OK. I just reserved a car through Enterprise, a full-size minivan for about $600 (Monday a.m. through Friday p.m.) I will continue to look for a better rate but in the meantime I have this. We will pick it up from Heathrow and return it to Heathrow. My husband thinks we should rent a vehicle with automatic transmission, so that may account for the higher rental rate. And this way we will have 3 additional drivers if my husband needs a break.

Now, I have to begin at square one figuring out where I should go in the Cotswolds for three nights. I still want to walk two of the three days. I loved the idea of walking through the Slaughters and visiting Stow-on-the-Wold. Should we stay in Bourton-on-the-Water? Any other suggestions? How about Broadway for one night? I need to go back to my books and look at some of the villages and what type of rooms are available since we need at least 3 doubles or 2 triples.

Please don't abandon me now!!! I need your suggestions and ideas.

Are you arriving at LHR, then staying in London, then going back to LHR to get car and continue on the driving portion of your trip, and then returning the car to LHR and flying out of there? If so, that's what we are doing (our driving is a bit longer than yours) and we have decided to contact justairports. They are a car service that will pick us up at LHR (to be driven to our B&B in Bayswater area) and then take us back to LHR (from the B&B) 4 days later to pick up our rental car. The round trip looks to be about 54 pounds. (Then also like you we are staying our last night near LHR before early early flight so will return the car to LHR, spend the night, and catch plane.)

All that to say check out justairports for service from LHR to London rooms and then back to LHR to get car. I haven't actually used them yet but they come MOST highly recommended and it is our plan this trip. Cheaper than HEX or taxi and more convenient than/worth the extra cost over the Tube this time.

That is great. Things will be MUCH easier w/ a car. And yes, an automatic will cost quite a bit more than a stick. But I do think you have some confusion about other details . .

"<i>I checked online the other day and it is 14 pounds per person for the shuttle. At the current exchange rate, that is about $125. As I said before, we haven't figured out the Oyster card situation yet, so yes, there is a good chance that transportation on the Heathrow Express is included?</i>"

• Oyster do <B>NOT</B> cover the Heathrow Express -- which is the very VERY most expensive way to get to/from LHR. Oysters are for your travel on the tube and buses w/i the city but not the HEX.

• What sort of shuttle do you mean? The car services I know/use don't charge per person. For 6 they would charge approx £40-£50 to central London for a vehicle that carries 6. That is only £6.5-£8.5 per person. www.justairports.com and www.london-transfers.com/ I used Ray Skinner (London-Transfers) last May for 6 from LHR to St Katherine's Dock which is all the way across London beyond the Tower, and it was only £59.

janisj, after pondering the car situation all night long and consulting others who have done the Cotswolds both by car and by train, I think we are going to return to our original plan and scrap the car idea. I think it really boils down to the fact that we are not comfortable driving a vehicle on the "wrong" side of the road and traveling roads that are much narrower than we are used to. We don't want to compromise safety for convenience and flexibility. I think we will be able to fully experience the natural beauty and charm of the place using public transportation and our feet.

On a different note, thank you for setting me straight about shuttles and car services. I Googled airport shuttles, and that's what I came up with -- a shuttle service that charges 14 pounds pp from Heathrow. I will definitely check out Justairports.

And thanks for the info about the Oyster card. As I said earlier, I have not even started to do any reading about London yet, so when it comes to city transportation options, I still am ignorant. I am trying to count about how many tube/bus trips we'll be making while in London to determine what type of card/pass we should get. I know that London is a huge city, but the last time we were there (1993), we rarely used the tube. We did A LOT of walking. And that's usually how we get around in large cities. But I know London is very different than Paris or Rome, and we will need to rely on mass transportation to get around.

I'll be back later to pick your brains again, but in the meantime, I do want to thank you for trying to convince me about the car and all the other valuable information you've given me.

And Texasbookworm, do enjoy your trip. I hope everything works out well for you.

freberta---you may remember we are planning something similar for next year, so I am reading all the comments with interest. This is great information.

I know the academic types in our group will want to spend a full day (at least) seeing Oxford, and I'm wondering if we should put that part of the trip on a weekend or a weekday? This will be early May. I haven't begun my research on what exactly is there, but we would hope to see inside libraries, and maybe take a walking tour of one or more of the colleges if that is offered.

>>some think it is an ostentatious pile owned by a prat.<<

\/

Lee Ann

Hi, enzian. Glad to hear from you again! You were one of the many people who gave us great ideas when we planned our trip to Switzerland last year. Can't even begin to thank you for your suggestion to stay in Alpiglen. We never would have found it on our own.

We, too, would love to spend more time in Oxford, but because this is a rather short vacation, it has to be a whirlwind tour. It would be interesting to check out some of the colleges, especially since next summer we will be doing the college circuit with my daughter (no big vacation for us in 2011).

I look forward to reading about your trip as it takes shape.

I understand wanting to pack in as much as possible, but please do consider that the Cotswolds is a lovely, pastoral place -- it really doesn't do it justice to be tearing around on a schedule all the time. We have spend a week there on 2 different occasions and loved exploring, getting lost a bit, happening upon a cricket match (where the locals graciously invited us to share the high tea!), etc., etc.

The Badger Inn in Chipping Camden does a very nice tea -- not a fancy high tea, but a delicious normal tea with amazing cakes.

PS - Excellent call to rent from LHR. You do not want to drive in the city of London. Ever. Unless you're a London cabbie and have The Knowledge!

I would also be curious about visiting Oxford on the weekend versus a week day. We will be there in June. I really appreciate reading everyone's comments re: the Cotswolds as we are planning that aspect of our trip as well.

"I would also be curious about visiting Oxford on the weekend versus a week day. "

The only diffences are:
- one or two things in Oxford have slightly shorter opening times for visitors on Sunday, and the working bit of the Bodleian's closed, so possibly the tourist bits are too (bit check)
- One rarely-observed delight of Oxford is that it's a supermarket of Christian liturgies and has Britain's best concentration of outstanding church choirs after London (which puts it close to having the world's second best). From full-fig Latin High Mass, through a number of Orthodox churches, to proper CofE choral evensong, the supermarket's shelves are especially well-stocked on Sundays
- Cheapo railway tickets are available all day Sat & Sun: but ionly after 9.30-ish weekdays
- Museums get a bit crowded on Sun afternoons. Especially the dinosaur displays if it's wet
- The youth drinking scene after 7 pm is at its raucousest on Sats, and least raucous on Suns

That's it, really. The key industries of shopping, pretending to study and handling daytrip tourists don't vary much between weeekends and weekdays.

We've toured in that area a couple of times and you are really doing yourself a disservice by not driving. There are many cute places you will want to stop for a few minutes - or go explore something you see - and you will miss out on those opportunities. Also you are assuming that trains and buses will be on time and that two cabs will always be immediately available - and that's just not so.

I would vote for 2 smaller cars - but if only one person wants to drive then do get some sort of small van.

nytraveler: I don't think 2 smaller cars would work. My step-daughter and her husband would not be comfortable driving on the other side of the road, and neither would I. So that only leaves my husband, who also has some misgivings and apprehensions.

Life is a balancing act, and sometimes it boils down to compromise. In this case, we are giving up the flexibility and convenience of a car but in return we don't have to worry about getting into a car accident because we are not comfortable driving on English roads. We might miss out on a few out-of-the-way sights but at least we will be able to experience the Cotswolds by walking the trails.

I have already contacted a taxi service in Moreton-in-Marsh, and I am working out the details. He has a van and can transport all of us in one vehicle. I am sure it will all work out, and if we run into a problem, we'll laugh about it later.

I spent a couple of nights in M-i-M a few years ago without a car. At that time there was a bicycle rental firm just next to the rail station. Don't know if it's still there, and don't know how you feel about bicycling, but I had a lovely time one day riding through the countryside to visit Hidcote and Kiftsgate gardens. The cycling company provided me with helmet, lock, and printed itinerary for a 30-mile circuit.

Julia1: What a wonderful idea! We are planning to do the Fat Tire Bike Tour in London and I never even thought about renting bicycles in the Cotswolds. My son, who is 13, is not a very good biker (I am actually waiting for him to wake up so I can take him to an empty parking lot to practice), but hopefully by the time we leave in August, he'll be ready to take on Lance Armstrong!

I remember reading about bike rentals in Rick Steves' book. I guess I might have to "rework" my time in the Cotswolds to include a bike rental. Right now I have us walking to Chipping Campden from MIM when we arrive (we get to MIM around noon) and taking a bus or taxi back to MIM for dinner. It might be fun to bike to Chipping Campden and back instead.

When biking in the Cotswolds are you riding in car lanes or are there bike lanes? Also, are bikes allowed on the walking trails? Are there dedicated bike trails? I haven't done any research on this because it really wasn't an option until now, so do pardon my ignorance.

Julia1, thanks for your great advice. That's why I keep coming back to Fodor's.

"When biking in the Cotswolds are you riding in car lanes" Yes. Which is why biking is a really rotten idea for people frightened of driving a car onthe proper side

"or are there bike lanes?" No

"Also, are bikes allowed on the walking trails?" There isn't space to explain the differnce between public footpaths, bridleways and permitted paths. In summary: bikes are sometimes allowed legally, but are almost always unwelcome, dangerous to walkers and devastating to the terrain.

"Are there dedicated bike trails?" Not really There are a couple of signed national bikeways: but significant chunks of them are just ordinary roads with a picture of a bike

"I haven't done any research on this because it really wasn't an option until now, so do pardon my ignorance".
Granted. But Jula T is - for the first time in recorded history - giving lousy advice. Bikes use ordinary roads, which undulate, are mainly lined with high hedges and bend, sharply, a lot. Julia lives here and drives a car: she understands how to bike on roads that are full of traffic in a hurry. People without that prior knowledge are a menace

<b> Cotswolds roads are the very worst places imaginable to learn to live with cars driving on the left </b> Seriously: central London's safer, because cyclists can see us driving, and aren't tempted to ride two abreast. London's also safer because bad cyclists are a danger only to themselves: here, they're a danger to others as well.

If you want to cycle in mainstream SE England, the New Forest is the place. The Cotswolds absolutely aren't.

Oh - freberta: Please PLEASE <B>PLEASE</B> listen to flanneruk. (flanner - I think you have Julia1 who offered this advice confused w/ JuliaT).

He lives there. I used to live there -- and riding on "Cotswold lanes" is one way to make sure you need to use the medivac portions of your travel insurance. Only a very <i>slight</i> exaggeration.

If you are reluctant to drive -- I can only imagine what you'd think of riding bikes after your first local taxi or bus journey. You'd be sharing winding/undulating, hedgerow/stone wall lined roads that are just about wide enough for a car and bus to clear.

And on the wider (though still only 2 lane) roads- the cars will be zipping by at pretty high speed -- in the opposite direction you will be used to.

julia_t here who lives in the Cotswolds (as opposed to julia1 who lives in Oregon) and I totally agree with everytrhing flanner and janis say about riding bicycles on Cotswold lanes.

Thank you for setting me straight about bike riding in the Cotswolds. As you can see, it didn't require a lot of convincing on your part to make me change my mind. If we are apprehensive about driving on the other side of narrow, winding roads, can you imagine how we'd feel about riding bikes on those same roads??????

Again, thanks. I'll pretend this part of the discussion never took place.

Roberta

Hi, Julia1 here, from Oregon. Actually, those of you living in the Cotswolds might want to do the ride first before commenting in such horrified terms. Then you would know what you are writing about.

The ride from M-i-M to Hidcote and Chipping Camden and return was on unclassified roads and farm tracks, and very pleasant indeed. It took about 4 hours at my pottering pace, not including time spent at Hidcote and Kiftsgate visiting the gardens and enjoying lunch (at Hidcote) and cream tea (at Kiftsgate), and was quite easy for an occasional rider of upper-50-some years such as myself, and not frightening at all. There were three short climbs: approaching Hidcote, just after Broad Campden, and leaving Blockley, which were made easier by the 21-speed bicycle I was given.

The route led through sheep grazing land and tiny hamlets, with many stunning views, and was a delightful way to spend a beautiful sunny day.