grantop

It's about time that at least the military be brought in, obviously the Police can not control these people and something needs to be done.

Art_Vandelay

If you followed the State department's advice, you would only travel to Disneyland and Liechtenstein!

kswl

I don't think that is a fair assessment of the State Department's travel warnings, Art.

Spygirl

Let's be clear here-the information on the Paris riots put out by the State Dept. and the US Embassy in France is not a "State Dept. Memo"-and it is NOT a Travel Warning, which advises Americans not to travel to a particular destination.

The information about the Paris riots and unrest has been disseminated through a Public Announcement, which is put out either by the State Dept. in Washington, or more frequently by the post (embassy) on a situation in a particular area of the world that travelers should take notice of. I posted the PA in full on the earlier Paris riots thread. There is absolutely nothing in the PA that tells travelers to stay away from France, it merely advises on conditions there, and urges caution. The difference between the two documents is explained on the State Dept. website:


What Are Travel Warnings, Consular Information Sheets & Public Announcements?

Travel Warnings

Travel Warnings are issued when the State Department decides, based on all relevant information, to recommend that Americans avoid travel to a certain country. Countries where avoidance of travel is recommended will have Travel Warnings as well as Consular Information Sheets. You may also want to review specific country Background Notes.

Public Announcements

Public Announcements are a means to disseminate information about terrorist threats and other relatively short-term and/or trans-national conditions posing significant risks to the security of American travelers. They (PAs) are made when there is a specific threat that cannot be countered. In the past, Public Announcements have been issued to deal with short-term coups, violence by terrorists and anniversary dates of specific terrorist events.


As far as Art's comments-let me say this: the issuance of a Travel Warning is a signficant event-there are only about 20 something TWs currently issued-- because a TW will materially impact that country's tourism, and thus its economy, in a negative way. Countries under a TW protest mightily through diplomatic channels when such are issued. But that's precisely the point: if the country in question has not taken, or is unable to take the steps to counter the threat in that country against travelers, and all intelligence on the area in question indicates an attack on travelers will happen again, then a TW is issued advising Americans against travel to the country.

Insurance policies may also be affected by a TW, in that an exclusionary clause will go into effect if the traveler goes to the country in question in spite of the TW.

And as shown on an Australian video made of the event, if those travelers sitting in that Bali restaurant a little over a month ago, on October 1, watching the backpacker bomber make his way through the restaurant (no metal detectors, no check at the door for backpacks) had heeded the Travel Warning out on Bali and Indonesia, they absolutely would be alive today. 25 tourists dead, 3 Americans, 100 injured-and the two bombers have still not been captured.

Art_Vandelay

Please don't get offended, but there was no travel advice being posted by anyone against taking domestic American flights on 9/11 (even though we now know that it could have been issued, but that's another story). It's strange how people are over sensitive to the slightest hint of danger abroad and yet go on taking their car on a daily basis, something statistically far more dangerous.

kswl

Hello Spygirl, quite right, no travel warning, and no one ever said there was. I'm sure you noticed in the original post that I described the email from the State Department as a traveler's <b>advisory</b>. There is a difference, and I think everyone here knows what it is.

LoveItaly

Hello kswl, I certainly know and understand the difference between a travel adivsory and a travel warning.

I don't understand why some have to get so upset. Everyone has a different viewpoint about what is acceptable to them when they travel. IMO it is a decision that each traveller has to make on their own. No right or wrong answer that I can see. Safe travels to everyone!

moldyhotelsaregross

Bookmark for myself.

Orcas

I understand that the dollar is finally strengthening re the Euro because of the unrest. So, those traveling soon from the US and Canada may find their dollars stretching a bit farther. From all I've heard, the major tourist areas are not affected by this unrest. I think the media gives an exagerated impression of the extent of the violence. From a traveler's perspective, I don't understand why anyone would cancel a trip.

LoveItaly

Hello Orcas, I personally would not cancel my trip. But then we went to Italy for two months in 1978 when the Red Brigade was causing terror across Italy. The PM of Italy had been kidnapped etc. We took our teenage daughter with us. Some of our family members really got upset with us. Everything was fine. We did, while in Milan, go to Switzerland for a few days as there was an announced parade and possible riot due in Milan where we were staying that week. And this riot did take place. The police shot rubber bullets and &quot;come si dice&quot; the gas type of bullets..no one got killed thank goodness.

Again, IMO, every traveller needs to decide for themselves what is acceptable and what is not. No right or wrong answer. And of course saying that each traveller has to accept the outcome of their decision. Take care.

Orcas

True. The perception of danger, whether the danger is real or not, can ruin the fun of planning for a trip, and when one considers bringing children, one worries even more. Many people have had to deal with a similar problem in recent years when considering visiting Israel. I was there some years ago, when there were a couple of incidents. They were a lot scarier to the folks back home than to people in Israel. In fact, I spent one night in a bomb shelter in the Golan Heights when it was attacked and thought it was great fun. We were up singing. My parents were not amused when they got the postcard.

LoveItaly

Oh Orcas &quot;my parents were not amused when they got the postcard&quot; LOL, I can really relate!!

We were in Italy, planned on going from Capri to Brindisi to Greece with a couple of friends in Italy. So I happily sent postcards off advising the loved ones at home that we were going to Greece, tra la la&quot; from such and such a date to such and such a date. At the last moment the wife got really ill with a virus. They were suppose to meet us on Capri before we went to Greece. When they called us from Milan to cancel the entire trip we decided to stay on Capri.

After returning home we found out there had been a horrible earthquake in Greece during the period of time we had said we would be there. We hadn't a clue. No one knew how to get hold of us (which we had warned them about before we left). Oh mama mia!!! You can imagine the lectures we received.
I did feel bad, well terrible of course, causing family members concern. So Orcas, I can really relate!

kswl

LOL, LoveItaly!! On our way to Greece in 72 (if memory serves, and it doesn't always these days) sailing when we heard on the radio that there had been a coup. We turned right around and went to Naples. Or Istambul. Somewhere other than Greece, I do remember that! But my mother and father were pretty upset, thinking our boat had been impounded in Piraeus (sic?) with all the other foreign vessels.