neckervd

TO PALEN:
The first direct Panoramic Express trains will run up to Interlaken (not yet Lucerne!) in summer 2018.

milestogoneedadvice

Great replies! As for Google, I have googled for hours, googled and read or cut and pasted to documents that I can reread. Googling for a specifics but stumbled on better information for something else I needed, googling more! It is such a help when someone has been there, done that and can give a focus for the google, because at some point it is pretty overwhelming. I know that it will get sorted out, I just need to remember patience.

Thank you for the lodging ideas, I will check out all of those, also the B&B website. There are 2 of us, we are not youngsters, but actively young at heart, we do enjoy the local B&B, we have had great experiences and some that just made good stories! We have stayed in an Ibis, they work. I know that Switzerland is expensive (according to Google). I'm thinking in the $150-180 range for a room would be good. Of course less is better It's always fun to budget and then have a splurge and a really special place.

I have been googling other things and have not focused on lodging, but I will now. We will be in Switzerland the first week of May, I have been trying to google what cable cars, gondolas,etc. are open and the hours of operation. Seemed like a good thing to know

In early posts I was advised that Murren would not be the best this time of year, I have read that Wengen might not be the best choice for the first week of May, stating that the lower areas "wake up" sooner. I will read more about Grindelwald.

I have been googling Gstaad, Berner Oberland, etc. I am will continue my research. I have one question. I have given the biggest block of time to Berner Overland/Lauterbrunnen. Considering the time of year would you recommend taking one of those days off of BO and adding it to the Montreux area or even Luzern??????? I know it's our decision. I want it to be a decision based on the best information possible. Your experience and knowledge, with regard to the time of year, are a valuable resource, any tips are appreciated. I will be working from the information you have shared thus far. I will do my best to find good information that will help me ask better questions, oh my, or maybe fewer questions

Thank you again.

kja

If your plans are still the ones you listed at Feb 5, 17 at 8:04pm, then again, sorry, but your call! There's plenty you can do FROM Lauterbrunnen (etc.) if the weather in that specific area isn't cooperative. And there's plenty to do in / around Lucerne if that's where you end up. I, personally, wouldn't add time to the Montreux area unless you want to visit Geneva or Lausanne -- each of which is, IMO, worthy, but neither of which strikes me as a place that fits the kinds of interests you seem to be pursuing. OTOH, if you wanted to add a day for a day trip from Montreux to Gruyeres, well, I think it would be redundant (the castle there is lovely, but similar to the Chateau Chillon), but it would give you the chance for a visit to the chocolate factory in Broc if you are still interested in that.

May I ask: Do you have a good guidebook or two? In comparison to the cost of your trip, the cost of a guidebook will be nugatory, and you will have a wealth of information at your fingertips. For that matter, you can consult one at a local library or book store.... I'm talking about a good, comprehensive, informative book where everything is in ONE place, with a good index so you can look things up easily and get an enormous amount of information just by flipping from page to page. And with a section on basics, where you can learn the things you haven't even yet realized that you should be asking. ;-) My recommendations would be the Michelin Green Guide or Rough Guide (if not both), but you have a lot of options. I fear that your approach is leaving you without focus. Forgive me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you are caught in the trap of chasing one idea after another, without really putting any one idea in context.... Not a place I'd like to be! Just something to consider....

swandav2000

Hi again,

Whether you have an additional day in the Oberland area or in Montreux really depends on what kinds of things you like to see and/or do.

If you like hiking or walking in the mountains, ascending cable cars and looking out over majestic peaks, taking ferry rides with majestic peaks over you, then the Oberland should have that extra day. One benefit of staying in the Oberland for an extra day is that you'd have a better chance of good weather to ascend the peaks. It's not uncommon for clouds to roll over the mountains and sit there for several days, so having an extra day there can work in your favor. On bad-weather days, visit Thun and its castle, Spiez and its castle, and the historic and amazing city of Bern.

If you like exploring a city, taking ferries or busses or trains to lakeside towns, walking along a lake with majestic peaks over you, all in a German environment, then use that day in Luzern. Plenty to do in town for bad weather, including museums, shopping, etc.

If you want a somewhat more relaxed atmosphere and cafe culture, Belle Epoque architecture (the Swiss Riviera is more similar to the French Riviera than it is to the German-speaking parts of Switzerland), French cuisine, French language, flowers along the lake, vineyards in the hills above the lake (mountains in the distance), then use that day in Monteux/Vevey.

I have some "reviews" (w/photos) of my favorite activities in/from Montreux, but I'm having trouble posting them. I'm actually travelling now, and my tablet is not cooperating. I'll try to get them posted.

Have fun!

s

swandav2000

Ah! Here we go.

Montreux old town
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...reux_Vaud.html

Lavaux
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...reux_Vaud.html

Walks through the Lavaux vineyards
http://static.montreuxriviera.com/ra...679.1466572907

Promenade Fleuri
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...reux_Vaud.html

Morges
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...rges_Vaud.html

Gruyeres
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR..._Fribourg.html

Saanen
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...wiss_Alps.html

Gstaad
http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserR...wiss_Alps.html

milestogoneedadvice

Wow, swandav! That's some googling material! When I opened this up this morning you made me smile. Yesterday was a hard day (personally), and by the end of it I was tired and second guessing myself. You've rebooted me and sent me off to googling adventures. Hope you are having wonderful traveling adventures and thank you for helping me "discover" Switzerland. You rock!

Off to google.......................

milestogoneedadvice

kja
Well, I am in a place with travel planning I have never been, behind. But life's challenges have been out of my control. So I'm doing my very best to catch up. I do have a guide book, but not the two you mentioned. I will pick up one of those to add to what I have. Yes in the end a guidebook is your handy dandy friend! I really really appreciate Swandav and you giving me a leg up on this and helping me get a handle on the planning. I'm reading googling double time, but life has to happen in there somewhere. I was second guessing myself last night.

I will be reading today and enjoying all the things I'm learning as I go. And no matter what, we will savor every moment in Switzerland. Thank you for taking the time to coach, advise, and share with me.

I hope there will be an opportunity for me to share my thoughts with someone who is interested, and give them the focus and boost that you and swandav are giving me.

Off to research, I'll be back to share my next level of planning with you, hope you will stick with me

PalenQ

TO PALEN:
The first direct Panoramic Express trains will run up to Interlaken (not yet Lucerne!) in summer 2018.>

thanks Neckervd! At least Zweissimen change will be eliminated.

kja

To be clear: I wasn’t trying to criticize – I believe there are even more ways of planning a trip than there are people who plan them, particularly because, as you say, life sometimes interferes. My intention was to offer some suggestions that might help you plan, even if you are a bit out of your comfort zone this time. (And if I haven’t already said so, my best to you and yours, and my sincere hopes that you are now in a position to move forward and will find this trip to be the kind of break you need.)

The reason I suggested a guidebook or two is because everything is in one place and so you can get an idea of your options without trying to figure out whether places X and Y are near each other or in different parts of the country, etc. And when I recommended using google, I meant to answer basic questions, such as “what is Wengen” or “what are the hours of the Chateau Chillon” – NOT for trip planning! (I can see how it might have seemed that I was saying something very different, and apologize for that.) Honestly, I can’t imagine using google to plan a trip – way too much information of unknown value and without context! (But maybe that’s just me.)

There is one thought that I would encourage you to keep in mind: There really aren’t any BAD choices for travel in Switzerland, just difficult ones. When I get overwhelmed with travel choices (and I often do!), I try to focus on just one or two really high priorities for each day, and to think of everything else as icing-on-the-cake. As it turns out, I get to have a LOT of icing on most of my trips. ;-)

Hang in there, milestogoneedadvice!

milestogoneedadvice

kja,

You are the exact reason I love the Fodor's community. And you are spot on with everything. Sometimes in the middle of it you can't see the forest for the trees. Thankfully the Fodor's community gets you on track. I did need to be reminded to go back to my guide book again and I will pick up one of your suggestions, a new perspective. We do have funny stories about carrying our guidebook as we travel.

Having input form this community is like calling a friend who can offer advice about something you know they have a passion for, as travel. I love hearing your stories and advice. I'm feeling really good about the itinerary itself, now the details, a little daunting. The forum helped me get focused and remind me of what was important to us.

I can see that you are right, just being in Switzerland will be a win/win! I really do love the planning because I learn so much about the new adventure.

Thank you for your intuitiveness and great advice. Speaking of that..........I'm looking at lodging, Basel, Montreux, Lauterbrunnen, Luzern. I'm reading reviews, looking at locations and all of the usual. If you have any insight, experience, or thoughts, I would love to hear them. Bookstore tomorrow and focus on lodging! Thank you ever so much!

kja

Thank you for your kind words -- I'm glad that you have found some value in my input.

For lodging, again, I urge you to look at booking.com -- you can screen for all sorts of things that matter TO YOU. FWIW, I never use guidebooks for lodging -- too out-of-date by the time the books reach press. ;-)

Here are the places I stayed in 2013, and my TA reviews of them (under the name "kja3"). I can't speak to anything more recent, nor whether they might suit your needs or budget. Again ... you know its coming ... you need to check these things out for yourself.

<b>Basel</b>: Hotel Rochat --

<i>"I spent two nights in a single at the Hotel Rochat in May/June and was very well pleased with the location and service. Near the heart of Basel’s Old Town, the hotel is easy to reach by foot or tram. The hotel consists of a set of interconnected buildings with elevators, but you may need to cross a few stairs to get from one part of the hotel to another. (If mobility is a concern, you would probably do well to contact the hotel to arrange or ensure appropriate access.) My room was well laid out and offered a pleasant view of a courtyard with a vine-covered building. My bed was comfortable, I liked that the towel was a bath sheet (rather than a conventionally sized towel), and I was satisfied with the amount of counter space. Breakfast was excellent, including an exceptionally wide array of both cold and hot foods and a wonderful cheeseboard with six different options. Hotel staff were consistently helpful and welcoming. If I have the good fortune to return to Basel, I hope to return to the Hotel Rochat!"</i>


<b>Montreux</b>: Hotel Splendid

<i>"I spent two nights in a double for single use at the Hotel Splendid in May and thought it had some great features and some not-so-great ones.

"With its wonderful location on Montreux’s waterfront, the little balcony of my room offered a truly wonderful place to enjoy some stunning views, and the views from the bed itself were also amazing! Although I didn’t actually see the sun rise, I could see dawn’s light spread over the magnificent snow-capped mountains across the lake without moving a muscle – glorious! I could hear some noises from the street in the morning, but they didn’t bother me; others might feel differently.

"(One can reach the hotel from the trains station by taking a public elevator. In case you haven’t already seen these instructions: Cross the street immediately outside of the train station and head to the left. Soon – in just a block or so – you will see a walkway to your right that leads to the elevator. At the base of the elevator, turn left; the Hotel Splendid is just steps away.)

"As noted elsewhere, the en suite “bathroom” is not a room – the walls reach only just above the level of the sink. As a solo traveler, I couldn’t imagine, in advance, any reason to object to that arrangement. I never realized how much I value stepping out of a shower into a steamy room – something that did not and could not happen here. I had plenty of hot water at good pressure, but the room was too large to contain enough steam for my comfort.

"I also thought the furniture a bit under par. The legs of the armchair in my room had been twisted out of alignment, so the chair was unstable. Although the room had sufficient counter space, there was no surface at desk height. I thought the bed quite comfortable, although the pillows were a little thinner than I would have preferred.

"The Hotel Splendid is family owned, and the two brothers I met could not have been more welcoming. The breakfast buffet held a nice array of tasty options. (Go ahead -- open the refrigerator behind the counter to reach the platters within!) And I was very pleased to find that the linens included wonderfully large bath sheets, rather than conventionally sized towels. On the other hand, I think some small conveniences, like an electric kettle and safe, would be much appreciated."</i>


<b>Lauterbrunnen</b>: Hotel Staubbach:

<i>"I spent 3 nights in June in a double for single use at the Hotel Staubbach, and have nothing but praise for this gem of hotel and its extraordinary staff! Without exception, the staff were hospitable and helpful, and almost all of them did things that went above-and-beyond the call of duty without being asked -- if someone saw a need, action was taken!

"My room did not have its own balcony (I choice I made when I reserved), but on each floor, the balcony facing Staubbach Falls has a small area that is set aside for guests whose rooms do not have a balcony. This area was small, but the only time I found the one on my floor occupied, the area on the next floor I checked was available. And OMG, the views were stunning! I loved sitting on that balcony and found Staubbach Falls utterly mesmerizing – not mention the other falls that can be seen, and the snow-clad mountain, and the cliffs and trees and birds and paragliders…. There is a bar very close to the hotel that generated some noise in the evenings – not overwhelming, but noticeable. I was pleased that the room in which I slept was quiet. It afforded views primarily of trees, along with a bit of the main road through Lauterbrunnen; it did not face the cliffs. My spotlesslessly clean room was very comfortable and nicely appointed, with plenty of counter and closet space. There was a large sink in the bedroom and a separate room held the (very welcome!) bathtub with shower and toilet.

"The hotel also has several large and comfortable indoor common areas, complete with books and toys and beverage options. The bright breakfast room, which faces the falls, offered a very nice combination of hot and cold options, all very fresh and tasty. Perfect!

"The hotel does not have its own restaurant for meals other than breakfast, but there is no shortage of options within an easy walk of a few minutes.

"If I ever return to the Bernese Oberland – and I would love to do so! – I will look forward to staying at the hotel Staubbach."</i>


<b>Luzern</b>: Hotel des Alpes:

<i>"I spent one night in a single room at the Hotel des Alpes in June and thought the location perfect. I adored the views from my room over the river and bridges! The room itself was nothing special, but was perfectly adequate. The staff seemed busy, but were helpful and efficient and responsive nonetheless. The breakfast room held a nice array of tasty foods and offered a very pleasant view of the Kapellbrucke and swans."</i>

swandav2000

Hi again!

Yay! Do hope my input/comments have been helpful.

Not sure about the nature of your trials at this time -- but I spent about a decade caring for my sister, then my father, then my mother. In my case, travel planning helped to lift me out of the circumstances, and of course the travel itself helped to restore my soul.

Hope you find restoration --

s

PalenQ

, I can’t imagine using google to plan a trip – way too much information of unknown value and without context>

ah Fodor's and similar sites are IMO a treasure-trove of unedited personal takes and experiences-like those of kja and swandav above and others -priceless.

I go to our library and photo copy the few relevant pages of guidebooks to places where I am actually going - no need to lug a hefty book around and I get insights from multiple sources.

milestogoneedadvice

awww swandav,

This is a travel forum, a passion that connects, but as a wise woman (MT) said, "We all belong to each other!" You too, are very intuitive, and planning travel and then the wonder of actually experiencing it are truly "restoration!" Thank you!

I am definitely starting to feel Switzerland. I am happy with the itinerary, as kja said, "There aren't any really bad choices in Switzerland, just difficult ones!"

I'm working on details and will be posting again with questions, but all of this is the best information. I'm going to start making my journal of train schedules, a list of things open/closed for season, etc.

Our first visit to Switzerland, we are so excited. Loved, loved the links that you sent, breathed in the moment.

More to come, working my planning as I can!

Happy adventures!

PalenQ

Yes I love gleaning information from books, friends who travel and the BEST Fodor's community ( I confess, throw in some Rick Steves too)! I planned a trip to France several years ago and in several places walked in my Fodor's footsteps, how cool! It would not have been as special without hearing their stories of favorite places. Wow what gifts! Cross your fingers as I continue with the planning

Thanks and watch for more questions!

PalenQ

Fingers croxxed!

milestogoneedadvice

I'm still here! Planning is on hold for a few days, as I am needed elsewhere. Hope to get back to this group in the next day or two with new information and of course questions!

Thank you!

milestogoneedadvice

Hello! I'm able to return to planning for a few days. I've spent some time looking at the itinerary activities, and I need help! I've recopied the itinerary and then added my information.

Day 1: Arrive in Basel - Half day in Basel, overnight Basel
Day 2: Train to Lake Geneva area - Montreux - Chateau de Chillon and walk the Lakeside Promenade?????
Day 3: Vineyards of Laveaux/Vevey
Day 4: Train to Lauterbrunnen area (1/2 day Lauterbrunnen - depends on how much time is needed for Glacier 3000)
Day 5: Lauterbrunnen area
Day 6: Lauterbrunnen - Day trip Schilthorn/Murren excursion
Day 7: Lauterbrunnen area ( Wengen/ Interlaken????)
Day 8: Train to Luzern 1/2 day in Luzern
Day 9uzern area(cable car to Mount Titlis, weather permitting, maybe the Golden Pass)
Day 10: Train to Zurich for morning flight

Time away, but I'm back! I'm trying to refocus. My first questions, I would appreciate direction.

1. Even though we have 10 days, I believe the 15 day Swiss Travel Pass is what we need.
I'm reading, looking at maps, etc. just trying to get a feel for the logistics.

2. With the Swiss Travel pass we do not purchase tickets, just show the pass, right? I believe I need to go head and order it online???? Any opinion on the SBB phone app?

I am going through the Itinerary one segment at a time. Right now I feel good about Basel, maybe some specific questions later.

3. Montreux - Still debating. I think it will depend on weather. The long walk from Montreux through the vineyards is of interest. Possibly Chateau de Chillon. Like the idea of walking and enjoying the villages, vineyard area, maybe the wine caves. I will continue to read for details.
Swandav: I found a wonderful post about how to approach the vineyard walk, with a ferry ride to end the day. I will be reviewing that again!


4. I’ve started to get specifics for the Lauterbrunnen area. It is a good start for day trips. But I’m feeling frustrated. I have been googling and I know there are many beautiful ways to experience and see the views here.


Option 1: The Schilthorn from Murren is a good thing. I’ve copied the following:
Services on the Lauterbrunnen – Grütschalp – Mürren route will not run due to maintenance work from: 1.05. - 5.05.2017 / 23.10. - 3.11.2017. Yes, we are there the first week of May.

Rick Steves says that If the cable car is closed you can take the cargo cable car from the valley floor directly to Murren, where a small bus will shuttle you down to Gimmelwald if needed. I think I could take the cable car that runs from Murren to the Schlithorn. Can someone advise or direct me to information? I’ve looked and read, but I’m not sure of what I think I know!

Option 1B: The Jungfraujoch - I know this would be full day. I’ve been reading differing opinions on whether to do the Schilthorn AND the Jungfrau. Many say choose one and then do other things. Please offer your ideas regarding this.

How we spend time in Lauterbrunnen sounds like it will be weather dependent. The maintenance schedule prohibits the Mannlichen Ridge excursion.


Option 2: We could take the cable car from Grindelwald to First, that is probably a full day?

Options 3: We could take the train to SCHYNIGE PLATTE, another full day.

Option 4: Waterfalls - suggestion: Hiking around the waterfall on local trails for the day is a must do. Choices in UNESCO World Heritage Theme Trails, this is a good list that includes the waterfall hikes.

Option 5: Trümmelbach10 glacial waterfalls drain together within mountain caverns, well-illuminated and easily accessible by lift. I’m not sure how this works with Hiking Valley of Waterfalls in Option 4.

Open from April to November, daily from 9 through to 17 h, July/August from 08.30 through 18 h.

Option 6: Maybe this should have been my first question;

I’m looking at a huge amount of information and trying to filter. Maybe some of these options can be combined on the same day. I hope with your own experiences and advice I can prioritize or at least start to filter.
I know that these days cannot be planned perfectly. I need to be flexible for the weather. But…. I don’t want to waste time when we can’t go to the top looking for and trying to decide what to do and how to do it.

I’m trying to see the possibilities. These options are all intriguing. A concern is that I can’t be high energy hiking every day, may need a low key or rainy day option in there, maybe not.
Ballenburg outdoor museum????
​KUNSTMUSEUM BERN
lake cruise on Lake Brienz

If I can figure out these segments I’m pretty much there. I think Lake Luzern is decided, will need some tweaking, but for now…….
Thank you for helping me sort out the information.

PalenQ

1. Even though we have 10 days, I believe the 15 day Swiss Travel Pass is what we need.>

An 8-consecutive-day pass is all you need- you are only staying in Basel first day and Lucerne to Zurich - buy that ticket in Lucerne- save lots of money with 8-day pass over 15-day pass.

2. With the Swiss Travel pass we do not purchase tickets, just show the pass, right? I believe I need to go head and order it online???? Any opinion on the SBB phone app?>

Yup just hop on the train or boat or bus, etc- for 50% off of course you need to buy a half-off ticket.

You can buy Swiss Passes at any Swiss train station upon arrival -no need to pre-order online -esp if shipping fees- and check prices for exact same pass in U.S. - it has often been cheaper the past several years and most agents have no shipping fees for such orders - I've bought passes from Byron at www.budgeteuropetravel.com for years - various passes and Swiss ones - he will expertly answer any questions - check the site for U S prices and see if they are cheaper than in Switzerland -if not just buy upon arrival (take into account any foreign transaction fees for using credit card in Switzerland). But check U.S. sites because they often in spring have specials- also check www.sbb.ch for sure for prices and specials.

PalenQ

Lauterbrunnen is just a few kms from Trummelbach Falls - kind of on the edge of town -fit it in anytime you have a few spare hours- can take a bus there but a lovely walk.

kja

The Ballenberg Outdoor Museum is wonderful -- but outdoors, and so not a great bad weather option, and it can involve quite a bit of walking, so isn't really an alternative to hiking.

The Kunstmuseum Bern is very nice. The History Museum in Bern is, IMO, excellent.