Sorry to lower the tone of the discussion, but do (western/ central) European hotels usually have toilets in the lobby or near their dining or breakfast rooms? Apart from the obvious convenience for guests, accessable 'public' toilets may also come in handy for when a group returns to the hotel and for the needy passer-by (providing he or she is discreet). My European experience was some time ago and then mainly at hostels and at the bottom end (no pun intended) of the hotel scene, but I would imagine that such facilities would be required for higher rating establishments at least. Please don't tell me Europeans are not as 'civilised' as other parts of the world.

Really??!!

What we have here is a failure to communicate. Are you saying that you expect a hotel like say the Savoy to maintain a public loo for anyone who saunters in off the street?

Large hotels with public restauarants or those that hold public events obviously have public rest rooms.

However, smaller, older hotels with a fairly small number of rooms and no restaurant often do not have facilities for the general public. (If you think about it, why should they?) Guests obviously have the facilities in their own rooms.

People looking for facilities open to the public are much more likely to find them in a cafe or restaurant - or even a large store - that needs to provide them for guests of shoppers.

Yes, really. Perhaps what we have here is a failure to read the question. Forget the needy passer-by if that's what upsets you.

Certainly they do! I mean large hotels like Hiltons and such. Yjey are often just off the lobby somewhere. Just wander in and look like you are a guest at the restaurant or at a conference.

i would just bring a catheter everytime you travel to europe.

I have been in the lobby restroom of the Georges V. It is lovely.

A typical European hotel, in my experience, can have a very small lobby that does not have the bars and restaurants that the above mentioned "Hilton" would have. Those small lobbies also make "wandering around" to look for a facility not much of an option, as one is quite conspicuous in the small space. I suggest stopping in one of the fast-food restaurants that are becoming more numerous in Europe----they have public facilities.

What happens if you just walk into the George V? I'm fine with walking into a business-class hotel (like say Hilton or Radisson or whatever), but I've not had the nerve to do this for a Four Seasons.

Some of the fast-food chains, however, require that you be a customer in order to use the facilities. Ditto for bars and cafés.

it has been my experience that most western/central hotels have outhouses, as the europeans have not caught up with the civilized world when it comes to plumbing.

farrermog: i highly recommend you limit your travels to more up to areas within the united states. better safe than sorry

sorry - make that "up to date areas like the us..."

Well, since I am a goofy person and don't think I can pull anything off with élan, I walked up to the reception desk, and said, "I've always wanted to see the hotel. May I look around the lobby?"

"Of course, Madam, please."

Since there is a restaurant, a lounge, and more, it was pretty simple. Obviously people can come there to use the lounge or restaurant that aren't hotel guests. I think a Michelin starred restaurant is there. But since I was intimidated, I asked. No problem.

I often go into larger hotel lobbies when there is no other place around with a likely restroom. A very polite, "Please, may I use your restroom?" has never been turned down.

Of course, I am a civilized looking middle aged woman, so why throw me out? When I was uncivilized young girl, it may not have worked.

Most hotels with a bar will have a restroom and they don't have to be Hiltons or business type hotels. The Art Hotel in Florence has groovy modern art shows hung all over the lobby, bar and lounge area. We have gone in there a few times. It's a pretty swank place but no one seems to mind us.

In Venice, any of the fancy large hotels that have a bar or restaurant will have a bathroom. I know from experience.

Thanks for the constructive replies. I don't know that I'd even think of trying the Savoy or the Ritz (perhaps the backpack would be a giveaway!), but I know that in my part of the world it isn't a big deal if you are reasonably dressed and discreet. And as far as being a hotel guest is concerned, it would obviously be useful for a family group sharing one room to know that access to another toilet/ restroom/ bathroom, call it what you will, is available if required. As I've been reminded here, that would likely be the case if the hotel has a public restaurant or bar.

This is one of the reasons that I strongly advise dressing reasonably well when one travels. If you are dressed like the people you see going into or out of a hotel (and only the larger, better hotels will have public toilets) you have no worries about being stopped. In Mom Jeans, white running shoes, and an "I'm with Stupid" sweatshirt, you have an excellent chance of meeting hotel security. This applies in the US as well as Europe.

No toilet in a privately-owned establishment such as a hotel is a "public" one..perhaps that is why the OP keeps talking about "being discrete" when trying to use one in a hotel lobby.

I never realized that providing a convenient toilet for people who are in a hotel lobby other than just to take a pee equates with "civilization" but you learn something new every day.

Farrermog, perhaps now you know why Europeans sometimes duck into an alley and take their pees there.

>>>Mom Jeans<<<

What are Mom jeans?

The reality is that in any medium to large sized hotel which has a restaurant will almost always have loos and when I have to go, if I see such a hotel, I go right in an dlook...if I'm stopped I'll say I'm looking for the restaurant and usually that does the trick...and you know what...most of the time I am wearing blue jeans, a t shirt and white sneakers and never yet have I been thrown out or denied looking for the restaurant.

Also bear in mind that in many loos in Europe, there is a dragon lady waiting to gobble up some small change for using the facility.

"What are Mom jeans?"