Padraig

Jean wrote: "I'd say the bigger problem is overpopulation, especially in countries/areas least able to afford more people..."

There is so much wrong with that claim that I don't know where best to start.

One possibility is to point out that the per capita contribution to global warming of the world's poorest people is tiny compared to those of us who live in the wealthy countries. Should they be denied a right to exist so that we can jet all over the place simply to enjoy ourselves? Do you consider why the poorest people have large families? In their situation, it makes very good sense.

It behooves us to accept responsibility for our lifestyle and not to deflect that responsibility on to others, particularly those less advantaged than we are. The destitute family in Calcutta and the subsistence farm family in sub-Saharan Africa together do far less damage to the global environment than does this indulged Irish individual.

traveller1959

Here are my suggestions for reducing CO2 emissions:

1. Stop travelling by aircraft, car or train. Walk instead. By walking, you can easily cover 15km a day. In three weeks, you can make 315 km. This is more than Jesus travelled all his life.

2. Stop heating your home. Instead, wear thermal underwear, sweaters and gloves in wintertime.

3. Stop using the shower. Instead, use a scraper to clean yourself.

4. Stop eating meat. And eating vegetables. Instead, start eating clay. It will fill your stomach, and after a couple of days you will cause no CO2 emissions any longer.

bkluvsNola

J62,

"As for waste, aren't beachgoers going to take a shower back at home/hotel if the don't at the beach? For me washing at the beach means I don't need to shower later. Which shower do you think will be longer and more 'wasteful'?"

Perhaps that would be true if those people only took one shower, but I saw people taking showers *every* time they got out of the water.

I saw one man (who wore a speedo so I can assume he was European) and he was at the shower every 15 minutes, washing every part of his body. All I could think was that he was wasting so much precious water.

The water was potable, by the way, because others were doing the same. Also, the water was nice and cold from the showers, whereas the "eau plate" was lukewarm, so I actually preferred drinking the shower water, LOL!

Here in Texas, I can't think of any showers in Galveston or Corpus Christi/Padre Island along the beach. There were no showers along the Panhandle of Florida either, although private resorts may have had some. It's just not as common place, at least along the Gulf Coast of America. I think there are showers in California, but that is probably catering to European tourists' demands.

traveller1959

>>> All I could think was that he was wasting so much precious water.<<<

Water is not precious in Europe. It is abundant in Europe.

And it must be even more abundant in USA, regarding that they are watering the lawns of golf-courses even in the desert.

But I admit, watering a golf-course is much more necessary than washing salt and sand off your skin.

bkluvsNola

"Regarding the showers on the beach, it does lessen having showers at the hotel"

This statement is false. In the US, when I go to the beach (let's say Florida Panhandle), there are no showers along the beach. I go in the water and swim, suntan, go back in the water, etc...

When I am finished, I go back to the hotel, and take one shower.

The routine that I saw in France was to go in the water, take a shower, suntan, go in the water, take a shower, suntan. I saw some people taking 10 showers in the course of a day, whereas they would only take 1 shower at the hotel.

Mucky

This wasting water arguement doesn't wash with me (sorry )

Most water finds its way back to the sea somehow, so during the next cycle of rainfall it will find it's way back as rain somehow, then into the resevoirs, then back out to sea.
Simplistic but basically true.

In come the clouds from across the sea, picking up moisture. When they hit land they rise, they then cool, condense then it rains.
Rain flows down into the rivers and resevoirs then eventually out to sea. The cycle starts again.

;-)

Muck

nukesafe

Well said, Muck! The only thing that is being wasted at the showers on the beach is the minuscule amount of energy that is used in the treatment and pumping of that water. As Muck says, it drains into the sand and then into the sea -- to come back as rain. The water itself is NOT a "precious resource" in those locations where it is abundant.

Get real, and worry about something important.

Mahya2

"There were no showers along the Panhandle of Florida either,"

I live in southeast Florida and we have free showers every few yards and/or wherever there is an exit/entrance path to the beach -

Most people at least rinse off the sand from their legs and feet before leaving the beach - but as a matter of fact we also have "free" outside showers at our pools and you are asked to shower at them before entering the pool.

I dont know why people on the Riviera shower every time they come out of the salt water, but maybe they know something about what's in the water, or saving their skin that we dont.

bkluvsNola

Mahya2 writes "I live in southeast Florida"

Southeast Florida (Miami) is not the Panhandle. There are a lot of Europeans in the Miami area that perhaps demand the showers?


The argument that it will come back as rain is hogwash. It may come back as rain in England or the Amazon Rain Forest or places where there is a lot of precipitation. If you waste water in a climate such as the Mediterranean, basically a two season climate of summer sun and winter rains, any water wasted during the summer doesn't come back until the winter and winter rains can be sporadic.

Sure, wasting water in England or Ireland is a moot point, as they have all the rainwater they need, but as you get further south into hotter and drier climes, the situation changes.

Just as the people of Southern California and Arizona how important water is. The Colorado River in America now runs dry to the Gulf of California. There are now battles between the Southwestern US states to try to get the water from that river and its reservoirs.

If Southern France didn't have water issues, they wouldn't have rationing of water like the hotel owner told me. Personally I would rather water for drinking than for showering at the beach when you can shower at the hotel.

Besides, if water is so abundant and cheap in France, then why can't I find any *&$# water fountains where I can get water for free throughout the city? In the US, every mall, store, gas station, grocery store, etc... has a water fountain with cold water that you can get and it's free.

Get priorities straight. If water is so free and abundant, then don't charge for it in your restaurants. If it isn't so abundant, then don't have beach showers every 20 feet.

bpajax

This entire thread is incredibly annoying.

Mahya2

What we have here is an American Logos. Nuf said.

bkluvsNola

"This entire thread is incredibly annoying."

Then why are you bothering to post?

lola618

I have seen showers at beaches in the US. At least in NY and they are not there for the European tourists. Not too many people come to NY for the beaches.

What I find annoying about this thread is what I find annoying about many threads. Someone saying "why does xxx country do this? They don't do that where I'm from."

Isn't that part of the joy of travel? That people don't do things in the same way it's done where you're from?

bozama

We have free showers at some beaches here in Canada, lakes etc.. ( our seas a bit too cold to swim in , LOL).

This has nothing to do with Europe at all bkluvsNola, evidently you have not been to many places in my coutry or your own country for that matter to assume that all beaches in States are shower free. In Hawaii most hotels have beach showers outside , and yes, they are free.

Maybe you need to travel more in North America before you pronounce something as unique to Europe.

Many people do not own clothes dryers in Europe, they hang their clothes to dry, and I like the the timers and motion sensors on the hall lights in hotels ,and in some bathrooms, great idea.
I have never seen that in my country or yours ( yet) . Also, I think more people use public transport there for commuting then they do in my country. Here most families own at least two cars and use them every day. My relatives in Paris own a car they keep in long term parking and only take out to use to go and visit their daughter who lives out of town , about once a month. Even at 70 they still walk or take metro to get around town, go to doctors appointments, and go grocery shopping.

Mucky

bkluvslola said:
"The argument that it will come back as rain is hogwash."

1st contradiction to that sentence:
"It may come back as rain in England or the Amazon Rain Forest or places where there is a lot of precipitation."

Ah so you agree it does come back !
I suspect your description also means places like France?

2nd contadiction:
" If you waste water in a climate such as the Mediterranean, basically a two season climate of summer sun and winter rains, any water wasted during the summer doesn't come back until the winter and winter rains can be sporadic."

Then you mean it comes back in winter?

3rd Contradiction:
"Sure, wasting water in England or Ireland is a moot point, as they have all the rainwater they need"

So its ok to waste it in England and Ireland then is it?

(I presume you include Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland in that 'England' bit)

Just to clarify.
We are talking about France here not USA not Amazon rain forests but good old France.

By the way, where do you think the rain comes from?

;-)

Muck

Padraig

bpajax wrote: "This entire thread is incredibly annoying."

No, it's not.

If you are annoyed, the responsibility for your state of mind is yours.

But pray tell: what about the thread provokes a sense of annoyance in you?

traveller1959

This is one of those "We Americans are the best and I always knew that those frog-eaters are pigs"-thread.

And a "If you do not share our glorious American chauvinism you have a problem with your state of mind"-thread.

As a European, I feel highly insulted by this thread.

But that is probably the intention of this thread.

This thread even starts to engage my sympathy for flanneruk.

Mucky

"This thread even starts to engage my sympathy for flanneruk."

Now come on Traveller1959 I don't quite think its that bad..lol


Muck

traveller1959

>>>Now come on Traveller1959 I don't quite think its that bad.<<<

It may become that bad if you start writing about foie gras and frog-legs!

kerouac

Hmmm... perhaps we should all examine world water usage statistics and then come back here to discuss the country which uses (wastes?) the most water by far....?