Can anyone confirm that the pass is good on TGVC trains? Thanks.

I'm guessing that final C after TGV was just a slip of the finger?

Yes a standard eurailpass will cover the TGV, but reservations are required and you will need to make one before boarding. There is a small supplement for the reservation.

Thanks, Patrick. Yup, hand's quicker than the mind! Actually, almost anything is quicker than my 60+ mind.

Yes pass is good for TGVs - but you may have trouble making reservations with passes on some TGVs - EVEN THOUGH seats remain. It's happened personally to me and me cohorts several times now - they say no seats possible for passholders but they can sell us one for normal price - apparently an allotment for passes and reservations on some trains - especially Paris-Avignon-Nice it seems. so reserve as early as possible in France - and have alternate trains in mind (Nice-Paris TGV no available get a Toulon or Marseille one and take local train there from Nice). But this is definitely a problem, at least in peak periods it seems - never heard of this in other countries but is in France. 3 euro to book in France with a pass. Seems can't do in automatic booking machines but have to wait in line - can do at any SNCF - French Railways - train station or at Boutiques SNCF in city centres. You probably won't have a problem but i alert you to the potential ones.

That's interesting. But I was unaware that you need to show a ticket to make a reservation. Can't you reserve a seat and simply say you have a ticket? Just curious.

Meanwhile it's worth noting that when I did a lot of travel with passes, I had the problem on more than one occassion to be charged a lot for those reservations. My problem was worse in Italy for Eurostar trains. Once they wanted to charge me something like 35 euro for a reservation -- insisting that there was an additional charge for taking a Eurostar -- which was clearly advertised as NOT being the case. Sometimes the clerks really don't know what is included and what is not. This clerk refused to sell me a reservation unless I paid the supplement. I went to another window and got someone who knew what he was doing.

Since no one else has raised the question, I will: has vedette carefully confirmed that the purchase of a Eurailpass is a good idea, in the first place?

Since it so rarely is...

Anyone's itinerary - - no less, no more for those of 60+ years - - ought to make use of www.railsaver.com to examine your itinerary for rail purchase advice.

Best wishes,

Rex

Patreek: It's advertised in Eurail brochure you get with the pass that a supplement will be charged to ride 'premium' trains like EurostarItalia, AVE, Thalys, etc. but doesn't say what it should be - if you book thru Raileurope it's $15 regardless of distance, for supplement including reservation - but i admit you're at the mercy of a clerk as it doesn't state exactly what the fee is.
As for showing ticket to make reservation - i don't know about regular ticket but with railpass they write in on the reservation placard "Eurailpass" and i suppose they are also supposed to write in a ticket number or something - rule of thumb has always been you need a ticket or pass in order to make a reservation.
Vedette: note - you must cancel the reservation card yourself in 'composteurs' in stations - date stamping the reservation before boarding the train. I supposed it's no big deal with just a 3 euro reservation card - but would be 6 euro for two folks but could be fined in theory for not doing so - rare would be the conductor who would. But as some trains are on honor-system all tickets bought in France (i believe all but maybe not some online tickets with codes) and reservations must be self-validated before boarding - as on trains without conductors these tickets could then be refunded, if refundable, as unused as they never know if you took the train or not. And have the date written in on your pass before the conductor comes around as he then can fine you and i know that this DOES in fact happen - usually conductor lets you slide but some will fine you - one German conductor who saw a guy's pass did not have the date filled in filled the date in for him and then filled in another of his flexible dates as a 'penalty'.

I second rex's suggestion.

Do you really need a railpass?

I second Rex's suggestion but not his statement that a pass is rarely effective - may or may not be but i can think of oodles of samples where a few trips can pay for a pass - especially country passes like Germany, where you can get a 4-day in one month pass for as low as $135! Or LondonPlus pass or Swiss Pass or ...
Many travelers do automatically think Eurailpass when in fact they are warranted for their plans - but many people taking a wide ranging rail trip - will find the pass a savings - especially for walk-up fares (in France if you pay normal fare and go Paris to Nice and back the $195 p person 4 day in one month pass will be quite a bit cheaper than walk-up fares - now if you care to deal with the hard-to-get and locked in non-refundable non-changeable tickets then no the pass does not add up) not just in money but in ease of use, though this is eroding with the advent of ogbligatorily-reserved trains more and more. But always investigate point-point tickets.
So i wouldn't say rarely though i respect Rex' many posts and his knowledge but i think that statement is just not true - many times perhpas for general travelers but not rarely.

I did specifically say a <i><b>Eurailpass</b></i>.

This might be a semantic difference in what &quot;rarely&quot; means.

My combined Europe travel experience totals 1 megabus trip with 40+ students, 7 solo trips and 17 trips of two or more people, encompassing about 100 &quot;person-trips&quot;.

During that experience, one Rail'n'Drive pass (actually, back in 1992 it was a &quot;FlyRail'n'Drive France&quot; pass) was a good purchase; &gt;U&gt;none of the itineraries (and some were VERY extensive) would have been a good fit (either too costly or too inconvenient to travel by train to the destinations involved) for a <i><b>EurailPass</b></i>.

I wouldn't rule out the possibility that if a thousand passengers board an aircraft each day at XYZ airport (in North America) headed for Europe, ten of them might benefit from the purchase of a EurailPass... maybe? (and half of those are &quot;traveling salesman&quot;, moving through one, two or three towns virtually every day).

I'd still call that &quot;rare&quot;.

We've disagreed on this point before, Rex and I. One thing he fails to think about is that some people don't simply plan an itinerary and THEN say how shall I get from point A to point B? Some people sit down and say &quot;this year I want to concentrate just on Italy&quot; or &quot;this year I want to adventure through a wide range of countries&quot;. Sometimes when it is the latter choice (one which Rex really dislikes, but others of us sometimes love) then the rail pass certainly CAN be and OFTEN is a great advantage. Some people might prefer combining Norway and Denmark, with Italy, and then finishing in Spain, taking lots of daytrips as well as venture from big city to big city. Others may want to stay within a very small region. I've done about 40% of my European trips with Eurail (or multi-country) passes, and about 40% primarily by car. Several others we've done with point to point tickets. I would not say that any of those methods are &quot;better&quot; than the other, until you take into account what the type of trip planned is.

That said, I must agree that many people buy rail passes without ever checking prices and finding out it would be much cheaper to buy point to point for their particular itinerary.

Rex: Sorry i didn't read your post carefully enough - it does change the formula though i still think for many a Eurailpass - especially those under 26 who can buy a 5-day flexipass for as low as $241 (3-country EurailSelect pass) - not to mention the great experience of being a youth and roaming the rails - priceless experience.
and for adults over 25 a typical itinerary may be:
Paris-Amsterdam-Switzerland-Venice-Rome can buy a 5-day 4 country select saverpass for $352 each in first class: compare to normal 2nd-class fares:
Paris-Amsterdam about $100
Amsterdam-Munich about 130 euro on bahn web site = $170
Munich-Switzerland (Interlaken) $100
Interlaken-Venice about $100
Venice-florence-Rome about $50
that's $520 per person in 2nd class - so the first class pass is a great bargain. And though many Fodorites will diss such an itinerary and too wide-roaming, many first-time Euro travelers actually do do such a trajectory - not the rare one but many. Now you could say airlines could be cheaper but then again you must reserve far in advance for cheap flights usually and then you only see airports and not the lay of the land in between. Many folks want to do the train trip and do such itineraries as i outlined above.
to say rare makes it sound like Eurailpasses are a rip-off - quite the contrary in my opinion. Respectively PQB

Well i meant to add again that many people also overbuy passes - often blindly recommended by travel agents and spend more than they would have on point-point tickets.

I'll only take issue with one word. Patrick... &quot;dislike&quot; - - I don't &quot;dislike&quot; the notion of wandering, unplanned. But I do think it is a poor choice for the vast majority of people who have ANY kind of time:money relationship - - and even college kids can and <i>should</i>.

Moreover, I just don't understand the appeal/merit of staying in crappy, overpriced accommodations, when better priced, much nicer places are a half mile away... <i>if you had only done some reading and planning to learn about them</i>!

Planning gives you more time and more money... to put serendipity to good use.

And to PQB... even a 5-day EurailSelectPass is not a <i>EurailPass</i>, as I perceive the trademarked term. And they still sell those big high-priced suckers... for $946, $1338 or $1654 (1, 2 or 3 months).

Buying one of those is tatamount to having a greater interst in seeing the inside of a train... than see ing Europe.

See the movie &quot;Before Sunrise&quot;. Thank goodness - - for the good news: Jesse finally got off the train for a day/night. The tragedy was that he had traveled &quot;all over Europe&quot;... and mostly saw it looking out the window!

Rex, I think you misinterpreted my post. I was never talking about &quot;wandering unplanned&quot; or staying somewhere without reservations even. It wasn't the difference between a &quot;planned&quot; trip and an &quot;unplanned&quot; one. I was talking about the difference in planning a trip that concentrates on one country as opposed to planning a trip that covers a number of countries. In other words the difference between starting with &quot;let's go to Florence, Italy, and Rome&quot; and starting with &quot;let's do a trip BY TRAIN where we can see parts of Norway, Denmark, Italy, and Spain.&quot; I was talking about starting with the basic idea of traveling by train as opposed to starting with the idea of visiting one specific area. I still meant that when doing a trip that involves covering a wide range of countries or cultures that it is still best to PLAN it, including exactly where you're going and where you're staying.

When we did our first three month Eurail Pass trip in 1995 (plus two more months) we booked every night along the way. But the whole plan for the trip STARTED with let's travel by train. That's what I'm talking about.

I did misinterpret. I can only acknowledge that the desire to do this fits nicely into the &quot;rare&quot; category that I allowed for.

As for &quot;dislike&quot; such a trip... I don't know. I might not dislike it... but from my present perspective, I guess it's true - - I would not be attracted to it.

While clearly different, perhaps there is some analogy to the travel - - chosen by a number of North Americans - - to travel across Canada by train (on such a trip, the time ON the train IS the chief attraction, as I understand it - - and I realize that you're not making that assertion about the kind of trip you describe).

I'm not attracted to those trans-Canada train trips either.

Thanks for the civil discourse.

Rex- your definition of a Eurailpass should then be qulaified when you post that it's rarely a good deal - yes Eurail Select Passes are indeed Eurailpasses - and if you're talking about the traditional Eurailpasses the figures you quote are the worst case scenario - you can get a 15 straight day pass for $498 per person - and i can think of many scenarios that would benefit from that (Eurailpass saver) - or a 10 day flexipass out of 2-month period - saver - for $592 p.p. so your quote of $946 and up is very misleading - even those passes - for one straight month in the case of $946 pass could be a great deal and anyone buying those would certainly have weighed the alternatives - if they had good info. Anyway a Eurailpass can well be a great deal - not in rare incidents but often - if going by rail. A EurailYouthpass - $382 for one straight month - your traditional Eurailpass - can and is a GREAT deal for many people under 26. So i respectively disagree with you on this point and you should not use the $946 pass as your base for the efficacy of whether passes are good for you - i would agree that if you must pay $946 for a pass it would rarely be a good deal for most people.

Sorry if you think I provide deceptive figures - - but your references to YouthPasses are equaly inappropriate.

vedette has clarified that the age of the traveler(s) on THIS thread... is over 60 years.

And on Patrick's first reply, the phrase <u>standard</u> Eurailpass was used (my own emphasis added).

No i don't think your reply was deceptive - knowing you and your many excellent well-meaning posts - but a standard Eurailpass was not implied in the OP - it said Eurailpass and today that includes Eurail Flexipasses and Eurail Select pass - i agree that the standard Eurailpass that a decade ago or so was the only passes available are hard to realize the benefit of - i only take issue with your statement that the purchase of a Eurailpass is rarely a good idea - you need to qualify that by saying a one month or more consecutive day pass which few buy - it is not rare for a Eurailpass, in the contemporary sense of the word to be a good deal. I don't know what Patreek meant by a standard Eurailpass - i'm sure he was including the select and flexipasses in 'standard' Eurail as standard Eurail tody must include those. My only argument is that the statement that a Eurailpass is rarely good idea is not good advice for many people. Sincerely.

Hmmm. What did I mean by &quot;standard eurrail pass?&quot; I guess it was a feeble attempt to say that the TGV isn't covered on some passes, such as an Italy or Germany pass?
Or maybe I meant that you don't need a &quot;special&quot; pass to allow for it. It is included on the basic (or &quot;standard&quot; passes).