Tips on Swiss trip
Jan 14th, 2004, 12:02 PM
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 510
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tips on Swiss trip
My wife and I live in the Bay Area of San Francisco and are planning a trip to Switzerland and Portugal beginning around May 20, 2004. The idea is to have my 83-years old father from Goa, India, join us in Zurich. We plan to spend about 3 days in Switzerland and 5 in Portugal.
I would like to hear ideas about how best to give my father a flavour of Switzerland in these 3 days. We will be starting out in Zurich which will be our base (we intend to stay at the Baur au Lac or the Widder). Our constraint is my father's age, which rules out long walking, climbing or any other physically strenuous activity. My guess is that day trips on train from Zurich to points of interest would be ideal.
I would like to solicit ideas (Cicerone, I would value your input) about possible sites and cities to do and an optimal plan.
I would like to hear ideas about how best to give my father a flavour of Switzerland in these 3 days. We will be starting out in Zurich which will be our base (we intend to stay at the Baur au Lac or the Widder). Our constraint is my father's age, which rules out long walking, climbing or any other physically strenuous activity. My guess is that day trips on train from Zurich to points of interest would be ideal.
I would like to solicit ideas (Cicerone, I would value your input) about possible sites and cities to do and an optimal plan.
Jan 14th, 2004, 02:31 PM
#2
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,019
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hmm. Interesting question. How familiar are you with Swiss mountain transportation systems?
The reason I ask is that some of them get up to highere altitudes than might be advisable for your father. He might be fine, but I would assume that an 83 year old man might be at more risk at 11,000 feet than a 23 year old man.
From Zürich, the mountains south of Interlaken are a little over 3 hours away. You can get greatr views from either Wengen or Mürren without being extremely high - less than 5,000 feet elevation.
From Zürich, Luzern is not very far, and Mount Pilatus is quite a steep, spectacular climb in a mountain train.
Luzern itself is a pleasant place to visit.
Another place near Luzern are the Falls of the Rhineriver near Schaffhausen.
I am sure that Gray Line tours or an equal company could provide an escorted tour of the area that would take you to the scenic places and supply convenient transportation.
The reason I ask is that some of them get up to highere altitudes than might be advisable for your father. He might be fine, but I would assume that an 83 year old man might be at more risk at 11,000 feet than a 23 year old man.
From Zürich, the mountains south of Interlaken are a little over 3 hours away. You can get greatr views from either Wengen or Mürren without being extremely high - less than 5,000 feet elevation.
From Zürich, Luzern is not very far, and Mount Pilatus is quite a steep, spectacular climb in a mountain train.
Luzern itself is a pleasant place to visit.
Another place near Luzern are the Falls of the Rhineriver near Schaffhausen.
I am sure that Gray Line tours or an equal company could provide an escorted tour of the area that would take you to the scenic places and supply convenient transportation.
Jan 14th, 2004, 02:33 PM
#3
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,019
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OOPS. Near Zürich for the Falls of the Rhine River. Not Luzern.
One other thought, is a rental car possible? Several of you going by train would be more costly than taking a rental car for the day.
And from experience, I know a car gives more options and convenience.
One other thought, is a rental car possible? Several of you going by train would be more costly than taking a rental car for the day.
And from experience, I know a car gives more options and convenience.
Jan 15th, 2004, 04:11 AM
#4
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,345
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi agtoau,
What a wonderful gift for you and your father -- some time together in a spectacular place. Here's what I thought for your Swiss portion.
If you stay in Zurich (more on this below!), you could take a cruise around Lake Zurich to the city of Rapperswil -- a delightful and relaxing way to see some scenery. Rapperswil is a very picturesque smallish town with a nice lakeside square. I think you all would enjoy a day there. Other easy outings would be the town of Zug on its lake, St. Gallen, or Schaffhausen -- though I personally haven't been to these three.
I wonder if you would consider basing yourself in Luzern? It's only an hour from the Zurich airport (by direct train in the airport's basement), and its scenery is spectacular, with mountains spilling right into the lake. There are several five-star hotels right at the lakeside, giving you a dramatic front-row seat of the view. From Luzern, you can easily get to its nearby peaks of Riti, Titlis, and Pilatus, and you can also spend a leisurely day riding ferries all over the lake to the villages of Weggis, Vitznau, and Brunnen. In all, Luzern would give you a more "Swiss" feeling than Zurich would.
For more information, you can check out www.luzern.org or www.lakelucerne.ch. For rail schedules and timetables, go to www.rail.ch.
Let me know if I can help further.
s
What a wonderful gift for you and your father -- some time together in a spectacular place. Here's what I thought for your Swiss portion.
If you stay in Zurich (more on this below!), you could take a cruise around Lake Zurich to the city of Rapperswil -- a delightful and relaxing way to see some scenery. Rapperswil is a very picturesque smallish town with a nice lakeside square. I think you all would enjoy a day there. Other easy outings would be the town of Zug on its lake, St. Gallen, or Schaffhausen -- though I personally haven't been to these three.
I wonder if you would consider basing yourself in Luzern? It's only an hour from the Zurich airport (by direct train in the airport's basement), and its scenery is spectacular, with mountains spilling right into the lake. There are several five-star hotels right at the lakeside, giving you a dramatic front-row seat of the view. From Luzern, you can easily get to its nearby peaks of Riti, Titlis, and Pilatus, and you can also spend a leisurely day riding ferries all over the lake to the villages of Weggis, Vitznau, and Brunnen. In all, Luzern would give you a more "Swiss" feeling than Zurich would.
For more information, you can check out www.luzern.org or www.lakelucerne.ch. For rail schedules and timetables, go to www.rail.ch.
Let me know if I can help further.
s
Jan 16th, 2004, 01:32 AM
#5
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 7,689
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Interesting that you should ask my opinion, Agtoau , as my parents came this summer for a visit. My mother is 75 and is also not a great walker. Below are some suggestions for things my parents enjoyed in the Zurich area, plus some other ideas.
At the outset I would say that if you or your father have never been to Switzerland before, I agree with the suggestion above of basing yourself in Lucerne or the Interlaken area if you primarily want to be in the Alps/countryside. Zurich is a lovely city but unless it is very clear, you will not see the Alps from here, or will you really feel you are out in the countryside even in the suburbs like Rapperswil. From Lucerne or Interlaken, you could use trains to get up to mountain areas, including some quite high elevations with very little walking. I did not go to Lucerne or any mountain areas with my parents as they had previously been to Switzerland and we wanted to concentrate on Zurich an environs.
1. Take the Berninia Express train from Chur to Tirano Italy through mountains, glaciers and passes, and through tunnels and over bridges. A really interesting trip, as you sit and watch the Alps go by in special panoramic cars with huge windows. You can do it round trip in about 7 hours, although it is a lot of sitting (you do get a break for lunch in Tirano for about 2 hours). You can also get up and walk around the train if you get stiff. Another thing is that you have to get an early train (7:30 am or so) from Zurich to get to Chur where the Berninia Express starts. For information on the Berninia Express, go to http://www.rhb.ch. Click on "English" in the upper right corner to get the English version. Click on "Experience Trains" and then look for the Berninia Express. An option to break the trip up would be to return via St Moritz and spending one night there, which would give you more mountain scenery.
2. As noted above, a nice day trip would be to go to Rapperswil, a town at the end of the lake. You can take the ferry down (about 2 hours, you can buy lunch or snacks on board). There is a medieval portion of the town which is very charming, although it would involve a bit of waling, some of it uphill. There is a very lovely rose garden, I am not sure how much will be in bloom in May. There is a castle at the top (now a museum on Polish history of not too great interest unless you are Polish). You can then return to Zurich by train (about 30 minutes) rather than taking the ferry back. The train station is quite close to the ferry pier. Take a look at www.rapperswil.ch, click on the UK flag for the English version.
3. If you don't want to commit to a full day for Rapperswil, you can take the public ferries to various points down the lake. The ferry company also offers 1.5 hour trips around the lake, some with lunch or dinner. You will get great views of the city, lake, alps and surrounding countryside. Take a look at http://www.zsg.ch for schedules. If you want to do it yourself by public ferry, a pleasant trip of about a half hour each way would be to go to either Ruschlikon or Kusnacht. If you are interested in this, I can provide manes of some restaurants very close to the ferry pier in both places.
4. Something I have not yet done but would like to do is take a cruise on the Rhine, esp. the area between Schaffhausen and Stein am Rhein, which is supposed to be very beautiful with lots of little villages. I understand the trip takes 2 hours and you can board either at Schaffhausen or in Kreuzlingen. This might be a good option, esp if you could get off for a period of time in Stein am Rein to see the city, have lunch, etc. Stein-am-Rhein is very lovely village along the river. Take a look at urh.ch which is the website for the ferry operator. The site appears to be in German only, so I could not make a lot a sense of it. You might post a question on this board about this option. It would be relatively easy to get from Zurich to either Kreuzlingen or Schaffhausen by train. It would take about an hour to reach either town from Zurich. Take a look at rail.ch. (Stein am Rhein could be a day trip on its own, although this may involve more walking than you want. Many people combine a trip to Stein am Rhein with a trip to the falls at Schuffhausen, but I am not a big fan of the falls at Schuffhausen. I guess Niagara Falls have spoiled me for small waterfalls like that.. .There are also a number of stairs at the falls, and paths with a steep incline.)
4. As noted above, a trip to Mt Titilus or Pilatus would be good. There are organized tours, and I would also imagine there is a way to get there on your own by public transport. Take a look at rail.ch or one of the Swiss Tourism Authority sites like http://www.switzerlandtourism.ch. If my memory is correct, there is not a lot of walking on either, cable cars or railways take you up to the top.
5. You can take a little train from Zurich to Utliberg, the highest point in the Zurich city area. At the Utliberg station, you can walk a little bit uphill for about 15 minutes and be rewarded with the best view of the lake and Alps. I would only say do this on a day which is very clear. If your father can't make that walk, the view from the train station is almost as good as the top, and there are some restaurants here with outdoor seating to enjoy the view. On a clear day, you can see to Germany. The train leaves from the main train station in Zurich and also makes a stop at the Selnau station in Zurich. The ride takes about a half hour. There is a hotel at the top with a self-service and full-service restaurant.
6. Most of Zurich is flat, with a small incline in the area of the Widder hotel and to get up to St Peters and the Lidenhof. (The latter is worth it for the views of the river and the old town.) The Niederdorf/Oberdorf areas have some inclines, but nothing is very steep and some streets have shallow steps so you don?t' have to be on the incline.
7. Zurich has some very good museums, especially the Reitburg and the Kuntzhaus for art. The National Museum near the main train station is also very interesting. My parents really enjoyed the ceramics and porcelain exhibit at the ZUNFTHAUS ZUR MEISEN as well as a walk through the Rathaus (old town hall). Both are in lovely old buildings which can be seen in 1-2 hours. (Stairs in both.) Take a look at the "Destinations" guide for details, click in "Destinations" above and scroll down to Europe/Swizterland/Zruich. The latter two museums are in the old town along the river, not far from the Widder or the Baur au Lau. A good tour would be to get to the Munsterhof in the morning (esp on a sunny day) to see the Chagall windows, and then go to the Zunfthaus zur Meisen which is next door and/or the Rathaus which is across the river. Both can be combined with a walk of the old town on both sides of the river.
8. There are concerts in the evenings at some churches, including choral performances, or at the Tonhalle or Opera house. Check you?re your hotel or take a look at www.whatsonwhen.com/pages/zurich.jml or http://www.zuerich.com/events/index
9. There is a farmer's market every Tuesday and Friday in Burkliplatz, which is right next to the Baur au Lau. Starts at about 7 am and goes to 10:30 or so. Kind of fun to walk around in the morning seeing what is on offer, you can also get croissants and coffee. There is also a flea market there on Saturdays. The platz overlooks the lake and you can go across the street and walk along the esplanade for good views.
Note that May willl be on the cool side, with temps in the mid-60s and there is a good chance of rain. Temps in mountain areas will be 5-10 degrees or so cooler
At the outset I would say that if you or your father have never been to Switzerland before, I agree with the suggestion above of basing yourself in Lucerne or the Interlaken area if you primarily want to be in the Alps/countryside. Zurich is a lovely city but unless it is very clear, you will not see the Alps from here, or will you really feel you are out in the countryside even in the suburbs like Rapperswil. From Lucerne or Interlaken, you could use trains to get up to mountain areas, including some quite high elevations with very little walking. I did not go to Lucerne or any mountain areas with my parents as they had previously been to Switzerland and we wanted to concentrate on Zurich an environs.
1. Take the Berninia Express train from Chur to Tirano Italy through mountains, glaciers and passes, and through tunnels and over bridges. A really interesting trip, as you sit and watch the Alps go by in special panoramic cars with huge windows. You can do it round trip in about 7 hours, although it is a lot of sitting (you do get a break for lunch in Tirano for about 2 hours). You can also get up and walk around the train if you get stiff. Another thing is that you have to get an early train (7:30 am or so) from Zurich to get to Chur where the Berninia Express starts. For information on the Berninia Express, go to http://www.rhb.ch. Click on "English" in the upper right corner to get the English version. Click on "Experience Trains" and then look for the Berninia Express. An option to break the trip up would be to return via St Moritz and spending one night there, which would give you more mountain scenery.
2. As noted above, a nice day trip would be to go to Rapperswil, a town at the end of the lake. You can take the ferry down (about 2 hours, you can buy lunch or snacks on board). There is a medieval portion of the town which is very charming, although it would involve a bit of waling, some of it uphill. There is a very lovely rose garden, I am not sure how much will be in bloom in May. There is a castle at the top (now a museum on Polish history of not too great interest unless you are Polish). You can then return to Zurich by train (about 30 minutes) rather than taking the ferry back. The train station is quite close to the ferry pier. Take a look at www.rapperswil.ch, click on the UK flag for the English version.
3. If you don't want to commit to a full day for Rapperswil, you can take the public ferries to various points down the lake. The ferry company also offers 1.5 hour trips around the lake, some with lunch or dinner. You will get great views of the city, lake, alps and surrounding countryside. Take a look at http://www.zsg.ch for schedules. If you want to do it yourself by public ferry, a pleasant trip of about a half hour each way would be to go to either Ruschlikon or Kusnacht. If you are interested in this, I can provide manes of some restaurants very close to the ferry pier in both places.
4. Something I have not yet done but would like to do is take a cruise on the Rhine, esp. the area between Schaffhausen and Stein am Rhein, which is supposed to be very beautiful with lots of little villages. I understand the trip takes 2 hours and you can board either at Schaffhausen or in Kreuzlingen. This might be a good option, esp if you could get off for a period of time in Stein am Rein to see the city, have lunch, etc. Stein-am-Rhein is very lovely village along the river. Take a look at urh.ch which is the website for the ferry operator. The site appears to be in German only, so I could not make a lot a sense of it. You might post a question on this board about this option. It would be relatively easy to get from Zurich to either Kreuzlingen or Schaffhausen by train. It would take about an hour to reach either town from Zurich. Take a look at rail.ch. (Stein am Rhein could be a day trip on its own, although this may involve more walking than you want. Many people combine a trip to Stein am Rhein with a trip to the falls at Schuffhausen, but I am not a big fan of the falls at Schuffhausen. I guess Niagara Falls have spoiled me for small waterfalls like that.. .There are also a number of stairs at the falls, and paths with a steep incline.)
4. As noted above, a trip to Mt Titilus or Pilatus would be good. There are organized tours, and I would also imagine there is a way to get there on your own by public transport. Take a look at rail.ch or one of the Swiss Tourism Authority sites like http://www.switzerlandtourism.ch. If my memory is correct, there is not a lot of walking on either, cable cars or railways take you up to the top.
5. You can take a little train from Zurich to Utliberg, the highest point in the Zurich city area. At the Utliberg station, you can walk a little bit uphill for about 15 minutes and be rewarded with the best view of the lake and Alps. I would only say do this on a day which is very clear. If your father can't make that walk, the view from the train station is almost as good as the top, and there are some restaurants here with outdoor seating to enjoy the view. On a clear day, you can see to Germany. The train leaves from the main train station in Zurich and also makes a stop at the Selnau station in Zurich. The ride takes about a half hour. There is a hotel at the top with a self-service and full-service restaurant.
6. Most of Zurich is flat, with a small incline in the area of the Widder hotel and to get up to St Peters and the Lidenhof. (The latter is worth it for the views of the river and the old town.) The Niederdorf/Oberdorf areas have some inclines, but nothing is very steep and some streets have shallow steps so you don?t' have to be on the incline.
7. Zurich has some very good museums, especially the Reitburg and the Kuntzhaus for art. The National Museum near the main train station is also very interesting. My parents really enjoyed the ceramics and porcelain exhibit at the ZUNFTHAUS ZUR MEISEN as well as a walk through the Rathaus (old town hall). Both are in lovely old buildings which can be seen in 1-2 hours. (Stairs in both.) Take a look at the "Destinations" guide for details, click in "Destinations" above and scroll down to Europe/Swizterland/Zruich. The latter two museums are in the old town along the river, not far from the Widder or the Baur au Lau. A good tour would be to get to the Munsterhof in the morning (esp on a sunny day) to see the Chagall windows, and then go to the Zunfthaus zur Meisen which is next door and/or the Rathaus which is across the river. Both can be combined with a walk of the old town on both sides of the river.
8. There are concerts in the evenings at some churches, including choral performances, or at the Tonhalle or Opera house. Check you?re your hotel or take a look at www.whatsonwhen.com/pages/zurich.jml or http://www.zuerich.com/events/index
9. There is a farmer's market every Tuesday and Friday in Burkliplatz, which is right next to the Baur au Lau. Starts at about 7 am and goes to 10:30 or so. Kind of fun to walk around in the morning seeing what is on offer, you can also get croissants and coffee. There is also a flea market there on Saturdays. The platz overlooks the lake and you can go across the street and walk along the esplanade for good views.
Note that May willl be on the cool side, with temps in the mid-60s and there is a good chance of rain. Temps in mountain areas will be 5-10 degrees or so cooler
Jan 17th, 2004, 04:42 AM
#6
Guest
Posts: n/a
Hi, agtoau. Cicerone and S' have supplied you with wonderful ideas. I'll just mention that Stein-am-Rhein is a virtual museum of exterior frescos-- amazing painted buildings. I hesitated to suggest it because I remember a bit of a walk from the train station, but C's suggestion of arriving there by boat from Schaffhausen is an excellent idea.
Rapperswil is very interesting, too. Just a thought, and Cicerone can probably answer this -- I remember that the train route from Rapperswil to Lucerne via Arth Goldau passes through some very lovely countryside. I cannot recall the name of the line, but it passes through Sattel and Biberbrugg. It might be possible to enjoy a day of rides -- first a train from Zurich to Rapperswil, (a bit of a look around), then the train to Lucerne, a boat ride on its lake? and then back to Zurich by train. As I said, I have not tested my idea, but it is one way of seeing that gorgeous country from Switzerland's superior transportation system. (Or, if you decide to stay in Lucerne, you could just daytrip to Rapperswil via that same railroute.)
Venturing farther afield, I did enjoy a daytrip to Altdorf (of Willem Tell fame) just below Lucerne's lake. Cannot recall, though, how much of a walk it was from the station to the town square.
I think we've probably given you more thoughts than you'll have time to explore. I hope you all have a wonderful time. J.
Rapperswil is very interesting, too. Just a thought, and Cicerone can probably answer this -- I remember that the train route from Rapperswil to Lucerne via Arth Goldau passes through some very lovely countryside. I cannot recall the name of the line, but it passes through Sattel and Biberbrugg. It might be possible to enjoy a day of rides -- first a train from Zurich to Rapperswil, (a bit of a look around), then the train to Lucerne, a boat ride on its lake? and then back to Zurich by train. As I said, I have not tested my idea, but it is one way of seeing that gorgeous country from Switzerland's superior transportation system. (Or, if you decide to stay in Lucerne, you could just daytrip to Rapperswil via that same railroute.)
Venturing farther afield, I did enjoy a daytrip to Altdorf (of Willem Tell fame) just below Lucerne's lake. Cannot recall, though, how much of a walk it was from the station to the town square.
I think we've probably given you more thoughts than you'll have time to explore. I hope you all have a wonderful time. J.
Jan 17th, 2004, 04:46 AM
#7
Guest
Posts: n/a
p.s. (sorry about that.) If you stay in Lucerne, there is a gorgeous rail route via the Brunigpass to Brienz, a pretty little town on its own lake with a spectacular view of the mountains on the other side. Brienz is a wood-carving center, heavily touristed, but maybe in May on a weekday it might show you some of its original charm.
There is a lakeboat option there, as well, and the scenery is gorgeous. J.
There is a lakeboat option there, as well, and the scenery is gorgeous. J.
Jan 18th, 2004, 02:00 PM
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 510
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Cicerone, I don't know just how to thank you for the wealth of ideas you have disbursed. Next time you are in Goa, I shall arrange for you to have a meal on me at The Mandovi's Riorico restaurant. They make excellent Goan fish preparations as well as good ol' Goan classics like Chicken Cafreal, Chicken Xacuti and Chicken Balchao.
To Bob Brown, swandav2000, and jmv: thank you all very much, for your thoughtful responses. I have now a lot of ideas with which to plan my trip.
One additional question: the Luzern Palace hotel is the best rated in that town, but I have heard/read murmers that the rooms are in need of repair. Is this true? What about the other options in Luzern like the Schweizerhof, The Grand Hotel and The Hotel?
To Bob Brown, swandav2000, and jmv: thank you all very much, for your thoughtful responses. I have now a lot of ideas with which to plan my trip.
One additional question: the Luzern Palace hotel is the best rated in that town, but I have heard/read murmers that the rooms are in need of repair. Is this true? What about the other options in Luzern like the Schweizerhof, The Grand Hotel and The Hotel?
