What is a "Carmen" ?
Feb 10th, 2008, 05:06 AM
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What is a "Carmen" ?
I kow ther are many "Carmens" in Granada & they seem to been private residences with nice gardens.
But what exactly determined if a hotel is a Carmen? Location?
But what exactly determined if a hotel is a Carmen? Location?
Feb 10th, 2008, 05:26 AM
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Let's see if I can explain it...in Granada they called "Carmen" a private garden in an urban environment. The property traditionally could be of a single person or a neighbours community but you couldn't see the garden from the street, they have a high wall. Some squares in London that you can see know where also this kind of property during XIX century.
So no, it's not location though they usually are in central zones (well..XIX century central zones), it's the way the garden it's built.
If a hotel is inside a "carmen" it's just because they have made one of those residences a hotel...it is not an hospitality related term.
So no, it's not location though they usually are in central zones (well..XIX century central zones), it's the way the garden it's built.
If a hotel is inside a "carmen" it's just because they have made one of those residences a hotel...it is not an hospitality related term.
Feb 10th, 2008, 10:07 AM
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Hi amsdon,
The cármenes of Granada (and the Albaicín and Realejo districts are filled with them), as kenderina has explained, are private properties surrounded by high whitewashed walls and with an interior garden, in Granada, usually terraced, as they are perched high on the hillside.
In the Albaicín they were owned by Christians who build their villas around the garden courtyards left behind by the conquered Moors.
Now the most stunning of them, the Carmen de la Victoria, has been taken over for use by the University.
Some are comprised of several buildings on different levels set around courtyards filled with fountains, bougainvillea and fruit tress. Most that we saw had a tower.
And some Albaicín cármenes have been converted into restaurants, such as the Carmen de San Nicolás, near the famous Mirador de San Nicolás, where everyone goes at sunset for those unforgettable views of the Alhambra.
We just came back from staying in one, the Carmen de la Alcubilla del Caracol. Our host, an avid historian, purchased this whitewashed villa below his house (also a carmen) and converted it into a small 7 room inn four years ago. The Valencian artist Joaquín Sorolla immortalized it in a painting.
It was simply enchanting, as the luminous rooms have spectacular views of Sierra Nevada, and the entire city of Granada was at our feet. In the terraced gardens, the lemon, orange and grapefruit trees were in bloom. We occupied the tower room with its own private terrace and felt very fortunate to be sharing this special, secluded place.
The cármenes of Granada (and the Albaicín and Realejo districts are filled with them), as kenderina has explained, are private properties surrounded by high whitewashed walls and with an interior garden, in Granada, usually terraced, as they are perched high on the hillside.
In the Albaicín they were owned by Christians who build their villas around the garden courtyards left behind by the conquered Moors.
Now the most stunning of them, the Carmen de la Victoria, has been taken over for use by the University.
Some are comprised of several buildings on different levels set around courtyards filled with fountains, bougainvillea and fruit tress. Most that we saw had a tower.
And some Albaicín cármenes have been converted into restaurants, such as the Carmen de San Nicolás, near the famous Mirador de San Nicolás, where everyone goes at sunset for those unforgettable views of the Alhambra.
We just came back from staying in one, the Carmen de la Alcubilla del Caracol. Our host, an avid historian, purchased this whitewashed villa below his house (also a carmen) and converted it into a small 7 room inn four years ago. The Valencian artist Joaquín Sorolla immortalized it in a painting.
It was simply enchanting, as the luminous rooms have spectacular views of Sierra Nevada, and the entire city of Granada was at our feet. In the terraced gardens, the lemon, orange and grapefruit trees were in bloom. We occupied the tower room with its own private terrace and felt very fortunate to be sharing this special, secluded place.
Feb 10th, 2008, 10:40 AM
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Thanks to both of you for the clarification. I was not sure if it was always a hotel but now I see it is not.
Maribel, I am considering this place for next year. I belive you mentioned it before you left and i bookmarked the website, looks beautiful.
How far/hard is it to get in to the center? Are there any recommended places to eat nearby? I think you said road or parking is limited?
Maribel, I am considering this place for next year. I belive you mentioned it before you left and i bookmarked the website, looks beautiful.
How far/hard is it to get in to the center? Are there any recommended places to eat nearby? I think you said road or parking is limited?
Feb 10th, 2008, 11:41 AM
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amsdon,
It is a truly beautiful, peaceful, sophisticated villa, but the initial approach may scare some people away because it's at the end of a steep, cobblestoned street, right below the Torres Bermejas on the Alhambra hill.
We eschewed the owner's offer of sending a taxi to pick us up at the airport and instead, opted for the airport bus (3&euro
to downtown, got off at the Gran Vía stop and hailed a taxi.
Because it's small and secluded, the taxi driver didn't know where the street (Aire Alta) was, but I directed him to the Alhambra Palace hotel, then down to the Carmen de San Miguel restaurant, where he left us.
We saw the steep incline and thought, oops! another one of those crazy adventures!
But when we rang the bell and entered the garden, the tranquility, relaxation factor and overall beauty of the place overcame our initial apprehension.
The pics on the web site, BTW, really don't do it justice. Walls are covered with fabulous art (family heirlooms), beautiful polished marble floors, classical music played throughout the day, antiques and great artbooks abound-very villa-like.
The very hands on, helpful, sweet owner understands people's hesitation with the location, and that's why he gives such specific instructions:
if coming by car, just alert him to your approximated arrival time, call him when you reach the Hotel Alhambra Palace (a snap, via the Ronda Sur, which circumvents the awful downtown maze), he will come up the hill, take care of the luggage and park your car for you. (He even showed us exactly how he does this.)
When you're ready to check out, he delivers your car to the door and will even drive it up the hill to get you on your way.
As far as getting downtown each day, we just walked down the steep walkway, the Cuesta del Realejo (with railing) to the flat, main commercial street, Santa Escolástica (past art gallery row) and arrived at the Plaza Isabel Católica in ten min.
To go back to our little romantic liar at night, we took the Alhambra minibus 30 or 32 from same plaza up to the Hotel Alhambra Palace and walked down. A good cardio workout.
That said,
it certainly isn't a property for those with serious mobility limitations, although there is a handicapped accessible room on the ground floor. Manuel, the owner, has had one guest who needed a folding walker to rest on when winded but no one wheelchair bound.
I honestly wouldn't stay on the Alhambra hill OR in the scruffier Albaicín with limited mobility.
The downtown hotels are far better for those with difficulty (or an aversion to) walking.
As for dining, there's the Carmen de San Miguel right above the inn, the dining room of the Parador (where we had a nice lunch-renovated will be complete June 15) and the bar of the Alhambra Palace for sandwiches (just so, so, pricey) plus "La Mimbre" below the entrance pavilion to the Alhambra.
But we ended up feasting on tapas downtown at night (the wine bars of the Campo del Príncipe are right down the hill).
Since Granada is the land of the free tapa, and bars try to outdo each other with their copious free nibbles, we found that after a few rounds of wine plus tapas at Cunini, El Oliver (next door, newer, even better) and Puerta del Carmen, we were more than satisfied!
ps.
Taxi ride from the Gran Vía to the Carmen cost 4.60€
Hope this helps to explain.
It is a truly beautiful, peaceful, sophisticated villa, but the initial approach may scare some people away because it's at the end of a steep, cobblestoned street, right below the Torres Bermejas on the Alhambra hill.
We eschewed the owner's offer of sending a taxi to pick us up at the airport and instead, opted for the airport bus (3&euro
to downtown, got off at the Gran Vía stop and hailed a taxi. Because it's small and secluded, the taxi driver didn't know where the street (Aire Alta) was, but I directed him to the Alhambra Palace hotel, then down to the Carmen de San Miguel restaurant, where he left us.
We saw the steep incline and thought, oops! another one of those crazy adventures!
But when we rang the bell and entered the garden, the tranquility, relaxation factor and overall beauty of the place overcame our initial apprehension.
The pics on the web site, BTW, really don't do it justice. Walls are covered with fabulous art (family heirlooms), beautiful polished marble floors, classical music played throughout the day, antiques and great artbooks abound-very villa-like.
The very hands on, helpful, sweet owner understands people's hesitation with the location, and that's why he gives such specific instructions:
if coming by car, just alert him to your approximated arrival time, call him when you reach the Hotel Alhambra Palace (a snap, via the Ronda Sur, which circumvents the awful downtown maze), he will come up the hill, take care of the luggage and park your car for you. (He even showed us exactly how he does this.)
When you're ready to check out, he delivers your car to the door and will even drive it up the hill to get you on your way.
As far as getting downtown each day, we just walked down the steep walkway, the Cuesta del Realejo (with railing) to the flat, main commercial street, Santa Escolástica (past art gallery row) and arrived at the Plaza Isabel Católica in ten min.
To go back to our little romantic liar at night, we took the Alhambra minibus 30 or 32 from same plaza up to the Hotel Alhambra Palace and walked down. A good cardio workout.
That said,
it certainly isn't a property for those with serious mobility limitations, although there is a handicapped accessible room on the ground floor. Manuel, the owner, has had one guest who needed a folding walker to rest on when winded but no one wheelchair bound.
I honestly wouldn't stay on the Alhambra hill OR in the scruffier Albaicín with limited mobility.
The downtown hotels are far better for those with difficulty (or an aversion to) walking.
As for dining, there's the Carmen de San Miguel right above the inn, the dining room of the Parador (where we had a nice lunch-renovated will be complete June 15) and the bar of the Alhambra Palace for sandwiches (just so, so, pricey) plus "La Mimbre" below the entrance pavilion to the Alhambra.
But we ended up feasting on tapas downtown at night (the wine bars of the Campo del Príncipe are right down the hill).
Since Granada is the land of the free tapa, and bars try to outdo each other with their copious free nibbles, we found that after a few rounds of wine plus tapas at Cunini, El Oliver (next door, newer, even better) and Puerta del Carmen, we were more than satisfied!
ps.
Taxi ride from the Gran Vía to the Carmen cost 4.60€
Hope this helps to explain.
Feb 10th, 2008, 12:07 PM
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make that "renovation" will be completed...
Speaking of the Parador, (this is for ekscrunchy), the concierge was kind enough to show us one of the newly renovated superior rooms in the historic convent section. What a transformation! Gone is the heavy, old, traditional Castilian furniture with that monastic look and feel-the new look, sleek and contemporary, in soft, relaxing tones. Completely renovated baths as well.
They've enlarged the alberca (reflecting pool), placed lounge chairs around it and made it into a solarium.
They are still working on the 4 new rooms (all standard), the restaurant/bar (meals are taken now in the breakfast room-only 13 tables, so it's closed to non-guests for dinner, but open to all for lunch, as is the cafetería/bar for sandwiches/salads, installed in the patio.
So yes, for a first visit (or special visit) to Granada, I would splurge to stay here, especially during the International Festival of Music and Dance in late June.
Speaking of the Parador, (this is for ekscrunchy), the concierge was kind enough to show us one of the newly renovated superior rooms in the historic convent section. What a transformation! Gone is the heavy, old, traditional Castilian furniture with that monastic look and feel-the new look, sleek and contemporary, in soft, relaxing tones. Completely renovated baths as well.
They've enlarged the alberca (reflecting pool), placed lounge chairs around it and made it into a solarium.
They are still working on the 4 new rooms (all standard), the restaurant/bar (meals are taken now in the breakfast room-only 13 tables, so it's closed to non-guests for dinner, but open to all for lunch, as is the cafetería/bar for sandwiches/salads, installed in the patio.
So yes, for a first visit (or special visit) to Granada, I would splurge to stay here, especially during the International Festival of Music and Dance in late June.
Feb 10th, 2008, 12:49 PM
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You asked: >>Oh by the way, do you know why it is called a "carmen?" Or does the name Carmen come from this?<<
Apparently it is a blend of Medieval Latin carminium and Arabic qirmiz, (Hebrew- kermes) which designated a garden. So, yes the name has truly survived the ages...
Apparently it is a blend of Medieval Latin carminium and Arabic qirmiz, (Hebrew- kermes) which designated a garden. So, yes the name has truly survived the ages...
Feb 10th, 2008, 12:54 PM
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Feb 13th, 2008, 04:33 AM
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Maribel you got me started now (isn't the internet a wonderful thing? Imagine the time it woul take to find this stuff.
Thanks you again so much for all your inspiration.
http://cvc.cervantes.es/actcult/jard...a/carmenes.htm
Thanks you again so much for all your inspiration.
http://cvc.cervantes.es/actcult/jard...a/carmenes.htm
Feb 13th, 2008, 06:18 AM
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While in Granada, I ate at Carmen Aben Humeya, which was one of the best experiences of the trip.
The restaurant has fantastic views of Alhambra/Generalife and wonderful food.
Their new site has a bit of info on Carmens and the history of the restaurant's buildings.
http://www.abenhumeya.com/
The restaurant has fantastic views of Alhambra/Generalife and wonderful food.
Their new site has a bit of info on Carmens and the history of the restaurant's buildings.
http://www.abenhumeya.com/
Feb 13th, 2008, 12:40 PM
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LOL, Waldo !
We have Carmen from the Bizet's opera based on an old Sevillian history. No one knows if she ever existed.
But Carmen Miranda was not Spanish. She was born in Portugal and lived in Brazil most of his life before going to the US.
We have Carmen from the Bizet's opera based on an old Sevillian history. No one knows if she ever existed.
But Carmen Miranda was not Spanish. She was born in Portugal and lived in Brazil most of his life before going to the US.
Feb 13th, 2008, 01:22 PM
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That's funny Waldo & Kend, my DH saw the post and thought I was also talking about Carmen Electra.
Hmmmm
what's so special about her? I'll bet she was the reason you looked at this post.
ams
Hmmmm
what's so special about her? I'll bet she was the reason you looked at this post.ams
Feb 13th, 2008, 01:57 PM
#20
Hi amsdon,
while we're on the subject of tapas in granada [and there are few better subjects, IMO] down in the centre in one of the little streets off the main square is a "pulperia" - [i think I've got that right] ie an octopus shop. if you like octopus and squid, this is the place for you. tapas and raciones are both available. the bar opposite specialises in Jamon, and another in the same street had very good free tapas.
It's probably just as well i don't live in spain.
regards, ann
while we're on the subject of tapas in granada [and there are few better subjects, IMO] down in the centre in one of the little streets off the main square is a "pulperia" - [i think I've got that right] ie an octopus shop. if you like octopus and squid, this is the place for you. tapas and raciones are both available. the bar opposite specialises in Jamon, and another in the same street had very good free tapas.
It's probably just as well i don't live in spain.
regards, ann
