dkarcz

I am planning a trip with my adult nephew to Paris and Rome. (64 and 40 yrs old) I have only been to Europe once so I need some help. We are in the States and I am wondering if we should go to Rome or Paris first. Next, I know that the accommodations are very small in most European cities so I need so me help about sleeping arrangements so that we each have some privacy. Should I book separate rooms if affordable or would it be more economical to book a family room?
Next, I am interested in how many days it is advisable to stay in each city. We can stay 9-14 days.
Which airlines are best?
Should we take a tour or find tour guides there?
I have had a knee replacement and will have to pace the walking each day.

I appreciate any help that any experienced travelers can provide.

Thanks so much,
dlk

Jean

Most of your questions could be better answered if we knew where you were coming from and what time of year you plan to travel.

On the in-bound, I prefer the easiest routing, preferably non-stop. The more connections, the more opportunity for delays/problems. I'm on the West Coast, so I nearly always have to make a connection or two, and I prefer some connecting airports over others. On the return, it doesn't matter to me if things go awry and I get home a day later. To save time, I would fly into one city and out of the other, and that might determine the order... simple inbound, not as simple return.

Nine days, 14 days... Obviously, the more days the better.

Unless you hire guides for just the two of you and can dictate everything, you may find the pace and distances of group tours beyond your tolerance. I wouldn't book tours every day but give yourself alternate (or more) days to recover or go slower.

Not all hotel rooms in Europe are small, and if you tell us your budget you'll probably get several recommendations. Apartments might be more economical, but first- or second-time visitors often find the assistance of hotel staff extremely helpful.

kerouac

I have lived in Paris for 44 years and obviously love it. But before I lived here, I came to Paris on my own (age 17) and loved it since I had been here before with my family, and I went just about everywhere else in Europe, too (since I had a 3 month Eurailpass -- a much better deal back then than what it became). I clearly remember writing to my parents when I reached Rome "there are 5 times more things to see here than in Paris!" I absolutely loved it.

But that does not mean that Rome is "better" -- it just means that I was a lot more impressed.

This is where the problem lies as far as I am concerned. I am also an Asia expert, so people have often asked me in which order to see things. One thing that I have always said is "See Ankor Wat last because if you see it first, all of the other temples will seem completely trivial, no matter how wonderful they are." And in terms of this trip, it means trying to decide if the Eiffel Tower/Louvre/Notre Dame etc. will be more impressive, or will it be the Colosseum/Vatican/Roman Forum etc. ?

Save the best for last.

RonZ

What airport are you flying from?

bilboburgler

It does depend on what sort of things you both like to do. Paris has a few old things (Roman) but Rome has loads of stuff like that, then moving forward Rome became a bit of a backwater until the 1700s, while Paris was developing. So thee cities are very different from an architectural and historical point of view.

From an International visitor point of view Paris has much better public transport while Rome has a far better large central pedestrian area. Both roughly the same size and both with interesting things to do centrally and on the outside.

I think I prefer Rome but is very much a close call.

alternatively you could add another city for a few days out. Florence is not far from Rome.

PalenQ

Do your own trip by train -Venice, Florence and Rome - the classic 3 Italian ducks in a row. Fly into one and out of the last one. For lots of info on trains and how easy they are to use and book your own ticket ahead of time: www.trenitalia.com -official site of Italian Railways; www.seat61.com; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com.

From Florence you can do day trips to Tuscan hill towns or rent a car and drive towards Rome, returning the car at a town outside of Rome and take trains in. Driving is horrible in Italian cities and not even allowed for private vehicles in many.

Christina

I prefer to fly home nonstop rather than when I go, but I can see Jean's reasoning. It makes sense as delays coming in or mislaid baggage cause more problems. However, for me, I am just tired out after a couple weeks and just want to get home quickly so that's why I plan it that way and it usually fits my itinerary better to have the big city at the end. With 2 big cities on the agenda, it doesn't make a lot of difference, just personal preference. Although check both ways for air fares, sometimes you'd be surprised how one way is a lot cheaper than the other, depending on arrival city.

AS for hotels, no fast rule on that one. Two separate rooms may not be more expensive than a "family" room, but often is, yes. But don't presume you get the same thing in a family room, as often that is usually for parents and children. For example, it may be one double bed and one small day bed on the side. This is not for two grown adults. Personally, I would never consider sharing a bedroom with my grown adult male nephews. Of course 2 rooms will be more expensive than one, but anything termed a "family room" is likely not for your situation. If you wouldn't consider booking a double room with 2 twin beds, then I'm not clear on what you think a family room will be that is different from that--a family room may actually have one smaller bed, as I noted, and one double or queen bed. It is usually a larger sized room within a hotel, though, say at least the size of the superior double.

It isn't true that all hotel rooms are small in Europe, it depends what you are willing to pay for, mostly, or type of hotel. For example, I've been given a family room at one hotel in Paris that was quite large for a double (which is what I'd booked, a superior double), and it just had a small extra day bed in an alcove. I think I got it because it was all that was left or something. I can't imagine a grown adult man sleeping in that bed in the alcove. There is no more privacy in a family room than a regular double room usually.

Mimar

You can get 2 single rooms. True single rooms are quite common in Europe. Another option is a double room with 2 twin beds.

In the Fall, for better weather and longer days, I'd be inclined to start in the north and move south. So Paris first, then Rome.

dkarcz

Thank you all so much for your input. Here is some additional info. We are flying from Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. The reason for the 9-14 days range is that we weren't sure if 5-6 days in each city would be too long. We have considered adding a third country but don't want to move around too much.
We are just starting to look at day trips that would allow us to stay in one hotel and just come back at night.
I didn't like moving hotels every 2 days on my last trip. It was a nightmare since I was having such trouble with my knees. And it made the trip much more aggressive than relaxing. So we will be planning some down time for sure.

We will be traveling in September but could actually do the last week of August and 1st week of September if it works out better.
Still checking on prices, etc.

KTtravel

5-6 days in each city will give you a nice amount of time in each location but you will likely still likely not be able to visit all the places you might like to explore. Particularly if you find your knees are acting up, it will be nice for you not to have to move at a rapid pace.

Someone here may know if you can borrow a wheelchair at the major museums in Paris and Rome. If a wheelchair is available, it could make visiting large museums more pleasant.

I would recommend trying to get two single rooms, if possible so you could each have a bit of privacy.

I like Rick Steves' guide books for first time visitors to Europe. He gives lots of practical advice and suggestions for touring on your own or joining tours.

I usually pick airlines based on which offers the quickest travel time, good travel times and a competitive price.

ssander

Flying from Pittsburgh means you can probably use Philadelphia, Newark or JFK as your gateway city.

PHL is probably the most expensive. (American has a virtual stranglehold on that airport.) It also may have the most flights from Pittsburgh, however.

You could also use Dulles...which, as I understand it, usually costs less. Look into Boston, too, if the Pittsburgh-Boston flights are frequent enough. (You want to give yourself a lot of connection time, because if you miss your trans-Atlantic connection, the next one is usually the next day,


ssander

WoinParis

You can find very good rooms in Paris for 100 euros a night.
You can find good rooms for as low as 60 with a bit of luck and discount.
You can find correct rooms for 50 euros a night. Less is a challenge.

If you are flexible about time you can easily reach Amsterdam or better still Bruxelles by fast trains. From Amsterdam or Bxl I would advise flying to Rome.
If you do so book 3 months in advance to get best deals.
I just flew Bxl Venice and Venice Paris on Ryanair and easyjet for about 60 euros for the two legs.

FuryFluffy

5-6 days in each city is definitely NOT too long, we're talking about Paris and Rome here! There are thousands of things to do. And when you are fed up with the city (unlikely), you'll have unlimited possibilities of day trips. For example, comprehensive and exhausted list of day trips from Paris, post in this forum by a helpful member:

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...s-446088-2.cfm

(Scroll down to the post of FrenchMystiqueTours, none of Paris day trip list beats his list there)

Rome day trips, plenty too, please come back to us if you need it.

For the order, do the city that interests you more in the last order. I've seen many people (my friends my aunt etc. ) saying that Rome is more impressive to Paris. Also, Rome tends to be hotter than Paris, though none of the two cities will be too hot in September. If you go in August, maybe Paris first then Rome to avoid the heat. It depends on you.

For which airline, you can look on comparing sites such as skyscanner which will list the cheapest flights for you. Look for multi-city or multi-destinations flights, which will land in Paris and depart from Rome, or vice versa.

FuryFluffy

I forgot, for accommodation, 1 double room tends to be cheaper than 2 single rooms. For me, I would prefer 1 double room unless I hate the person so much I want for my single room.

Rome and Paris are easy to navigate (and lovely to get lost), so you don't "have to" book a tour guide. If you had a knee replacement and prefer to walk at your own pace then maybe tours are not suitable. The subway and bus system in Paris is very convenient and covers every city spot. Get some detailed map and you're good to go.

ssander

Caveat:

Many Metro stations in Paris require going up and down stairs...both from street level to/from the platform level and between platforms within a station that serves multiple lines.

I think the RER has a much higher percentage of stations that have escalators/elevators.

...unless things have changed radically since we were there last fall.

Buses, of course, only have a few steps and are a great way to get around the city...if the journey is not too long.

ssander

PalenQ

5-6 days in each city is definitely NOT too long, we're talking about Paris and Rome here! There are thousands of things to do. And when you are fed up with the city (unlikely), you'll have unlimited possibilities of day trips.>

From Rome there are several great day trips:

Tivoli: Water Gardens at Villa del'Este

and Hadrian's Villa -bus from Rome to either site

Naples is just over an hour on high-speed trains

Orvieto - classic hill town

Viterbo -classic hill town

and right on doorstep of Rome - Ostia Antica -whose ruins rival those at Pompeii sans the thundering masses - short metro ride from Rome.

kerouac

In terms of metro steps in a place like Paris, yes it can be a bit of a pain if you are not used to it. However, my parents were happy (?) to suffer in the metro and walk three flights up to my apartment because they felt that the exercise was doing them a world of good, and they felt that they were in great shape by the time they went back to flat Florida. My father was over the age of 80 on his last trip and never complained (well, almost never) and after his death at age 86 when I was obliged to bring my mother to Paris, I was able to take her to most places within reason on foot (using both the metro and the bus) until she was about 85.

So I find it difficult to worry about someone who is 64, which happens to be my age, and I am still sprinting up my three flights and taking the metro about 6 times a day. I have a knee that hurts maybe one day a month, but I live with it.

ssander

K...

You are certainly right that -- if there is no problem -- using both Metro and bus is the way to go.

Perhaps I read more into the OP's statement about his knee replacement than was necessary, so I was just giving a heads-up.

Two trips ago to Paris (2015) my wife was fighting a bout of <em>plantar fasciitis</em>, and we found that taking the bus rather than the Metro (with its stairs) whenever possible was helpful; and didn't really slow us down too, too much. (Thankfully, by the time of our 2016 visit, she was pretty much completely recovered.)

I will say this: we love the buses, because Paris is such a beautiful city, and you can see the streets and neighborhoods on the bus so well.

ssander

powhatangal

The Hotel Albion in Paris has a family room. I stayed there on November. There are 2 separate bedrooms connected by a short hall. Off the hall is a bathroom with shower/tub and there's a separate toilet room.

You would each have a separate bedroom. There was a mini fridge in one of the bedrooms.

I put in dates for the end of Aug and it was 124 euros a night.

PalenQ

Buses as said are a nice alternative to the metro and its many steps and stairs at not all stations but many minor ones. Get a carnet of RATP tickets which can be used on buses and metro (and Montmartre funicular!).