Coquelicot

The N104/184 is the way we take leaving CDG but I don't recommend it. The lanes are narrow, traffic is heavy and very fast, and motorcycles weave in and out of traffic. We have learned to take it only as far as Cergy-Pontoise and then we take the back roads to Giverny or wherever we're going. We like to stop at La Roche-Guyon for a walk along the river.

Another suggestion for your first night's stay is Pierrefonds. It's not too far from CDG. I think a family of architects would love the reconstructed chateau. There are amazing photos of Pierrefonds on Google Images.

Paragkash

jpie, I just checked auto lease plan. It turns our 40% more expensive than the rentals for around 3 to 4 weeks.
Coquelicot, La Roche-Guyon and Pierrefonds are amazing hidden gems. Will try and incorporate.
As far as going North from CDG, I can see only other option as A15. The rest will be tough for me to find.

dugi_otok

Based on more reading of your posts, how about this. More time in Normandy at the expense of saving Burgundy(my previous recommendation) for another trip. Then we have

Arrive CDG in AM.
Drive to Rouen (159 km-1 hour 45 min)
Visit tourist office. Rouen walking tour.
Lunch in Rouen
Brief tour of Jeanne d'Arc Tower
Leave Rouen( drive to Honfleur 88km-1hour 5 min)
Arrive in Honfleur, check into hotel.
Stroll the old port of Honfleur

A. Honfleur- 1 night
Wander Honfleur, see the Eglise Ste Catherine
On to Caen for museum stop
Hit the road and the D day beaches, American Cemetery,etc.(60km-40 min plus meandering)
On to Bayeux (20 km-20 min)

B. Bayeux- 1 night
See the remarkable Bayeux Tapestry
More D day stuff
Drive to Le Mont Saint Michel (1 hour 28 min)

C. Mount Saint Michel for 1 night
Circumnavigate Le Mont
English tour of the abbey
Leave for Dinan for a touch of Brittany (optional) 58 km-46 min
Lunch and short walking tour of Dinan (optional)
Leave for Amboise 329 km-3 hours 20min
Le Mont direct to Amboise would be 310 km-3 hours 27 min
D. Amboise(Loire )-3 nights www.le-vieux-manoir.com
361 km-4 hours 18 min

E. Rocamadour-1 night www.domainedelarhue.com/gb/accueil.htm
366 km-4 hours 8 min

F. Sarlat-la-Caneda(Dordogne)-4 nights www.villaconsuls.fr
504km-5 hours 11 min
Since you are an early riser you do not need to spend a night in Carcassonne. Just make it a stop enroute Sarlat to Provence

G. Uzes(Provence West)-3 nights
309 km-3 hours 17 min

H. Nice(The d'Azur )-4 nights
244 km-2 hours 51 min via Aix en Provence

I. Saint- Saturnin-les-Apt (Provence East-Luberon)-3 nights http://www.masperreal.com/indexfr.html
382 km-3 hours 56 min

J. Annecy (French Alps)-3 to 4 nights
Drive to Lyon (139km-1hour 38min) and take the TVG to Paris
(about a 2 hour nonstop train trip)

K. Paris-1 night

dugi_otok

Another oops
Rocamadour to Sarlat is 51km 1 hour

sanderskn

I would add your extra days to Normandy when you are up by Mt St Miche. Normandy is beautiful. The towns of Les Andelys and Bayeux are great. Lots of medieval ruins in Normandy, plus cider farms.

anniemackie

MSN: A whole day spent in MSM would be similar to spending an entire day on Main Street in Disney's Magic Kingdom. The mount is beautiful before and after the hordes of tourists descend. If you want to use MSM as a base, get out of "Dodge" during the day. IF you stay two nights be sure to locate high enough for a good view of the surrounding waters, with perhaps a balcony for some relaxation. IF you are planning on eating there, research restaurants extensively...we've had yet to find a decent one right in MSM.

Normandy: well worth every minute...good idea to try and fit it into the list.

Carcassone: we loved it for an evening stop and went on to Aigues Morte (sp?) for our next stop. Toured the salt mines & surrounding region before going on to Provence. Great towns for a one-night break.

Scheduling: We travel the same way as your family and have discovered that at least 4 nights in one place gives us more pleasure. I know it is hard to plan, but consider that three nights only gives you two days in a region -- you may spend half a day figuring out how to get around. Of course, I don't have any suggestions for where to cut, that will end up being an entirely personal decision.

This looks like an exciting trip!

--Annie

jpie

Wow surprised at the price difference of the leasing. We always find it cheaper-but that of course could be difference in insurance cost and also the fact we lease 6 months.

Paragkash

jpie.. you are right.. the longer you rent better the rates are

Paragkash

anniemackie, I have similar views about staying at one place for 4 nights. Looking at the amazing places scattered everywhere I may hv 2 do 1 or 2 night stays in between the 4 night bases to see the area effectively. I also like to live like the locals, buy grocery at local stores, interact with them and be temporary residents of the place. All of it is not possible everywhere. But I look forward to such holidays in future at least once my kids are settled.

Paragkash

Am working on the itinerary. Want to get the most out of it. It is probably turning into a whirlwind tour with close to 4000 km in 30 days. It is based on Rick Steves Itinerary with about 6 days added to it, not because I want to see more places but want to spend more time at select places.
Am trying to incorporate everyone's suggestions.
Have increased a day in Normandy/ Brittany and reduced from Chamonix area.
Have a lot of questions. Don't know if i should be posting them under the same thread or should post a new question for every segment.
My revised Itinerary:

Day 1- Arrive at CDG by 7 am and proceed to Giverny, Rouen overnight Honfleur

Day 2- Drive to St. Malo and Dinan- Overnight Mont St Michel.
Day 3- MSM - no driving day (skipping D Day beaches)

Day 4/5/6 Loire Valley- Overnight near Amboise

Day 7/8/9 Sarlat- and villages around ( would have loved a day more)

Day 10- Carcassone- overnight

Day 11/12/13/14- Arles or my choice ST REMY. want to visit Les Baux, Marselles, Casis and Provence villages around. Even 4 days sound less here.

Day 15/16/17 Nice and riviera.Would want to also see smaller places around.

Day 17/18- Nice to chamonix- 2 nights- This 457km long drive via A10/E80 and E25- 5 hr drive according to google is a bit of concern. It will probably take 7 hours for me if I leave by 6 am. There are multiple route options via Turin and around. Would like suggestions. Dont mind reaching by evening but the road should be safe and easier and preferably scenic.

Day 19- Drive to Annecy- spend half a day and proceed to Beaune-( Didn't fancy Beaune. Wll prefer a smaller place before that as a stop-over.

Day 20/21- Drive to Colmar- 2 N- Route du Vin villages.
want to see Strasbourg and also Ronchamp Chapel by le Corbusier. Do i add a day here and visit these places.

Day 22- Drive to Reims en route paris- Overnight hault- Should I do this or look for a smaller quaint place.

Day 23- Drive to CDG and return the car. and stay in Paris
Day 24/25/26- Paris Versailes etc. ( would have loved Fontainblue and Chantily)
Day 27- Flight back home

I do have 2 more days to add if needed, which I generally use back home to unwind.

Please comment and suggest. Thanks

kja

This itinerary would be WAY too rushed for my tastes! Some examples: Even if you can drive safely after arriving at CDG, Rouen deserves at least a full day, if not more, IMHO. I personally was not that impressed with St. Malo, but even if you skip it, I think it would be difficult to see Honfleur and Dinan before heading to Mont St. Michel. Sounds like you have at most 2.5 or 3 days in Sarlat -- not nearly enough IMO. Etc.

I recommend that you get some good guidebooks (or spend some time with a few in your local library), identify the things you most want to see in each location, note their opening/closing times, and mark them on a calendar. Then pencil in your transportation, add some time on either side (for getting to/from the train/bus station or whatever, checking in/out, packing/unpacking, getting oriented, etc.). Then see how things fit together. You might end up deciding to cut a number of destinations.

BTW, you say that your plan is based loosely on a Rick Steves itinerary. I'm not sure whether you mean a tour or a written plan, but here are some thoughts:
- If you are looking at the plan for a guided tour, note that independent travelers can rarely make the schedule work for themselves. As one simple example: a guided tour may only stop long enough at site X to allow people to take pictures of themselves in front of it. If you actually want to SEE the place, you could need substantially more time.
- If you are looking at a written suggested itinerary, note that IME Rick Steves covers relatively little of what can be seen in any given location. I generally find that I want at least twice the time he recommends anywhere, and I sometimes want much more than that. Granted, I really enjoy art (which isn't his thing), but it isn't just that -- there are all sorts of things to be visited and enjoyed and admired that his guidebooks seem to skip.

Rather than trying to cram it all in (my take on your itinerary), I try to maximize the time I have to actually see and experience the places that I do choose to see, while minimizing the time spent traveling between places. I’m most likely to skimp on places that have international airports, because those are the ones that I can most readily visit again. I’ve also realized that if I can return to a region, the LAST thing that I am likely to want to do is spend my time re-doing all that (unnecessary) travel time so that I can go back and finally see the things I skipped the first time. In fact, I might end up not returning specifically because it would mean wasting so much time going from place to place! JMO.

Good luck!

Paragkash

Kja, Thanks a lot for taking so much efforts to write your views. I fully agree with you that this looks rushed up. This is a sample itinerary on the website made by Rick to assist an independent traveler. But he himself calls it Kamikaze (suicidal)
I can skip St. Malo and Rouen as I don't much like big cities. Would like to see Monet"s Garden at Giverny and sleep at Honfleur. Next day would be only for Dinan and sunset at MSM. Plus 1 full day at MSM.
I have been studying France on internet and reading travelogues, pictures, reading DK Eyewitness guide and Lonely planet. This makes the job even tougher. Only way to freeze the itinerary is through this forum.
My destination is the journey itself. Small villages and beautiful places on the way. This I find is the best way OF family bonding. This would probably the last long trip all 4 of us can do as my daughters' will soon become A Doctor and AN Architect and will get married. I also do not want to leave a lot of France unseen and for the next trip as I do not know if I will come back to France. I have been to Paris twice earlier and to the rest of Europe 7 times.
Suggestions I want is what to cut and where to add time.
I feel the thing I can cut down is
Carcassone & Beaune, Colmar area. I may see it if I plan Germany trip again.
I don't want to leave the car at nice n fly back to Paris.
I am trying to keep distance between 2 bases limited to max 300 km/200 miles, so that I have time to see places on the way.
then the distance between A. Sarlat and St. Remy demands a hault in between.
Same consideration for B. Nice-chamonix and C. Annecy- Paris.
Please help.

Paragkash

As if this confusion was less for me, that I came across a fabulous and magical looking place in central France. Le Puy en Velay in Auvergne. It is close to no place in my itinerary. Minimum 250 km (3 hrs) from Arles.
I am fascinated by the visuals I saw. Can someone suggest a route that can cover this place.

Michael

Drop Carcassonne and travel via the Gorges du Tarn or the Lot to Le Puy-en-Velay on your way to the Rhone valley and the Provence.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mksfca...132588561/show

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mksfca...313123155/show

You should have a large road map of France in front of you as you make your choices.

Paragkash

Yes Michael, I do have a road map.
As I study more, even more fascinating places come up and the choice become harder.
Carcassone is probably more touristy as it is on the major tourist route and close to the riviera.
Le Puy en Velay weighs slightly higher for its stunning visuals that are unmatched and not seen anywhere else in the world.
There are picturesque villages in the Dordogne area and Provence. But they have a similar character of a region. After seeing 3 of them, the 4th one doesn't evoke the same awe. Deja Vu. Or Law of diminishing Marginal utility.
Hard choices to make.
More help from the wizards here please.

Paragkash

Michael, your photos area amazingly wonderful. I wish I could get the names of each villages that are featured. it is a visual treat.

Michael

Where possible the pictures are identified as to location. Just click on "show info".

dwdvagamundo

Paragkash--one thing I would scale back for sure is your visit to Mont Saint Michel. One full day around there would bore me a lot. Unless you want to time the tides and try to walk to the mainland and back, there just isn't that much to do. Not saying to do it, but I am saying you won't need that much time; best part of MSM for us was looking at it lit up all nite from our bed and breakfast on the mainland. So stay one nite and add it to the Loire Valley.

Still thinking about Nice to Chamonix. The mountains in that area make it very difficult--one logical stop along the way would be Torino. However, it may perhaps be better to reconfigure this part of the trip so that you come back to Aix-en-Provence and head north from there on the A7 to Valence thence NE on the A49 into the mountains. Haven't looked at the mileage.

One route back from Annecy would be to drive to Macon then north along the Saone to Beaune, to Dijon, and thence to Reims. You should be able to find some lovely little town(s) stay in along that route.

Paragkash

dwdvagamundo, can you recollect the name of your B&B at MSM

dwdvagamundo

Paragkash--I THINK it's this one:

Auberge de la Baie
44 Route de la Rive Ardevon
50170 Pontorson
France

I've searched for this several times over the years and today is the first time I've found it. Looks like the one we had--stone walls, great cuisine, views of MSM. The tariff makes me rethink our decision not to return there for the French trip we're about to take. My spouse and I just talked about this place last nite! One of the nicest travel memories we have.