esp. later in the month - to do that.

Songdoc

I like your thoughts. Areas around SF are gorgeous (i.e., Muir Woods & Muir Beach) and of course, so is the city itself. Yosemite is magnificent -- and you'll love Big Sur, as well. If you drive the Pacific Coast Hwy between L.A. and SF you might overnight in Cambria or San Simeon and take in Hearst Castle.

I'm not a big Vegas fan ... but there's actually more to Vegas than the gaudy gauche Strip. There are some incredibly beautiful places to hike within an hour's drive: Red Rock Canyon & Valley of Fire have unearthly beauty.

But remember ... depending on how early in September you go, it might be sweltering.

Happy planning!

Trent7

If you go to San Francisco I would definetley hit a couple of place: The City, Yosemite (4-5 hours away), Napa Valley (it is a beautiful area with literally hundreds of wineries) and maybe Lake Tahoe. I am not a huge fan but there are casinos and the lake is beautiful.

If you only want to see national parks, I would recommend Wyoming for Grand Teton National Park and Yellowstone. They are, in my opiion, some of the most beautiful areas of the United States.

If you go to Napa, remember that lodging in the area can be a little pricey but it is fun. being in the UK, you may have been to France to experience the wine regions so maybe this won't be as fun for you. For those of us in the US, there isn't anyplace like it here.

My opinion is that San Diego is fun and a nice city but if you are coming to the US, do you really want to see another generic city when there are so many natural treasures here?

Have a great time in the USA!

wildblueyonder

Many thank, all, for your continued suggestions - all much appreciated.
Trent7 & HKP - yes, probably my favourite places I've visited in the US have been Yellowstone and the Pacific NW - however I think my son and dil would be bored ... We have also spent some time in San Diego - went to Old Town, the zoo (didn't like it - too cramped for the animals) etc - but, for some reason, it's not what I'm looking for.
We are ok with heat - spent 4 days in Palm Springs, last year, in 110! Though I have to admit I'm better in dry heat than the humid type. Having said that ...
I am leaning towards a week in AZ/NV/UT and a week in Florida. Maybe fly to LV, spend 3/4 nights in a rental house there (day trip to Death Valley if we want), then up to Zion and Bryce and down to GC and saguaro np. From Phoenix fly to Tampa. 4 nights on the Gulf coast and 3 nights near Orlando (so that they can go to Disney if they really must) What puts me off mostly about Florida is the risk of hurricanes and the rain in September. But, hey - just back from Hawaii and there were tsunami sirens everywhere ... It has to be the end August/beginning September as my excuse for going is a 'big' birthday (I don't do numbers!) and, if anybody asked me where I would like to spend it, I would hardly hesitate a hair to say 'The Camelback Inn, Scotsdale'.
Thanks again! Plenty to think about!

dfr4848

Wow - you do have a task.

I like your general concept, except it looks like you're backtracking a little too much. With 2 weeks, I'd try and avoid that.

San Diego would certainly meet a lot of your criteria. But you could do something like the following:

1)

Do open jaw - fly into LA and out of LAS (Las Vegas) to maximize time and avoid backtracking. Nonstops to/from London available on Virgin Atlantic.

Drive the coast with stops in Santa Barbara (nice beaches, shopping, activities), San Simeon, Monterey, then SF and surroundings (including Muir Woods, wine country).

Then to Yosemite, Grand Canyon then Vegas (which I happen to dislike too, but sounds like it's got to be on the list)

Leave from Vegas.

If all the driving scares them, you could take Amtrak's Coast Starlight from LA to SF, although you would miss some of the stops in between. Might be able to get a ticket that allows you to "hop on/hop off" (not sure about that). But it does follow the Pacific for quite a distance and has some beautiful scenery.

This might be a little hectic, but still doable.

2)

There's plenty to see/do in Florida without Disney World and Sept will be less crowded. [Although it is hurricane season. That doesn't stop a lot of us from making plans to visit places around the Gulf and Caribbean; but you may want to consider this].

Fly into Orlando and go straight to Tampa/St Pete area down to Sarasota, Ft Myers. Lots of nice beaches and plenty of activities. Visit Captiva and Sanibel Islands. Really nice and some of the best shelling anywhere.

Then head over and visit Everglades, then down to Key West.

Come back up to Miami area for a few days and leave from there.

This would work if "beaches" are a key/main criteria.

I have plenty of other ideas, but sounds like some beach time has to be there somewhere.

Just some thoughts.

dfr4848

wildblue - we were posting at the same time. But maybe my thoughts will help.

wildblueyonder

Yes, many thanks dfr4848 - especially for the suggestions on Florida (I've ordered a tourist brochure, as I have no idea what's where!) The hurricane season is a risk, but perhaps worth taking.
The reason for the backtracking on the first thoughts was because of the drop off costs for car rentals - we've suffered greatly for this in the past!
Thank again.

dfr4848

wildblue - I like your idea of splitting the time with a week in the west and a week in FL, although you'd have to really cut some things. In the West, you could fly into SF instead of LA (although that drive on the Coast Highway is spectacular). The FL part would have to be compressed, but you could for ex skip the few days in Miami and use it just as a departure city. Or skip Key West, but that's such a unique area I almost hate to suggest it.

Understand the drop-off fee issue. Guess I was thinking that LA and Vegas would be such big markets, maybe the fee wouldn't be that much (if anything) but you've probably already checked that.

Good luck. And what choices!

dfr4848

Forgot to mention that if you do split the time and fly, check out fares on Southwest Airlines (you may already know this). They often have the best fares and their service is very good. They're not listed on major search engines like kayak.com, so you'd have to go directly to their web site:

www.southwest.com

PeaceOut

What about going to Lake Tahoe as a compromise? Your son can see the Nevada gambling side, and you can enjoy the gorgeous lake. I don't think I'd try two states, because of all the time in arriving, departing, getting and returning rental cars.

The California coastline will give you everything you want: beaches, cities, attractions.

Fly into San Diego and leave from San Francisco, or vice versa. There's so much to see in California.

Definitely use Southwest airlines if needed. They let you check two big bags for free, and they will change your itinerary without penalty fee. They are my favorite.

Barbara

Skip Florida. Humidity, huge, flying bugs, swarms of mosquitoes...who needs that?

Stay in California/Arizona. Fly in and out of Los Angeles. so a circular tour from LA-SF (up the coast on highway 1)-Yosemite (can't miss that out, really)-Death Valley-Las Vegas-(2 nights are more than enough)-Grand Canyon-San Diego(lying on beach)-LA.

Even this could use more than the two weeks you have. I would leave the Grand Canyon out.

wildblueyonder

Arrgh! I had almost, very contentedly, settled on AZ + FL, but I had forgotten about the bugs! I was scared almost witless by the huge flying roaches in Hawaii. And mosquitos love me. I was very careful with repellent in HI, but got bitten mercilessly one day in Hilo ... And I've read they have banana spiders in FL. Yikes. (Worse thing I've seen in 3 visits to AZ was a tarantula in a glass domes in a souvenir shop! OK, saw roaches, but only squiddy ones).
So, back to the drawing board. Maybe I'll have son and dil around for dinner, to discuss!
Thanks again for all suggestions - all has been noted. But I don't think I can take them to the US without Vegas or GC.

Orlando_Vic

wildblueyonder,
If you plan to come during the summer, from the UK, you should know that Florida will be hot (and humid), Las Vegas & Arizona will be much hotter and Death Valley will be Insanely HOT!

I recommend visiting all three, but timing is everything and the winter months would be best.

Actually, winter is "high season" for Florida, Summer is not.

Barbara

Ahh, but Death Valley and Arizona are a "dry" heat, so much more pleasant (less unpleasant?). LOL!

Gardyloo

I know exactly what you're saying, WBY; I've had the opportunity to "show off the USA" (a few parts, anyway) to several sets of British pals over the years. You can please some of the people all of the time and all of the people some of the time, and some of the people once in a blue moon...

All of our "hosted tours" have involved road trips, and most (not all) of our guests have had similar preferences to your son and DIL, including the same ambivalent (bipolar?) attitudes toward Las Vegas.

I also share the general opinion that Florida is the wrong side of the continent, especially for a September outing, when it's still hot and when the occasional hurricane can really muss your hair.

A fortnight is pretty short, so you should be looking either at "loop" itineraries, or open-jaw ones where you're not retracing your steps.

So as someone who has lived throughout the US west, when I wasn't living in Britain, let me offer some alternatives for your consideration.

First, let's talk about access. Starting this autumn, British Airways will be joining Virgin in nonstop service from Heathrow to Las Vegas. BA already fly nonstop into several other western US & Canadian destinations, including Calgary, Vancouver, Seattle, San Francisco, LA, Denver and Phoenix. This means open-jaw trips are dead easy to book and you have sufficient choices for arrival/departure points that almost any itinerary is possible.

First idea: Bite the bullet and start in Vegas. Why? Because of all the cities in the world in which to recover from jetlag, Vegas is near the top. If you find yourselves waking up at 3 in the morning because it's 11 AM at home, just go downstairs in the hotel and things are popping the same as they were at 7 PM or noon. Plus, for first timers, LV invokes so many images - scenes from TV, American scale and absence of inhibitions, the entertainment scene, the weather... it's like shock treatment. Everyone's senses will be supercharged, so that when you move onto more subtle or quiet pursuits - looking at red rock national parks, for example - the juxtaposition will be all the more dramatic.

Rather than trying to work off 8 hours of time change behind the wheel (a dicey proposition), a day or two in LV can actually assist in easing into the USA, ironic as that sounds. If your son and DIL want to hang by a pool, well duh - no place better. Or if you want to do an afternoon outside the frenzy, head off to Lake Mead and Hoover Dam for gobsmacking scenery.

After LV, it's a short drive up to Zion or Bryce NPs in Utah for some world-class scenery. Then you have a choice. You can continue north on Interstate 15 to the junction with Interstate 80 near Salt Lake, then head west through Nevada to Reno and Lake Tahoe; or backtrack (just a couple of hours) to Las Vegas and then head north by west - either through Death Valley (hot but not necessarily dangerously so in September - sort of depends on what part of the month) then north on US 395, or else north on US 95 in Nevada toward Tioga Pass (Calif. State Route - SR 120) and down into Yosemite. Again, depending on when in the month, there may or may not be some autumn colo(u)r at higher elevations.

Visit Yosemite then head west to the junction with Calif. SR 49, the "gold rush" highway, and follow that road through some beautiful and historic countryside until you reach I-80.

If you've either (a) gone straight north from Bryce/Zion to I-80 in Utah, and then have stopped at Lake Tahoe or Reno; or (b) have connected to I-80 through the Yosemite route described, from there it's straight through to the San Francisco Bay Area for the balance of your time.

There are so many things to do and see near the Bay Area that you can spend all your remaining time there - wine country, fabulous rocky coast and redwoods just a little north, SF itself... plenty to do. Fly home from San Francisco.

IMO trying to include either LA or the Grand Canyon in this itinerary is pushing it. September in LA is often the hottest month of the year, and the Grand Canyon is too much of a cul-de-sac to be included in a short holiday in which California is to play some role.

Of course there are many other alternative plans. You could fly into Calgary, get a car and drive through the Canadian Rockies (Banff is just a couple of driving hours from Calgary) and drop the hire car in Vancouver, then take the train (around £20 per person) to Seattle and collect another car, then drive down the Oregon Coast and through the Redwoods to SF. Fabulous introduction into western N. America, and the weather in the Pacific NW in September is usually warm enough for poolside lounging, if not dipping a toe into the rather chilly north Pacific.

Or, fly into Denver, head up to Yellowstone NP for a couple of days, then head west over I-80 to SF; or fly into Vancouver or Seattle, see the big volcanoes on your way south to the Bay Area, then go ahead and end up in Southern California on the beach or in the presence of mutant mice...

So many choices. Happy planning!

wildblueyonder

Hi again guys - more ideas - thank you!
I was rather hoping that somebody would come on and say not to worry about the bugs in Florida, because AZ+FL wouldv'e been ideal(I think).
First, the heat. It doesn't bother us and we can only afford to go to the hot places in the summer (because of the sky high prices in the winter!) We've been to Arizona in September and June and to Vegas in the same months and to Palm Springs in June/July. Sticky heat is worse though, another thing to put me off FL.
Second, the jetlag. Never had a problem going west from the UK, be it 8 hours or 11 hours as we had to HI last month. But coming back is a different matter - I'm still not right after HI!
All of your suggestions are interesting, Gardyloo - I'm particularly getting my head around your first suggestion. My hub, myself and eldest son have made several trips to the US - it's just our youngest son and his wife who haven't. I need to keep the time shorter, because of the financial side. If I have to pay for 5 adult flights (as I've promised) there's precious little left for accommodation!

Our first trip to the USA was in 2004. We flew into PHX (with BA), stayed at the Camelback Inn (LOVED it) and then drove up to the cooler mountains and down to Petrified Forest, Meteor Crater and to Sedona for a couple nights (didn't rate it, I'm afraid) Then we did GC and then Lake Powell, Bryce, Zion, to LV (only one night!) - then down to LA and then up to Sequoia NP and Yosemite before finishing off at SF and flying home from there.

2006 - we flew in and out of Seattle (BA), did Mt Rainier and MSH, then a couple more stops in WA before making our way, through Montana, to Yellowstone. After that, we stayed in Cody for a couple days and then headed north to Glacier and into Canada and Banff. Then we drove to Vancouver and back to Seattle.

2008 - we flew to NYC - stayed 3 days, then flew to Chicago. From there, we drove all the way to San Diego, via the Black Hills, Denver, Santa Fe, Monument Valley, Arches, Bryce, Zion, Vegas (again only one night!), Lake Havasu City, Palm Springs. We flew home from LA, as there are no direct flights to the UK from San Diego (as far as I know).

2009 - flew to LA - flew to Honolulu - stayed on Oahu for a week - flew to Hilo - stayed down by the tidepools/volcano for 3 nights and then to Kohala Coast for 4 nights. Flew home via a 12-hour stopover in Dallas (murder - rented a car, visited Southfork(!!) and the Book Depository. Then home to LHR and 2 weeks of jetlag!

So, we are pretty well travelled and now just have the task of picking out a 2-week trip that other son and dil will enjoy. What I fear is them coming home and saying 'what's the big deal?' I want them to love America as I do.

Thanks again - I'll keep thinking - and will get them around to discuss. I think, probably, something like our 2004 trip might be best - although it will have to be cut back (unless we win the lottery or something!)

Orlando_Vic

"I was rather hoping that somebody would come on and say not to worry about the bugs in Florida, because AZ+FL wouldv'e been ideal(I think). "

O.K., I'll say it. I've lived here 22+ years. We do have a lot of wildlife who also love it here, but bugs are not a major problem.