thursdaysd

Since we posted at the same time I hadn't seen your hotel list. Since I don't travel in Central America I certainly have no "feel" for the costs there without some details. And if we're going to get nasty, why don't you just answer my question about whether you're negotiating deals with the hotels?

thursdaysd

Great minds, toedtoes, lol!

Not sure why I'm bothering, since I'm not planning to visit Costa Rica any time soon, but for purposes of comparison:

My favorite small group tour company for Asia (Intrepid) has a 16 day/15 night Costa Rica Discovery, “original” level for $1260 (including the local payment, no single supplement, mandatory share) or a 9 day/8 night Taste of Costa Rica, “comfort” level for $1280 (ditto, optional single supplement available at $335).

Higher up the scale the Smithsonian has a 10 day/9 night Costa Rica – Nature’s Museum, “value-priced” trip, starting at $1,299 double, $2,399 single (!).

I see that all the hotels you list charge more (sometimes considerably more) for single rooms than double. I also see that at least two offer discounts for groups...

Grassshopper

Gee, this board has joined the rest of Fodors talk in being incredibly unfriendly and cynical to anyone new who presents a different opionion or approach to travel. Solo travelers travel solo for different reasons. When someone presents one that is not up your alley, no reason to try to prove that it has no value.

toedtoes

Grasshopper - I don't think anyone is trying to prove it isn't better, we're just trying to understand how it MIGHT be better. The OP has stated that these "untours" are saving the participants lots of money - we're simply asking for more details. Costa Rica is a place that I am interested in going to at some point so finding out how Raderbarbarian is getting these great rates is something I'd like to know.

raderbarbarian

I threw this concept of "untours" out to this board because I think it is an idea adaptable to other places besides Costa Rica. Of course we are getting reduced rates on hotel costs - duh! - just as we are on transportation costs. Any hotel will give a reduced rate when a group of rooms are reserved at one time - ten of them, in this case - often every room in the hotel (since hotels tend to be small here, at least the ones I like to use).

If someone wanted to put together a similar "untour" to, say, Berlin, why wouldn't hotels give you discounts for booking a group of rooms there, just as they always give groups? They don't care whether we call it an "untour" or a "group honeymoon."

It is a way to save money, that's all I'm saying. I am not trying to convince you to come to Costa Rica. Quite frankly, we do not have a shortage of visitors as it is. Sometimes I wish we had less.

So if you think this idea stinks and believe it is not for you, so be it, and by all means run away from considering it. And please take your cynicism and naysaying with you, por favor. It is just possible that this idea my resonate with someone else, though, right?

thursdaysd

Some people are so thin skinned. When an unknown person shows up on a public board with a new way for other people to save money, it is not cynical, but rational, to ask how they are doing it. (And I see that raderbarbarian posts on the Central America board, which I never visit, and the Lounge, which I generally avoid, but I don't recall seeing him/her here before.)

thursdaysd

And if the answer to "how does this save people money" is simply "group discount", what on earth was the problem in simply saying so in reply to the first question, instead of getting miffed and making a big deal out of it?

suze

Thanks for simply saying you are getting hotel discounts. Sorry you thought it a duh-worthy statement, but believe it or not I did not know that "any hotel will give a reduced rate" booking blocks of 10 rooms, etc. That is good information. Since I haven't done group travel no is was not obvious to me.

rb~ Please don't take this as an unfriendly welcome. Solo Traveler forum doesn't get much traffic, and new posters are high encouraged to join in the fun! Sorry if it did not come off that way to you, or others.

toedtoes

Thank you for confirming the group discounts.

Again, I don't think anyone was trying to be rude to you, but as solo travelers having someone come along and say "we all have private rooms and are saving lots of money" perks our interest and curiosity.

I'm also interested in how you are working the van as transportation. Is it being used only for traveling between areas or will you be using it for dropping people off at their personal interest sites within the areas?

And please, this is not being mean, but I know how regular tours work and as you are suggesting this is different, I'm trying to see where things are different.

raderbarbarian

Toadtoes said, "I'm also interested in how you are working the van as transportation. Is it being used only for traveling between areas or will you be using it for dropping people off at their personal interest sites within the areas?"

Well, I live here in Costa Rica so I know how things work here. The van will be used between areas only. Once we arrive in an area, taxis are readily and cheaply available - everywhere, even in the smallest of towns and in rural areas. In almost all areas, the drivers speak English. Tourism is the main industry here, and the taking care of tourists and their needs is well organized. Since I am along on the trip, I can advise and assist in arranging transport to personal interest sites as needed (which will be less than expected, I am fairly certain).

For many (most?) activities in the areas we will be visiting, the provider picks up people at their hotels and then drops them off later. The transport is built into the activity (or can be if requested).

There are places, however, where keeping the van and driver for extended periods might make sense - just not in this case, since no activities have been included in the "untour" (because we didn't want all of us to be locked into participating in the same activities, and also, because here activities need not be pre-arranged - you can make arrangements easily after arriving).

It might be wise, in attempting to use this model elsewhere, to target areas that you or someone in the group already know. It would help if someone in the group "knows the territory" somewhat.

By the way, I do not think I am "thin-skinned." I just give as good as I get. I may be new to this board, but I am not new to message boards in general. I realize that some people frequent the same board over and over and, whether meaning to or not, begin to claim "ownership" of it. They assume everyone knows them and their online personality, so they let things fly with abandon, never considering feelings nor the insinuations that they throw about willy-nilly. Fire away, if it makes you feel better - I'm a big boy. I can take it.

thursdaysd

"the insinuations that they throw about willy-nilly" What insinuations? I suspect any insinuations you think you detected were only present in your imagination.

suze

what the heck! How were we supposed to know you lived in Costa Rica, so have an insiders advantage to arrange great tours? You never mentioned that part..

That's great and I can see the value of your organizational skills. But you didn't say any of that at the start. That's why people were curious and asked for clarifications.

No one was throwing things about "willy nilly". No one has "ownership" or even much or a stake on this particular forum. If you bother to check the dates and number or replies on Solo Traveler its readership is very small, so your generalizations about posting habits don't hold in this situation.

raderbarbarian

Okay, Suze, just do not go back and read my ORIGINAL post on this thread. You might discover that you are WRONG (as hard as that concept may be for you to grasp). I absolutely mentioned that I live in Costa Rica in the very first post.

And you can now have you message board back to run as you choose. Have fun. I am going away now. You are BACK IN CHARGE!!! (Whew!)

suze

I apologize. Obviously I did miss where you clearly said you live in CR right off. I AM interested in your inventive idea for combining group & solo traveling.

'Solo Traveler' is hardly mine. It is one that Fodor's will not delete even though it gets terribly little participation. A few of us check in now and then to try and make it a viable forum. New participants are welcome.

I'm sorry you took our asking about details to be so negative.

thursdaysd

Having some time on my hands while watching TV, I did a little digging, since I wondered about the genesis of this tour. I thought the other message board referred to in the OP was on fodors, but it turns out it's a yahoo group (see tinyurl.com/32swu4). rader specifically says there that he's not making any money out of this, but it seems likely he's actually the guy in this article - www.hillquest.com/community/lairabout.htm - where he talks about starting a new business as a travel "consultant" in Costa Rica. Maybe there was a reason for all this defensiveness? (I certainly wasn't insinuating anything, I was asking for information, and I doubt anyone else was either.)