We are active retirees and have now purchased air tickets to visit Spain and France from mid April next year for 5 weeks.
I would appreciate comments on our Spain itinerary. Any modifications/suggestions would be welcome.

Fly into Barcelona from Auckland, NZ
Barcelona 4 nights
Fly to Malaga pick up rental car and drive to Rhonda
Rhonda 4 nights, explore nearby white villages
Drive to Granada, drop off rental car
Granada 3 nights
Train to Cordoba
Cordoba 2 nights
Train to Seville
Seville 3 nights
Flly to San Sebastián/Bilbao
San Sebastián/Bilbao 3 nights undecided where to be based as most flights go to Bilbao
Then, train to France, itinerary undecided but have 14 days and last 2 nights in Paris. We have been there before.

Should be wonderful! That said, I find you allocation of times puzzling. Perhaps more information about your priorities would help,

3 days is very, very little for Barcelona, particularly as you will be recovering from jet lag while there. A stay of week there would not be unreasonable to see the things that draw many people to that city.

4 nights in Ronda (not Rhonda) seems a lot to me. Two nights (one day) is enough for most people for Ronda itself; another night for another white town or two should suffice.

3 nights in Sevilla would be at least a night too short for me.

3 nights for San Sebastien / Bilbao might work for you, but I’m glad I had more time in that area.

In the absence of information about your priorities and interests, that's all I can say. I hope it helps!

I agree with kja. I would spend a minimum of 5 nights in Barcelona, and 6-7 nights would be even better, especially since you will be jetlagged when you first arrive. We spent 6 nights in Barcelona about 15 years ago, and we didn't see everything we wanted to see. And nowadays in Barcelona many, many sites require advance purchase tickets online so that you aren't spending hours waiting in line for tickets. This means you may not be able to go directly from one sight to another.

We did not visit Ronda or any of the other white towns but I know from research and reading trip reports that most people spend only 1 or 2 nights in Ronda. BTW, Malaga is a wonderful place to spend a few nights especially if you want some coastal ambiance.

I would spend a minimum of 4 nights in Seville. Seville is a gorgeous city with many historical and cultural gems. It's a much more important city than Ronda and really does deserve more time. Seville is great for just wandering and getting lost. There are parks, plazas, fountains, and beautiful architecture. You can see a flamenco show. Take a carriage ride around the city.

If you reduce your time in Ronda, you can take one night and add it to Barcelona, and take another night and add it to Seville. This will still give you 2 nights in Ronda.

I haven't been to SS or Bilbao so can't advise there.

Definitely agree that Seville is worth more time. Here's where we stayed, which was perfect. The company was very professional, met us at the door with keys. Sent a car to the airport for us. Gorgeous apartment in great location. We also used them to lease similar apartment in Madrid.
Highly recommend: This is San Jose V, the two- bedroom one we stayed in, on airbnb w/Home at Homes
https://www.airbnb.com/rooms/21799442

Casa Palacio San Jose

Calle de San Jose 7, 41004 Seville Spain

The leasing agency

https://www.homeathomes.com/eng/Casa...e-V/en/Sevilla

The whole estate

http://www.sevillasanjose.com/

YouTube video in Spanish

Spain Select Casa Palacio San José


Have fun planning your adventure.

I agree that you need more time in Barcelona, we were there in June 2022 for 5 nights and we still didn’t see everything (as if you ever do) we hoped for. I think 6-7nights would be perfect in my opinion.

in SEPTEMBER 2024 we traveled to the Basque region and spent 5 nights in San Sebastián and we loved it. It’s easy to get from Bilbao airport to San Sebastián, we hired a private pick up and that worked perfectly. We used bus system to get from SS to Bayonne, France which we also loved Bayonne (3 nights) and then we bused back to Bilbao and spent 3 nights there, our least favorite spot of the trip but still a lovely city.

Thank you for all your comments. The only thing in concrete time wise are our air tickets.
So, some more information, we are flying from New Zealand and that is why are trip altogether is a good 5 weeks. We like a variety of activities, some museums, some architecture, food, biking, hiking, countryside and exploring. We do not want to be in a rush and we do not want to do everything.
Yes, 5 nights in Barcelona is noted and less time in Ronda. 3 full days gives us time to explore the white villages and we would like to go to Caminito del Rey, thinking we would do this from Ronda.
About San Sebastián, Any suggestions whether this will work better if we say had 6 nights in this area and how we could use this time efficiently?

Thank you will visit the sites

Yes, 6 nights would be better for San Sebastian and Bilbao, particularly in light of your interests and preferences.

And like KarenWoo, I think 6 or 7 nights would be better for Barcelona.

FWIW, here's a trip report that includes those destinations:
Four Awesome Weeks in the North of Spain and Catalunya

Thank you for the feedback. We will now have 6 days in Barcelona and 3 days in Ronda.
An alternative could be to go by train to Madrid from Barcelona and stay a few days by taking a few off the above itinerary and then go to Cordoba. Then do the reverse of the above and end up in Seville by having a rental car from Granada to Ronda, no Malaga, and dropping off at Seville. We are not too interested in too many large cities and not being rushed.

Then fly into spend into Northern Spain and now spend 5-6 nights. Then use the train to move into France.

So, is Madrid a must?
and what would be a suitable plan for Northen Spain for first timers
Any modifications/suggestions would be much appreciated. . Planning an itinerary can be overwhelming.

I'm sorry, but I find it hard to follow your options. Could you please lay them out in a way that makes the differences clear? It would really help.

As for whether Madrid is a "must"-- well, I'm not fond of the concept of "musts." I would say that anyone with a serious interest in art would likely make Madrid a priority. Beyond that, I found much to treasure there, but I found much to treasure in pretty much every place I've been in Spain, so I think how to prioritize it depends on your interests. JMO.

Northern Spain is huge and diverse. A "suitable plan" for less than 2 or 3 weeks is not a concept that makes sense to me. Sorry!

I wholeheartedly agree that planning an itinerary can be overwhelming! I think it helps to decide whether you want to skim or delve, particularly if your time frame is fixed. And read, read. READ! Not trip reports, not google search results, but rather comprehensive guidebooks which will introduce you to the stuff that might really catch your interests, even if they aren't "popular." Guidebooks like those of the Michelin Green or Rough Guide series. JMO, with the hope that my perspective my prove useful.

Thanks kya for your comments.
Hopefully the itineraries below are easier to follow

Although both itineraries are similar, is one better logistically

Barcelona 5 nights
Fly to Malaga pick up rental car and drive to Rhonda
Rhonda 3 nights, explore nearby white villages
Drive to Granada, drop off rental car
Granada 3 nights
Train to Cordoba
Cordoba 2 nights
Train to Seville
Seville 3 nights
Or
Barcelona 5 nights
Train to Madrid
Madrid 2 nights
Train to Cordoba
Cordoba 2 nights
Train to Granada
Granada 3 nights
Pick up rental car and drive to Ronda and find a base to explore nearby villages
Ronda 3 nights
Drive to Seville and drop off rental car
Seville 3 nights
If I have some more time, like 5-6 nights, I could add this to Southern Spain or go to Northern Spain from Seville as we will be going to France for the final part of this trip.
Any comments appreciated.

I cannot comment on experience as I'm currently planning my own trip to Spain that also includes France.

First off, where in France are you going? That is important details that might impact suggestions for order for Spain.

Second, you are jumping around quite a bit. And if you have to schedule one or more flights within an itinerary to make it work, it usually means it is a bit too convoluted.

Have your flights to/from Europe been booked? If so, where are you flying into and out (home) of?

As Travel_Nerd notes, your destination in France is important. For example, Barcelona and northern Spain are much closer to France than your other potential destinations, so you might want to END with one of them rather than starting in Barcelona. If you add time in northern Spain, it would probably make sense to have that time just before or after Barcelona so you don’t have to waste time going south and then north again. But honestly, it depends on where you are going in France.

As already noted, 5 nights would not be enough for Barcelona for my tastes. And I’d want at least 4 nights in Sevilla. You say you don’t want to rush … and yet you are. But maybe you just want to a quick look at the highlights of these cities?

For just 2 nights (1 day) and absent a strong interest in art, I’m not sure Madrid makes sense for you. It’s easy to reach, so you might wait for a different trip when you can include Toledo, Segovia, Salamanca, or other parts of central Spain.

If you really have extra time, you have a wealth of options. At the risk of redundancy, a good guidebook or two should help you decide.

“For just 2 nights (1 day) and absent a strong interest in art, I’m not sure Madrid makes sense for you. It’s easy to reach, so you might wait for a different trip when you can include Toledo, Segovia, Salamanca, or other parts of central Spain.”

As someone who visits Madrid+ every year, I agree with kja.

btw, there is a bus from Bilbao airport to SS. Worked well for us.

Information asked for, tickets are booked. We are arriving at Barcelona and leaving from Paris. Our France part has not yet been finalised. We have been to Avignon, Dordogne, Luberon, Toulouse, Sarlat and Paris before

This is why it is generally suggested to book flights once your itinerary is at least set... Alas, here we are.

Without knowing your France details, it is hard to provide advice. And since now you are stuck to start in north of Spain with a desire to go south, my suggestion is to consider upon arrival in Barcelona to then take a flight immediately to your southern-most point and then work your way north, thereby making your plans to go France simpler. Or maybe even see if you can add a flight to your itinerary so you don't have to re-enter security. Doesn't help with the convoluted, but hey, your trip.

Is this the same trip you've were asking for advice on in September?

What Travel_Nerd said.

I second what travel_nerd and kja said. I never book our airline reservations until my itinerary is more or less set in stone.

kiwinz, depending on your first destination in France, maybe you could fly from Seville or from Madrid to that French destination? So that you don't have to backtrack to northern Spain.

Thanks for all those points. My plan was to fly from Seville to North Spain like San Sebastian and spend up to 5-6 nights in this area and then enter France by train and spending some time around Bordeaux, Loire Valley and move up to Paris. This part we are working on. Unfortunately, we were under pressure recently to buy tickets as prices were increasing .

We like to alternate countryside/smaller towns with cities. Not everyone loves Barcelona. I like Seville more than 3 nights. Before I commit to how much time in each city, I study guide books to see what there is to see and what appeals to me. Both Seville and Barcelona will be busy in April/May. The white towns are not as interesting as you might think, although driving through the countryside can be a nice road trip experience.

I second the thought that Madrid is a waste if you're not interested in art and museums that much. That said, though, there isn't anywhere in Europe that we personally have felt was a waste of time.

It is nice to see some of both the south and the north of Spain. They are very different from each other. We do love San Sebastian for the relaxed pace, the food, the scenery, and the coast line is beautiful. Also as you say it could be a natural jump over to France. Just make sure you map out travel times to get a realistic picture of how much time you are going to spend getting from place to place.

Since we live in a city, though, when we travel, we are enjoying the smaller centers with a more relaxed pace than spending all our time in cities. So as we all know, travel is enjoyed most when it is a personalized experience.

Your itinerary is pretty fast paced. Keep in mind that too many flights between locations will tire you out, because air travel is not as easy as it once was. Since we are in our late 60's/early 70's now we are enjoying staying in one country per trip and traveling around less. That may not be an option for you though, with the long distance from NZ. But there will always be more on the bucket list, and also places where one wishes one could return.