France travel experts, I'm seeking your thoughts on the best way to see a lot in the short time we have for three areas of France, to accomplish various goals.

Ten travelers total. Everyone will fly into and out of Paris. Six travelers have only one week plus weekends on either side, and four travelers have a few days longer. Everyone will visit Paris and Normandy and the four who have a few days longer will visit the Loire Valley as well.

The 4 people will probably fly in before the rest, and see the Loire Valley for several days. Then the rest of the group will fly into Paris, and I am considering having the group of 10 all meet at the airport on the arrival day of the 6 people, and all 10 head directly to Normandy, and see it sort of "backwards" from the way most people apparently visit. The 10 people (we will be driving) would make the long drive to Mont Sainte-Michel directly from CDG and spend one night on the island. The day of arrival is a fog of jetlag anyway, so I'm thinking the 6 jetlagged people can nap in the vehicles, we could stop somewhere nice for lunch, and arrive in the evening at Mont Saint-Michel for a bite and bed. The next day we could see the island, then leave and head to other places in Normandy we want to see (Bayeaux, maybe Etretat, Camembert, Honfleur, the D-Day beaches, American cemetery, Giverny, etc.) spending another couple of nights along the way, and end in Paris for the remaining days until we all fly home.

I would love any educated thoughts about this.

Also, the 4 people who want to see the Loire Valley could either return to Paris the night before the others arrive in Paris, OR have a marathon travel day and drive directly from the Loire Valley to CDG to meet the plane and then continue on to Mont Saint Michel. If we do that, what Loire Valley town should be the final one we visit so that it's quicker to get back to Paris?

Of course, all of this assumes we'll not be prevented by the virus, closures, etc. from traveling next spring.....





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Ten people 3 cars? We did something similar in 1995: 12 persons for two boats on the Burgundy canal. We came from different places, and 10 of us met at the airport. Arranging transportation to the Gare d'Austerlitz was touch and go, but we found someone driving a van, or he found us, that could fit 10 (one couple met us in Dijon). My point is that you need to really nail down the transportation, and be aware that herding 10 people is not like getting your partner to follow your schedule. I would also simplify the accommodations. Maybe choose Bayeux as a central point with day trips to be taken to Mont Saint Michel and Honfleur. I would go by train to Normandy and then use group transportation for the various excursions. It would mean missing out on Rouen and Giverny, but would eliminate a lot of headaches for the rest of the trip as a group. There used to be a rule that a large group purchasing the train ticket 26 hours in advance would get a discount; we got one going from Dijon to Saint Florentin where the canal trip started. I do not know if the policy still exists, and fluency in French might be essential. You would be doing that on your way to Loire valley.

Hi bakerstreet, I think you have the makings of a nice trip there. I can't address all your points but a couple of years ago we visited Normandy and the edge of Brittany and so we hit some of your destinations. I had a couple of points to ask you about. One is Mont Saint-Michel - did you expect to stay there overnight (i.e. on the island itself) or in a nearby town on the coast? I ask because I don't think it would be a great place to get over jet lag or for a first night. To start with, parking for the island is a long way away, more than a kilometre, and you take a (very crowded) free shuttle bus from the parking lots to the island (and you would do this with luggage, potentially at the end of a long drive). Secondly, the island itself is steep stairs lined with tiny shops and restaurants, and there is also accommodation in the form of rooms along the way. It would be a battle to get bags up those steps to the hotels. So if your ten people were all young, strong, not tired out and prepared for a fight at the beginning of the trip before six of them had had sleep, this would be OK. You would also have to manage expectations regarding this beforehand. I understand there is accommodation on the mainland (the shuttle bus passes some hotels and restaurants I think) and that it can be nice to see the island with twinkling lights at night, which obviously you don't get when you stay on the island, but you would have to find out which hotels have the view. I also read of someone who loved the accommodation on the island and experienced the magical feeling of staying on the island. I can't personally speak to either as we drove in from Rennes, which was our base. There were pros and cons for that, I am not necessarily suggesting that for you.

Secondly, just wondering about meeting at the airport. We have some limited experience of driving a rental car to our accommodation at the airport (Novotel) using the car's navigation system and then dropping the car off afterwards. It was quite complex because the signs did not tally with what the GPS was telling us and the traffic was berserk. My DH who was driving followed the GPS on a punt and we miraculously got there (or accidentally got there ), but all I'm saying is that the airport is somewhere to avoid by car. We have driven in Europe quite a lot so I don't think it was down to inexperience, but we certainly don't know the roads around the airport. You might think about meeting somewhere accessible by train as there are good train and bus connections into Paris, which we ourselves used. By comparison they are not at all complicated. However, I leave this just as a thought with you - maybe you have experience of driving near the airport and are not daunted!

Otherwise I think your trip sounds wonderful and I hope you get lots of responses here

Lavandula

Have you ever traveled with 10 people before??? If not - rethink your plan & perhaps cut out 1/3 of the destinations.

Have you done a lot of research with a good travel guide about France (not Rick Steves). Fodors might be a better choice. I get the feeling that your itinerary is "by committee". Has anyone been to Camembert? I have visited many of the Normandy cheese towns - and Camembert is the least interesting - and IMO not the best Normandy cheese.

How many days do you have for the Normandy portion?? Perhaps:

Day 1 - meet at CDG & drive 5 hours to the MSM parking lot. Figure out how to get into the lot, pay a fee (if any), park the cars, meet group, and take a bus to the Mont (difficult). This is an all day event - as you suggested.

Day 2 visit MSM 9-noon
Get off MSM & retrieve cars (difficult) 12-1
Drive to Ste Mere Eglise 1-3:30
Visit SME & museums 3:30-5:00
Drive to Bayeux (note spelling) 5-6
Check into hotel (3 rooms?) 6-6:30 Stay 2 nights
Walk around town & have dinner

Day 3
Explore Bayeux. There are 2 wonderful museums in Bayeux, and a 3rd opened recently, I believe. We spent hours in them. No idea of how long it would take to herd 10 people through only 2 museums. So I'll guess - 9-12. If it is market day - add an additional 1 1/2 hrs for 10 people. Tapestry may be "on tour"
Visit Cemetery, battlegrounds, Arromanches & theater, Pegasus bridge & museum

Day 4
Drive 1 hr to Honfleur. Visit & have lunch. Take walking tour in Michelin Green Guide
Drive 1 hr to Etretat, visit, & return to Honfleur. 1-4:30
Stay night in Honfleur

Day 5
Drive 1 1/2 hrs to Giverny & visit. 9-12
On to Paris.. Not much time for Paris

Attached is my Normandy & Brittany itinerary

Stu Dudley

Regarding staying on Mont St. Michel, I stayed at the Mercure right off the island. They have free outdoor parking and the shuttle to the Mont stops directly across the street. It is the closest hotel to the Mont without being on the Mont.

Mercure Mont Saint Michel
Route Du Mont Saint Michel BP 8
Le Mont St Michel 50170
Tel: 33 02 33601418

To follow on from StuDudley's post, yes, there is a fee for the MSM parking lot which you pay when you leave. There are machines and an enormous visitor's centre with good facilities (clean toilets) but no food. No matter, there are many restaurants on the Mont and also some on the way there.

Lavandula

""there is a fee for the MSM parking lot""

We stayed in an hotel on the Mont, and they provided us with instructions, and maybe a parking lot pass-code, and we did not have to pay anything. We REALLY enjoyed staying overnight on the Mont. Read my description in the itinerary I attached, for a "perfect stay on the MSM". However, with the OP's "complications", I suggest that he/she give up the Mont to save time, stress, and confusion (remember - Covid is hiding around every corner).

Here is one of my wife's Shutterfly books with picsfrom our stay on the Mont, as a part of our 2/year month-long trips to France we make every year (except Covid years).

https://stududley.shutterfly.com/57
Click "Full screen"

Stu Dudley

Have you considered having the 6 people arriving later in the trip take the train from CDG (or bus, longer but less expensive) to Rennes? You could pick them up in Rennes.

Herding cats is going to be the key issue

The next is a massive range of language skills (so Fred has to be with Alice as he can't understand anything etc)

When I do this even with maps inked in and clear instructions tail-end charlie will always get lost

10 people is also a lot for restaurants to take in on a spur of the moment thing. I've done it and chef is often bewildered "monsieur why did you not book?"

I'd not meet up at the airport unless the 6 newbies are the walking dead. Get them to meet at that nights hotel and invest time and resources to get them there. if it has to be say be Rennes or Rouen so be it. Certainly don't let 6 jet lagged people hire a car or two at CDG and drive across a country with strange laws you are heading them into serious danger. Get them on a train and taxi combo. Having another 4 people at CDG just turns a farce into a tragedy.

Hire your cars ar Rennes or Rouen and return them to CDG, extra cost but nice and simple

I like all of these ideas.

I would not do MSM first but Normandy, as Michael said getting to Bayeux by train is the way to go at least at first. It might even be more relaxing if those joining you later did a first night in Paris, and then went onward the next day. Either way Michael is right, don't try and herd people the first day, just give directions for joining the first group in Bayeux.

My last flight got in by 8:30 and even getting a train straight out of CDG I allowed about 2 hours after the flight arrived for that train. Given your group would be commuting to say, St. Lazare station, that would take about an hour. So allowing 1 hour for customs formalities, an hour to commute, an hour to buy tix at St. Lazare and maybe grab a sandwich for the journey (might as well do it on the day, this is an ordinary train) and, your group would need at least 3 hours after flight arrival before getting aboard the train - but once on there are onboard washrooms and room to spread out (usually.) , The train journey itself takes 2.5 hours or so. Group would arrive mid afternoon. I would not try to plan a 'nice lunch' for the first day, jet lagged people may not be up for it.

Once settled in Bayeux, the trick is to find a ww2 experiences tour company that is big enough for 10 plus a driver in Normandy, most have a maximum of 8 participants. When we did this we did one sector (the US) on our own in a rental car and did not get as far as SMEglise - but it was laundry day so had a slow start. We did Omaha beach and the cemetery, Pointe du Hoc, and a couple of other places we found in a guidebook borrowed from our BandB., but Utah beach is quite a stretch from Bayeux, a van tour might be the way to go.

Anyway, the other day we took a van tour of the British-Canadian sector, there were 5 of us plus the driver, and the van might have squeezed another 2 but it was comfortable with only 5. I think the next size up of bus would be too big and so I would suggest booking two van tours (even paying a little extra to have the two vans restricted to your group members) and going in tandem, if that's what it takes. Much easier as the tour guides will run things, herd the cats, do all the navigation, etc. So you'd need at least 4 nights - the first is arrival night, the next could be Bayeux tapestry day and a relax day, and then two days to explore by tour.

Regarding Mont St Michel. I would not stay on island, for the reasons another poster noted. That's a day a rental car (or 3) might come in handy although again a day tour arranged by van tour company from Bayeux might be the way to go. It's about 3 hours round trip from Bayeux. No, you don't get to see it by night, but it avoids having to uproot everyone.

By then you've used up 5 nights and it's time to return to Paris for a couple of nights.

Incidentally we did a little of the Loire solely by train from Paris. Once again with a group, get a van tour and day trip from your base to see the chateaux. Do not herd cats, get someone else to do it.

Bayeux is good on the train too

We did something similar, and it was not fun. At all. Herding cats indeed.

The only smart thing we did was to rent a gîte for a week for all of us. Then everyone needs to be able to go their own way and meet up at the end of the day. We didn't do that and it was time consuming and tedious to make any move at all. Good luck to you, brave bête.