sandi_travelnut

Well, my parents aren't quite so frenzied, but they are the same age group. In Dec 2004 My husband, son and I took them to Paris, Montreux Switzerland, Venice, Florence and Rome. We had an incredible time and spent and 3-4 nights in each location except Montreux. Their favorite city was Rome because of the energy, architecture, history etc.

I think in your situation, Paris, Florence or Venice might be good ideas.

nytraveler

Well - since you say thy're high maintainance I would suggest a couple of things:

Work with them but have THEM pick the desinations based on what they want to see most (otherwise you'll be hearing but I really wanted to see the blot). Bring them lots of brochures, look at web sites with them etc so you all agree on the must sees.

Suggest a hotel rather than an apartment (less work for you, they can have a meal in if they want - and you will have the support services of the staff and concierge in meeting their needs)

Plan on traveling by cab to save their energy for the things they really want to see

I would not worry about the frenzy part - as long as you're in Western or Central europe you can have the resources to unfrenzy them (would not reco Russia or other eastern areas with less sophisticated tourist infrasructure)

I would not try to tie them down to a cruise - or anything long-term - but leave as much freedom as possible so they are IN CONTROL (that's what was wrong with the tour, along with the specific issues - and a cruise would be the same problem)

Grandma

I'm 69 and husband just turned 80. The past two years we've been to London and Paris. We've visited each several times in the past... but there is something to be said for being older and just slowing down and smelling the roses. I'd opt for Paris. ( Simply because the prices in London might send your parents into cardiac arrest when they convert pounds into dollars - There is soooo much to see and do in Paris. Maybe we just appreciate it more now that we're older. We stayed in the 7th (twice in the last two years)...and the last time El Husband visited a real estate agency looking at properties. Dream on....

basingstoke2

One more vote for Vienna. A great public transportation sytem, impressive architecture galore, great museums of all kinds (I particularly enjoyed the musical instrument museum). Relax in the cafes - enjoy a wine garden or two.

Heck I want to go back NOW.

Aramis

70 + parents.

How the heck did you get that many parents?

lucy_d

fishee,
I, too, think Vienna would be a good choice.

>>>they tend to associate Europe with high art, high culture, "famous" stuff<<<

Vienna can be fancy and high brow. The Imperial Apartments "Sissi Museum" and Imperial Treasury at the Hofburg would be enjoyable for them. Of course, the Kunsthistorishes Museum is wonderful, but enormous. The Belvedere might be a good alternative (or addition) as it is easily doable in much less time for people who may tire.

I agree with the posters who suggested taxis and, of course, separate rooms.

I really hope your trip works out for you. One of my greatest regrets is not traveling with my mother. WHile we've both traveled in Europe, we never had the opportunity to go together. She can no longer travel but so enjoys hearing about my trips.

Looking forward to hearing what you decide.

fishee

Some of this might depend on where I can get two award tickets for October. (I'll purchase my own ticket to ensure I'm on the same flight) Paris or Vienna -- I figure it shouldn't be too hot or cold during that time?

I appreciate the comments about the uneven pavement in Rome -- my mom has fallen when coming down the stairs on a smaller RJ and my dad has broken his toe in the hotel room when they were in Hawaii.

I can't believe I'm considering doing this... If I get through it, I'll have the basis for a screenplay.

111op

I agree with the people who suggested asking your parents where they want to go.

Nearly every year since 1998 or so, my mom and I have taken a trip together. We've been to many of the standard destinations in Europe. Of these I think her favorite is Switzerland (we stayed in Muerren), and she still talks fondly of the Amalfi Coast even though I made her do the insane thing of going to Amalfi and then Pompeii later that same day.

I don't think anyone has mentioned Switzerland yet. My mom is much more fond of nature than I am. She also enjoyed the Norway in a Nutshell trip. We also just went to Australia.

I guess this won't fit with wanting to see "impressive architecture and famous paintings," but you never know.

I'm thinking of going to the Italian Lakes with her on a future trip. Neither of us has been there.

We almost always quarrel on our trips together, but I guess I still end up taking her somewhere every year. The reality is that she really is very easy going, and I'm also realizing that I should travel with her when she can still do so.

Sue4

I had to smile reading this, as it made me feel good about myself! I'm 70+ (71)and have taken trips to Europe almost twice a year for the past 10 years - most solo, and not on tours. I had done tours when I was younger, and like your parents, felt too rushed. I've throughly enjoyed 2-week trips to London and Paris. And during the past several years have done 2 weeks each driving around Burgundy, Provence, Dordogne, Alsace and Loire Valley, and am going to Normandy in April. I've vaguely considered asking my "high maintenance" daughters along, but
reconsidered!

Anyway, I'm sure your parents would love a week's stay in Paris, especially your mother. There is so much to do, and daytrips (say, Versailles) are easy to do. Keep it low-key and easy and I'm sure you'll all have a wonderful time.

daph

We are in our early 70's and have traveled independently for the last 25 years in the UK, France and Italy. We like to stay for a few weeks in cities, getting to know them or for a shorter time in smaller towns-on the French Riviera or the Amalfi Coast-where public transportation is fairly good. Never did like driving in these places too much, especially on the left side. Last year, for the first time, we took an organized tour. It was a Tauck tour of Britany, Normandy and the Loire, with Paris at the end. It was a wonderful, beautiful and well planned tour. Everything is done for you and you still get quite a lot of free time. It is a high end company but first rate if you care to go that way. We were lucky enough to have a great group and leader. There were several other couples our age.

Jimjim

We are in that age bracket and I wish our son would offer to take his parents on a cruise up the Rhine, through the Main/Danube Canal and down the Danube to the Black Sea. We will settle for only going as far as Vienna or Budapest.

They can see 7 or 8 European countries from a comfortsble deck chair, with-out getting sea sick.

bob_brown

Well I am a 70+ parent and if my son tried to tell me where to go, I would reciprocate rather vigorously. But, he would not "tell"; he would ask us first where we might like to go!!

I have several comments to make, like you make your parents sound like they have no idea about where they would like to go and were it not for you, they would flounder interminably.

Noble thought, but are they really that out of it? By the time I get back to Europe this year I will be 74, with an artificial hip, and arthritic knees.

Despite my senior status, I know where I want to go, and my wife concurs because I have asked her, until she was tired of concurring!!

I think an apartment in Paris would be a good idea. In fact, I had one lined up for all 6 of us (the senior Browns, son, daughter-in-law, and 2 teenaged grandsons.) The plans fell through because of grades; summer school looms like a specter.

Munich is a good place to visit. I will be there for a few days in August. And I will tell you now that if your Dad likes to play golf, the Margarethenhof Golf Club on the Tegernsee is a lovely place with a 4 star hotel and a good if not great restaurant.

Salzburg is good for a slow paced visit.
Vienna is the same. Lots to do, and no particular hurray to "see it all" because you cannot.

I think it all depends on what they like. The last time we were in Vienna, we attended 3 operas in 4 days and enjoyed all of them greatly. We also went to the other sights as well that have been previously mentioned.

My favorite place of all, however, is Switzerland. We rent an apartment by the week in Lauterbrunnen and ride all over the place on trains, buses, and cable lifts. One can argue the merits of Wengen versus Mürren versus Lauterbrunnen versus Grindelwald versus Interlaken. All have good and bad points. We have a good set up where we go and "we know the drill" so that minimal time is wasted getting set up.

We also know where we want to go and what we want to see before we get there. Like last year, we finally got what we wanted in Zermatt: A clear day. We drove to Täsch, got the shuttle train, and walked to the cable lift to the Klein Matterhorn for a stupendous day of gazing. At last, a fully clear look at the Matterhorn, the Dom, and all the way to Mont Blanc!!

This year, after Switzerland, we will take a short tour of Scotland with Back Roads Touring.

Back Roads does small group tours and I have gone with them twice in the past, both times to Wales. We got our money's worth both times. The tour of South Wales had 6 people total, and we were able to discuss what we wanted to do each day, within the parameters of the tour guidelines. Each day was full and there were none of these absurd commercial stops to take an "optional" tour at extra cost. (For reasons like that Insight will never see me again.)

I think my conclusions are these:
Many good ideas have been discussed and all should be taken into account. I do, however, have one final comment: If, you were my son, I would strongly recommend that you first ask Dad and Mom what they wanted. They might not be as senile as you make them out to be.

fishee

I have no doubt that many of you who regularly give me great travel advice might be in your 70's.

But trust me, y'all are NOTHING like my parents. I'll share an illuminating detail of their group tour experience: At one point, the guide was so irritated/angry with my dad that he ordered that the bus stop and he and my dad got out and started to get into a physical fight on the side of the road. My mother sat on the bus wringing her hands and tried to not die of embarrassment.

This is not the most mortifying moment of their trip -- just the most succinct and illustrative.

I'm not kidding. I really wish I were.

Aramis

And you are considering taking them on this trip - why???????

ira

>the guide was so irritated/angry with my dad that he ordered that the bus stop and he and my dad got out and started to get into a physical fight ...<

How old was the guide?

BTilke

Given your story above, that makes my rec for Vienna even stronger, as it's a city where it would easy for your parents to venture out on their own to many of the sites close at hand. Which means you wouldn't have to be together all day when friction could develop. I also think seeing so many other people in their age group enjoying the city would increase their confidence level to explore independently.

However, I would urge you to pick a good four-star hotel that can give you separate rooms or a room for you and a mini-apartment for your parents. There are many good 4-star hotels in central Vienna, including family owned hotels like the Kaiserin Elisabeth and solid, full-service chain hotels like the Marriott. And of course, the five-star palace hotels (if your budget runs to those) who are used to demanding guests.

If this is a summer trip, however, make sure you pick a hotel with AC (and AC in the rooms, not just the public areas). Vienna can be quite warm and muggy in the summer.

nytraveler

If your father is that combative/difficult I have a couple of comments.

Has he always been like this or is this something new? It's true that some people are difficult their whole lives. But if this is new it may well be a sign of approahing dementia (patients become so frustrated that they are confused but don;t know what's wrong that they act out like toddlers). If this is the case, he really needs an evaluation by an MD (who has been prepped with all of this info.)

If he's been like this his whole life - all the more reason to have them make the decisions on where to go/what to see, to stay in a hotel not an apartment, and to make it easy for them to go off on their own at times (so you don;t end up in a fistfight with him).

sandi_travelnut

...and please let us know what your itinerary is so we can stay away!

fishee

I NEVER said this trip was going to be easy...

He's always been combative (although apparently so was the tour guide) but it's the worst under the following conditions:

1. when he thinks he's being taken advantage of
2. when he's uncertain and feels a lot of pressure to make the right decision -- then feels like he's screwed up.

They're my parents -- what'cha gonna do? I don't ever travel with them -- but if I can endure one trip with them before they pass and some good experiences can come out of it (for them and myself) it's worth doing once. I also don't like punishing my mom for his behavior which has happened for decades now -- but he'd never stay home while we took a trip together.

If I can coordinate a trip that will greatly minimize the 2 above conditions, he will be much more mellow. He trusts me to a large degree -- that I know what I'm doing, that I find good deals, that I can finesse social situations that they aren't comfortable in (like a nicer restaurant where we'd have to order in French or Italian). He feels like they're treated more respectfully when I'm present (they're immigrants with heavy accents).

Anyway, thanks for the advice. I'm going to call them this weekend and get some feedback on this.

Sue4

I don't know, Fishee, but do you really think your dad will enjoy a trip abroad?
So many things can go wrong on a trip, and when a person is that inclined to "blow up" - well, you know what I mean. Your poor mother - can't you arrange to just take HER? From what you've said, probably not, but I wish you could!