crozier

Instead of a detailed trip reports, here are a few notes and observations:

1. Biggest surprise ? English is a virtual second language. Most public facilities, trains, etc., give all announcements and other info in English as well as Italian. Most people speak enough English to allow the required communication.

2. I wish someone had explained that the train from Rome airport arrives a long, long walk from Termini main station and that when you get off, there are no signs directing you to the main station. It?s a confusing mess. Once you do find the right way, there are signs at about the halfway point directing you to a ticket office which is closed. And what in the world are those orange ticket counters about? Lastly, I wish someone had explained that you don?t need to stand in line to get internet-reserved tickets. You can get them from those excellent and simple-to-use ticket machines

3. Lucca is a bore. There is nothing to see ? it?s like a quiet suburb of Florence. The much praised city wall looks just like to same city wall that you?d see any many other, and more interesting towns.

4. In contrast, Pisa was surprisingly good. The town isn?t much but the tower, despite the jokes made about it, was an impressive sight as was the cathedral. It wins out over Lucca hands down.

5. Despite the stories, Venice is very easy to navigate. There are signs directing you to major places, and we virtually never got lost. Even without the signs, a good map gets you where you want to go.

6. Venice is by far the best of the three big cities. Florence has all those museums and things, but the city itself isn?t really all that great. And it takes itself far too seriously. Venice is just a place to have fun. Rome is OK. It is simply a big city with some interesting sights. But big cities are fundamentally similar to one another. For example, don?t bother with Plaza de Spagna. The Spanish Steps are simply a bunch of steps. The nearby streets, eg, Via Candotti, have the same fancy shops that you?d see in any big city. And there is little difference between the vapid Roman teenage girls who overrun the place and the vapid teenage girls you see anywhere else in the world.

7. The food was much overrated. We had some good meals, but overall it was more so-so than exceptional - and very, very expensive. The one compensation was being able to have wine with dinner so cheaply ? house wine seldom usually cost 3-5E a half liter. Good wine was only 3E up by the glass. The best stuff was often the simplest ? pizza, cheese, etc. Gelato was vastly overrated, especially Vivoli?s. It wasn?t even close to best we had on the trip. That honor goes to the Lemoncello gelato from some place just south of Plaza Navona in Rome.

8. Taking trains instead of driving was the in the top 10 best decisions I?ve ever made. We sat relaxed on the train, drank espresso and read our guidebooks planning our schedule for the next place. No hassles and it gave us relaxation time that we badly needed anyway.

9. The Rome subway is frightening place. You are packed in so tight that it is scary. If anything went wrong and you got stuck, it would be a nightmare. And the smell! It?s easy to make jokes about Italians not washing, but it isn?t so funny when you are stuck in the subway with them.

10. Assisi is an extraordinary place. I won't describe it because you have to experience it.

11. Went over on American and back on British Airways. BA service is about 10 times better than US carriers. If you have a choice, go BA.

12. We were surprised athow much we bought. Despite, thehigh Euro, it was nick-nack shopping at its best.

13. While we enjoyed the trip, overall, we enjoyed Spain more.

i_am_kane

If I read your comments before I took my trip(s) to Italy, I would never have gone. What a pity that would have been! To each his own.

ChatNoir

I've never seen anybody say Pisa was a better experience than Lucca.

Could you go into more detail?

crozier

"Could you go into more detail?"

Certainly. Pisa has some very impressive sights- the tower, cathedral and baptistry. As Rick Steves says, Pisa is a tourist quicky since you everything is close together. Pisa itself is a rather depressing place. But what is there is worth seeing. Lucca has nothing to special to see and no distinctive quality. As I said, you can find city walls anywhere. You can't find the leaning tower anywhere but Pisa. The duomo in Lucca is decidly minor league compared to Pisa and other places. Plus the Pisa cathedral is one of the few that allows you take pictures.

adrienne

I'm happy you liked Assisi. The frescoes are amazing. Since you seem to be a fresco fan did you get to see the Masaccio frescoes in Florence? They're in the Brancacci chapel and are just as amazing as those in Assisi, although there are not as many.

Thanks for the info on the train from FCO to Termini. I've never taken the airport train but now know what to expect.

kybourbon

There have been many comments on this board about the long schlepp from the arrival of the airport train to the main part of Termini.

There was a thread "What's so great about Lucca?" or something like that a few months ago. We went to Lucca on a day trip that included Pisa and weren't impressed either. I guess I expected the wall to be more like Rothenburg. The town was deserted(dead as you said), the restaurant prices higher than Rome/Florence and we had our worst meal of any trips to Europe. All six of us agreed we didn't get the attraction of Lucca. Maybe you have to go when there are concerts or music festivals.

I find the train travel relaxing also. Since I have to drive so much at home it's nice to just hop the trains and watch the scenery.

I'm probably going to Spain(haven't been before) in July but I can't imagine liking it better than Italy. Italy is my favorite!

mdtravel

I personally didn't find the walk from the airport train to the terminal to be all that bad...guess I was just excited to get there and get on with the trip.

marcy_

In reading your observations, I had to wonder whether you went to a different Italy than the one I've visited.

My impressions of Florence, Rome (even the metro), gelato, and the food were totally different from yours.

I agree with I_am_kane: To each his own!

Maybe it's a matter of attitude?

Nikki

Thanks for some interesting observations. I was also underwhelmed by the Spanish steps and surrounding designer shops in Rome; however I absolutely loved the way the big modern city was built over, under, around and through the ancient ruins. This made Rome the most fascinating place I have ever been.

I agree that Venice is not that hard to navigate. I believe that most of the people who talk about getting lost are actually just wandering around with no particular object, which is very enjoyable in Venice. While you're not really lost, you are not really oriented either, and the places you come across in this manner become delightful surprises.

As far as English being a second language, this seemed more true to me in Venice than in Rome. I encountered more opportunities in Rome to use my Berlitz-tape Italian than I did in Venice, at any rate.

crozier

"I'm probably going to Spain(haven't been before) in July but I can't imagine liking it better than Italy. Italy is my favorite!"

To tell you the truth, we were surprised that we preferred Spain too. From all we read, we expected Italy to be Spain++. Perhaps it was a matter of overly high expectations. There are too many people who are so determined to have a good time on vacation that they repress all the bad stuff. If you listen to most trips reports, everything was FABULOUS and nothing every went wrong. (I remember one person who described a FABULOUS trip and then casually mentioned in passing that she had scraped the paint of the sides of her rental car trying to go down a narrow street.)I'd like to travel with those people since they seem to lead charmed lives. For us mortals, nothing is ever that perfect.

Perhaps it was cost. A top place to stay and sit-down meals for both lunch and dinner in Italy would be cost a fortune. In Spain, we could travel in style (Italy has nothing like the Paradors) and while the food was not exceptional, it was faily good and quite reasonable. I don't doubt that the best food in Italy would surpass what you can get in Spain. We didn't find the food in Italy to be all that much better, but maybe it was because we were unwilling to spend 50E/person for a meal. I live in a big city and I get can get top food of any kind here. I don't need to spend a fortune in Italy. Similarly, I get good gelato at home. That's probably one reason that I wasn't all that impressed with what I got in Italy. Maybe that's really it - there are plenty of Italians and Italian culture where I live. But there are few Spanish immigrants in NA, so Spain really seemed a lot more foreign. (And no, Mexico is nothing like Spain.)

The other thing is that while Italy has a lot more big tourist sights, you start get adapt after a while. The 4th big duomo looks pretty much like the last 3. In Spain, the number of attractions seems just about right for my rate of travel. We found a greater variety of things to do in Spain. Also, no single sight I saw in Italy compares to the Alhambra. On the other hand, there is no place in Spain as exceptional as Venice and Assisi.

Or maybe there is no rational explanation. All I can say is that both my wife and I both found our Spain trip more enjoyable.

PS. It wouldn't go to Spain July. The best stuff is in Andalucia and the heat then will be a major problem.

crozier

"Message: Thanks for some interesting observations. I was also underwhelmed by the Spanish steps and surrounding designer shops in Rome; however I absolutely loved the way the big modern city was built over, under, around and through the ancient ruins. This made Rome the most fascinating place I have ever been."

I suspect that our impressions of Rome were colored by the fact that it was our last stop and we were wearing down by then. Even a Rome advocate would agree that Rome is a place where you need all your strength! It would be a muchg better strategy to start there while you are fresh.

Singletail

Thank you for posting your report. It is always useful to hear someone else's opinion about a place.

I am continually amazed that people who have traveled cannot understand why not everyone shares their particular view of a place )or had the EXACT SAME experience) and then snidely dismisses the comments with, "To Each His Own."
And I think it is shortsighted to rely totally on the opinions expressed on this, or any other board, to make decisions about whether or not to visit a place.

bobthenavigator

Crozier, I can understand some of your frustrations---been there done that.

Let me suggest that your experience was not totally atypical for first time visitors who concentrate in the 3 major art cites--too many people and too expensive. I am easily frustrated by big crowds and long lines.

But, you have not seen Italy yet. Your comments about Assisi are are spot on. To me, the magic of Italy is found in the hill towns of Tuscany and Umbria, the Cinque Terre, the Lakes, the Dolomites, and Amalfi coast. I never set foot in Rome until my 8th trip, but then we spent a week. We had only spent a day in Venice until our 10th trip--then we spent a week.

After 4 trips to Spain I still prefer Italy, just not the crowds in the major art cities during season. Try the Lakes and Dolomites next.

crozier

"Let me suggest that your experience was not totally atypical for first time visitors who concentrate in the 3 major art cites--too many people and too expensive. I am easily frustrated by big crowds and long lines."

The only problem with your explanation is that we never encountered any long lines. We walked in the Vatican museum, St Mark's Basicilica, Uffizi etc without ever waiting more han 5-10 minutes - usually less. The crowds, in early May, weren't all that bad.