We're thinking of going to Europe for 10 days in December (we'll be there over Christmas). Do you think that it would be advisable to spend time in Switzerland and then travel to the south of France? Or vice versa? Or do you think that we'd be better off spending all of our time in Switzerland? It'll be quite a group of us so I need to make sure that everyone is happy (if that's at all possible!).
I'd originally thought that we could stay in Bern but after reading the posts on this board I think that's definitely not a good idea. So now I'm thinking perhaps Lucerne or Interlaken? I'm not sure what might be the best city/town to stay in while we're in Switzerland.
Thanks for any advice that you might have!

I think Lucern would be a better choice than Bern but I also think that 10 days there would be overdoing it.

There's a lot to see, depending on your interests, but getting around is easy enough, particularly by rail.

Knowing the types of activities you would be interested in would be helpful.

Think Alsace!

I spent 16 days in France/Switzerland last month, I enjoyed it, but would have cut down the traveling a bit if I could (I was meeting friends in CH otherwise would not have added it on this trip).

for ten days, I'd pick a fairly close geographic area and stick with it. especially with a group.

Considering a large-ish group & 10 days at the holidays, I'd suggest finding one place for the entire time... but one that has easy train connections so the group, or parts of your group could split up and venture out on 1-2 day trips, without having to haul everyone to a new destination each time. Geneva is an easy airport to deal with as a place to land, and it has excellent connections (the train station and airport are connected buildings).

thanks for all of the help so far!
A little more information: it's a group of family so there will be some grandparents, 40 and 50 somethings, 20 somethings, and teens. My family has spent time in Europe as have my grandparents and uncles but my aunts and cousins will be first-timers.
I'd first thought that we'd spend all of our time in one city and then do some day trips but then I thought perhaps we could spend half of the time in Switzerland and then half of the time in one city/town in the south of France.
I think that the message that I'm getting from the posts so far is that we'd be better off staying in Switzerland the whole time?? Would Lucern be a good base or would we be better off at Interlaken or Grindelwald??
I wonder if it would be a better choice to go to Rome or Vienna??
Decisions decisions!

thanks for all of the help so far!
A little more information: it's a group of family so there will be some grandparents, 40 and 50 somethings, 20 somethings, and teens. My family has spent time in Europe as have my grandparents and uncles but my aunts and cousins will be first-timers.
I'd first thought that we'd spend all of our time in one city and then do some day trips but then I thought perhaps we could spend half of the time in Switzerland and then half of the time in one city/town in the south of France.
I think that the message that I'm getting from the posts so far is that we'd be better off staying in Switzerland the whole time?? Would Lucern be a good base or would we be better off at Interlaken or Grindelwald?? There are skiers and hikers in the group so while I hadn't planned on this being a ski vacation it could very well turn into one. Is it possible to hike in the winter in that area or is it too cold??
I wonder if it would be a better choice to go to Rome or Vienna??
Decisions decisions!

Oh no, not Rome!!! (Just kidding, as I've never been, but I imagine any huge, hectic, hussle and bussle major city would be a WHOLE lot harder to manage for a group/family trip.)

I am only familiar with the 'Vaud' region in Switzerland, but it might be ideal for you. It is certainly gorgeous with lots to see and do. Or rent a villa in the south of France? Pretty nice place to celebrate Christmas, non? Although maybe cars would be necessary, where Switzerland is easy to do it all by train.

For Switzerland, I recently realized many towns have their own websites. I visit these three places each trip as I have dear friends there...

www.lausanne.ch
www.montreux.ch
www.vevey.ch

Hi jessica323,

I know it's gonna be hard to please a group, much less a group that ranges in age from seniors to teens, so I really applaud you!!

I wonder if you realize that December is a bit early for the snow-covered villages you may expect in Switzerland? Luzern and Interlaken may have a dusting, but more likely they'll just be wet and cold. You'll have more luck if you head up to the heights like Zermatt or St Moritz; even the villages of the Berner Oberland are if-y until early Feb.

One option would be to stay in Vaud, which is a little warmer than other regions because of its lake (it's called the Riviera of Switzerland). You could stay in Morges (close to Geneva) or in Montreux (one of my personal favorites, and only about an hour from Geneva) and take day-trips to the nearby mountains of Gstaad, Leysin, Villars, and Les Diablerets -- as well as walking the vineyards between Lausanne & Vevey, visiting Chillon, walking the lakeside, shopping in Vevey's old town, etc.

If the chances of little snow don't bother you, you should still head for the mountains, but you'll have the best luck at Zermatt and St Moritz area (Engadin Valley) as I said above.

I think one move in 10 days would be about right for a group like this: more moves and it'll be hard on the seniors; fewer moves and it'll be boredom for the teens.

Unfortunately, the train trips are outrageous, about 8-10 hours from Interlaken, Luzern, Morges, & Zermatt to Nice. But you may want to fly. Check www.whichbudget.com to see the best ways to connect. For instance, you can fly from Geneva to Nice on Easyjet or from Zurich to Nice on Helvetic.

So I guess the easiest vacation would be to spend half on Lake Geneva, then fly from Geneva to Nice. Getting from Zermatt or St Mortiz to an airport will be an additional hassle with long hours on a train, more connections, handling luggage, etc. But Morges will be a direct train to the Geneva airport, and Montreux is one connection to the airport (I think -- it may also be a direct train). You can check the train schedules at www.rail.ch.

I hope this makes sense. Let me know if I need to clarify something or add something --

s

Hi Jessica and s': Is the French Riviera warmish at Christmas? I have no idea, but if it should be cold and rainy, one might just as well stay on Lac Leman (Vaud). There are an incredible number of daytrips possible from any of the places S' mentioned, including Bern and Lausanne, Yvoire (French part of the lake), Gruyeres, Avenches (Roman stuff), and of course the mountain destinations already mentioned, and perhaps even Annecy,south of Geneva. My question, s', is what do the lavaux vineyards look like in December? I wouldn't fancy the walk if they're bare.

What about a split between Lac Leman and Lugano? What do its Christmas temps look like? Or, someone mentioned Alsace--I'd imagine that area of France would be great at Christmas. Well these last mentions are just in case the French Riviera doesn't work out. J.

for what it is worth, Menton on the Cote d'Azur has a microclimate - a bit warmer than the rest of the Riviera - they grow citrus fruit there for example.

also should point out - it's only a fairly recent phenomenon that the Riviera is a summer destination - it always used to be the chic place to go in the winter, especially for the upper class English.

Hi jessica323 & jw,

Yeh, the vineyards are bare. I've been there in Nov and also in March, and there's not much but brown sticks in mud.

And yet . . . and yet . . . I still do it. It's still dramatic, with the brown hills, the blue sky, the gray lake. Here's a link to my pages at igougo, with some photos of the Corniche taken in wintertime.

http://www.igougo.com/planning/journ...orniche+Lavaux

jessica323, I've also been thinking abouat just two destinations in Switzerland -- say Luzern & Zermatt or Luzern and St Moritz or something like that??

Maybe do a photo search at www.webshots.com for these towns & villages to get an idea of the atmosphere.

Let us know if we're off track or what.

s

You have all been so helpful! I really can't thank you enough for all of the help.
Regarding the weather -- it'll be December so I'm not really expecting spectacular weather anywhere that we go. I know that it will be brown and the vegetation will be gone but it's ok. Even if it's cold and rainy that will be fine. I think that December is just an iffy month for weather. We're not going to let that stop us though.
I will say that I chose Switzerland as a possible destination because it's a country that I haven't been to before and I've heard great things about the country and the people and the food.
I like the suggestion of Geneva and then Nice just because I think it might work well for this group. I had been concerned about the issue of transportation from the central or eastern areas of Switzerland to Fance. This might be a silly question but I need to know . . . is Geneva a good city to visit? Will we really "experience" Switzerland?
Does anyone think that it would be ok to spend the whole time in Switzerland?
I'll start investigating a villa in the south of France too. The only thing that concerns me is that perhaps the teenagers in the group would have a better time on their first trip to Europe in Switzerland than the south of France? Don't get me wrong, I love the south of France I'm just a little concerned about the first-timers.
Thanks again for all of the advice!
Jessica

Provence is great fun around Christmas. There are many festivities, and the smallest village to the largest cities have wonderful decorations. Specialty foods abound (check out the chocolates!), and you can take in the local santon fairs, a great way to learn about these charming figurines and/or add to your collection. You will often see the Treize Désserts (13 Desserts) of Christmas: a plate of nuts, dried fruit, and other assorted goodies served with dessert throughout the holiday season.

Hi jessica323,

Well, I don't recommend you stay in the city of Geneva -- get into one of the towns or villages around the lake to get closer to Switzerland. Use some of the websites suze offered to start your investigation; you should consider Montreux, Vevey, and Morges (imho!). I can post a link to some photos of Morges if you'd like -- or do a text search here for my trip report that has a link to those photos.

And personally, I love Switzerland and love to spend all of every one of my vacations there -- I've been doing that since 1995 with a very few exceptions. So I will tell you that, yes, you can have a glorious trip within Switzerland alone. However, I would have thought that the teens would have preferred the Riviera to Switzerland; Switzerland is a sort of staid, old-fashioned place with not a lot of cutting-edge nightlife. Of course, you'll find more nightlife in the cities -- but then you'll sacrifice the charm and scenery that you came to Switzerland for.

What do your teens like to do? Are they active & into cycling, rollar-blading, etc? If so, you should stay in Switzerland. There's all kinds of outdoor & adventure activities -- you can rent bicycles at most train stations, and more and more shops are renting rollar blades. So a stay in Luzern & Zermatt or Luzern & Engadin would be perfect for you -- cycling around Lake Luzern and then cycling down the Engadin Valley would be enough to keep most teens happy, I think!

Best wishes!

s

Hi . . . I love Bern, it will be special decorated for Christmas. Geneva is antiseptically boring.

If you're all taking the train, I would recommend seeing Burgundy and Alsace, very doable in 1 trip, and again, very special places over Christmastime (the Alsace/Lorraine Christmas markets will make everyone smile). Get a little ice skating in, and presto, fantastic vacation.

Provence will still be there -- Swiss chalets and half-timbered Alsacian houses is what you want.

ps -- the Swiss franc is hellishly strong against the dollar right now. You could just do Alsasce/Burgundy & the Beaujolais/Provence instead . . . . .
HTH

I think 10 days all in Switzerland would be wonderful and fits what you describe for family activities.

Per above post, Geneva to Montreux on the train is direct (or at least has been when I've taken it). Returning just make sure you stay on until the terminius, as there is 1 downtown Geneva stop before the airport.

I would not spend time in Geneva. It's a huge, world-class, expensive city. Great place to be sent on a business trip but I wouldn't vacation there. But efficient & organized airport hub to fly in and out of.

As for teens, Vevey is not so dull. I'm older so didn't investigate but there were definitely interesting young people on the streets, flyers up for music and clubs, etc. There's a popular youth hostel right on the town square - you might send the kids there to check I'm guessing they'd have a good handle on what's going on around town.

So... somewhere in the Vaud (as keeps coming up, you'll notice!) paired with one other Swiss town or France (can't help with that).

The great things you've heard about the country, the food, the people... true, true, TRUE!

Hi!

I am glad swandav posted her reply.. I was going to say something similar but didn't want to hear HUMBUG for saying I'd prefer the Riviera if I were a teen...

I do think you'll find more variety and etc on the Riviera. Switzerland is utterly gorgeous but it isn't 'exciting'.

I think you should realize that there are widely varying areas of Switzerland, where even the dominant language is different. I feel the area around Geneva and Montreaux is very like France; at the other end of Switzerland is an area that is very like Italy. In the center, it is very like the best mountain areas of Germany. I think when most people think of Switzerland, they are thinking of the central area. So if you want variety, and ten days is enough to get some variety, I would suggest you stay in the central area of Switzerland, and in France. To this end, I would suggest you try to get open jaw airline tickets, where you land in one destination, but return from another.

I like Bern; it is a fascinating old city, but is actually somewhat removed from the mountains, which I assume is what you want to see. My suggestion would be Lucerne, a wonderfully scenic small city with a cable car excursion you will not want to miss. Based there, you will have access to many attractions. I would recommend Lucerne over Interlaken; Lucerne is an attraction in itself; Interlaken, in my opinion, is more a place to stay between excursions up into the mountains.

You should be aware that many Swiss hotels, particularly in the smaller towns, close down completely during their off season, so you will want to check that when you are doing your planning

Hey everyone!
Thanks again for all of the responses. A note on the teens -- they're 13,13, and 15 (he will have just turned 15) so they're in their early teens as opposed to late teens. That's why I thought perhaps they'd have more fun with Switzerland for now . . .