Hello there, we are family of seven, including parents over 60, and a toddler.

Looking to do an extensive 17D16N trip of Southern France in May.

Main aim is sightseeing, soaking in the atmosphere and family time

Here's the initial draft of our itinerary.

1) Fly into Paris 12 May - stay 2 nights
2) Take TGV to Lyon - stay 2 nights
3) Take TGV to Nice - stay 3 nights
Do day trips to Antibes, Cannes, St
Tropez
4) Pick up rental car and drive to Aix-en-
Provence - stay 3 nights
Do day trip to Marselles
5) Drive to Luberon (clueless on
transportation modes there) - stay 2
nights
6) Drive to Avignon - stay 2 nights
Day trip to Arles and St Remy
7) Return rented car and take TGV back to
Paris - 2 nights.

Wanted to cover Bordeaux but it is too far and out of the way from above. Also to do a open jaw ticket to/from Lyon/Nice/Bordeaux is double/ triple of what I would pay for return to Paris.

Any suggestions on how to tweak my itinerary (eg. Base for day trips, rental cars, other alternative areas to explore etc)? Wondering if I'm spreading it too thin and moving around too much - especially with a toddler in tow.

Would welcome any suggestions for rental properties/ apartments to prepare cooked food for my toddler.

Also, given the Cannes Film Festival runs from 18-28 May, is this a good time to travel to Southern France? Just thought I could nip a short day trip to Cannes from Nice and carry on with the rest of the trip as per normal. Worried about traffic and crowds.

Thank you!

You have too many stops, especially considering the size of the group.

I don't really believe that flying into Paris and out of Nice would cost 2-3x as much as RT Paris. Just doesn't pass face value for me, as I've done those kinds of flights many times (into one city in France,out of another), and it has never had that kind of pricing, it is either the same price (or cheaper) or maybe $50-100 more at most. Of course it may be more just because that city is always more than Paris, not being as big a hub. Of course I don't know where you are flying from, but I still find it hard to believe even if you were flying from London.

In fact, I just did a test from JFK on 5/21 and 5/31, and the RT Paris fare was $690 but flying into CDG and out of NCE was only $666 (Air France), so cheaper and no payment for a train trip to Paris, either.

Aside from that, which could affect your entire itinerary (going back to Paris for 2 nights is a waste of time and money, IMO), I think you are moving around unnecessarily in Provence. Aix and Avignon and the Luberon aren't that far apart, no need to move every 2 days. As for transportation in the Luberon, it doens't matter as you'll have a car (which is the best for that area, by far).

On the other hand, if you really don't mind moving every 2 days, your itinerary isn't that bad as it is easier to do a day trip to Arles from Avignon than Aix, and of course, Marseille is easy by train from Aix or Avignon. But if you want to see Aix (which is lovely), your itinerary sort of makes sense. I've visited Avignon by car from Aix, but I wasn't using that trip to go farther west for day trips as I'd already been there (Arles, etc.). But with a toddler, I don't think you should do this much moving around. For two adults, it's possible.

What I am not clear on is why you want a car in Avignon, you don't intend to drive to Arles, do you? YOu have to for St Remy, but not Arles. I would not visit both of those in one day by car, if that's your plan.

Cannes will have no effect whatsoever on Aviginon, Aix, etc.

YOu are not spending any time in Nice even though you are staying there, it appears, just using it to go elsewhere (Antibes, Cannes, etc). I think that is a mistake.

I think you could cut out Marseille, I like it but it's too much for your trip. But, I would never drive to Marseille for a day trip from Aix rather than taking the train, which takes less than 30 minutes. Even from Avignon, the train isn't that long a trip to Marseille.

Yes, you are probably moving around too much with or without a toddler in tow.

If you are going to base in Nice, without a car, you will NOT be able to get to Saint Tropez. Unless you take the train to Saint Raphael, then either a bus (that takes forever to get to Saint Tropez) or at the Port of Saint-Raphael, you could take the Bateaux Saint Raphael to the port of St. Tropez. The latter takes about an hour, but it's not cheap for a round trip. If your heart is to go to Saint Tropez, it's better to do it from your base in Aix and, with the car, do it as a day trip. Or base yourself in Sainte Maxime, a super family friendly place, and (with a car) drive to Saint Tropez. They have a wonderful open air market there twice a week.

You will be going at a very busy time and accommodations may be very difficult.

Is there any specific reason you want to go to Lyons or the Luberon? for the Luberon, you will definitely need a car.

If it were me, I'd head to Nice from Paris (staying in Nice of Juan les Pins). Use public transport (particularly the coastal train) going west to Cannes or east towards the Italian border.

Rather than Aix (as much as I adore it!), to get to the western spots you want to visit, train to Saint Raphael, then rent a car and base yourself in Sainte Maxime.

You could then head to Avignon and, with a car, visit Arles and St. Remy.

Although you'll still be tight on time, these would be my suggestions to get a lot out of the coast and family time, and still get to see the best of Provence in the spring.

Stu . . . you need to add your 2 cents to this post!

I wonder if the reason you are getting such exorbitant fares for open jaw is that you are looking at two one-way fares, rather than a multi-city/multi-destination fare? One-way fares are enormous; multi-city fares are usually quite reasonable. There's a multi-city or multi-destination option on every search site.

Christina Op says multicity vs R/T Paris gives a difference.
That difference is 2-3 times the price of retunring from Nice to Paris.

Chicaq, you ahve too many stops and at each stops you have too many daytrips. St Trop for instance will consume one full day from Nice.

Forget Luberon, forget Marseilles (not a city so memorable imo) and focus on Riviera + ...

1) Fly into Paris 12 May - stay 3 nights
2N means one day ... day of arrival is short and you are wasted.
3) Take TGV to Nice - stay 4 nights
Do day trips to Antibes, Cannes, St
Tropez. Or Stay at Antibes.
4) Pick up rental car and drive to Aix-en-
Provence - stay 3 nights
Why by car ? Anyway with the car stop at Baux de Provence en route.
5) Drive to Avignon - stay 3 nights
Day trip to Arles and St Remy and somewhere else.
7) Return rented car and take TGV back to
Paris - 2 nights.

My opinion.

>>Also to do a open jaw ticket to/from Lyon/Nice/Bordeaux is double/ triple of what I would pay for return to Paris.<<

That seems very far fetched. Where are you flying from? Returning to Paris (and splitting your time there) is a huge waste of time. Hopefully you haven't already booked R-t in/out of Paris.

Don't look for a rental in Paris or Nice -- it will have to be a hotel (or an aparthotel) since the VAST majority of short term rentals are illegal. (basically the law applies to cities over 200,000 population)

I agree with RonZ - too many destinations. You also have some "challanges" with visiting large cities on Sundays & Mondays when all/most of the shops will be closed (if you plan to shop).

You will be in Lyon on a Sunday & Monday. Museums will be open on Sunday and many will be open on Monday - but most shops will be closed Sunday & Monday AM. You will also be in Aix (my wife's favorite shopping city after Paris) on a Sunday. Your only day-trip is to Marseille - which will also have shops closed if you do it on a Sunday. You'll also be in Avignon on a Holiday when shops will be closed.

You didn't mention where you are flying from, but on Air France from SFO (where we live), RT to Paris is $700 and SFO to Nice and CDG to SFO open jaw is $1,400. This surprised me because I didn't think the difference would be that large.

Here is what I would do:

- May 12 Friday. Fly to CDG and immediately take the TGV from CDG to the Avignon TGV station. Rent a car and spend 4 nights in the Luberon. Rent a car.
- May 13 Sat. visit the Luberon villages
- May 14 Sunday. Farmers market in L'isle sur la Sorgue. Get there early (8:00) Bonnieux & Gordes will have shops open in the afternoon.
- May 15 Mon. Visit Colorado de Rustrel & "rest" in the afternoon
- May 16 Tues. Drive to St Remy & stay 3 nights. Visit Arles & les Baux
- May 17 Wed. Market day in St Remy if you need another market. Visit Avignon
- May 18 Thurs. Visit the Pont du Gard & Uzes.
- May 19 Fri. Drive to Aix & stay 2 nights.
- May 20 Sat. Market day in Aix. Visit Marseille.
- May 21 Sun. Drive to Nice & stay 3-4 nights. Return the car.
- May 22 Mon. Nice & surrounds
- May 23 Tues. Nice & surrounds.
- May 24 Wed. Take the TGV to Paris. I would skip Lyon. You have already visited many large cities and Paris is next. It might be smart to eliminate 1 destination.
- Spend your remaining time in Paris

Stu Dudley

Or . . . possibly Cannes is inflating the fares. Have you considered reversing the order and flying into Nice and home from Paris.

It cannot possibly be 2-3 times as much for an open-jaw ticket. You must be looking at two separate one-way tickets.

And yes, with a group that large, including a toddler, you have way too many stops.

And what kind of rental car do you envision that will hold 7 people? There are 7-person vans, but the luggage space is extremely limited. Everyone would have to pack really, really lightly, and even then some will no doubt end up holding a suitcase on their laps.

And one seat will be taken by a car seat for the toddler. A 7-passenger vehicle really has about enough space for 5 adults and assorted luggage. 6 adults IF everyone sticks to carry-on sized bags.

You would really need 2 mid-sized cars

Flight option on Air France:

Returning May 29

Round trip SFO to CDG
Depart May 10 $660
Depart May 11 $1,014

Open Jaw SFO to NCE, CDG to SFO

Depart May 10 $1,068
Depart May 11 $1,118
Depart May 12 $1,405

We have United Air RT tickets from SFO to CDG depart June 4 & return July 2 for $1,950

It depends on WHEN you travel and WHEN you book, plus any "sales".

Stu Dudley

To be entirely clear, use the multi-destination search function from an airline or an on-line agency to get the proper price.

Do as Stu suggests.

Drop the daytrip to St Tropez; it's a pain to get to. You could take a boat from Nice, but it's a looong trip, and if it's windy not very pleasant.

Cannes is not a problem unless you are planning on staying there. You can still visit during the festival if you go by train. Easy daytrip. Antibes is easy by train as well. But with 3 nights in Nice you will have to pick and choose.

you guys are rock stars! so touched by the community here with your comments/suggestions.
We are from Singapore, and i did only one search on Singapore Airlines (which flies only to Paris) - that explains the exorbitant cost.

Via Singapore Airlines
SIN - CDG - SIN: USD638
Open Jaw: USD2064

Did a check on Air France as suggested, and cost is reasonable for an open jaw.

Via Air France
Open Jaw: USD945



Thanks for the suggestion on the rental car - didn't think that we actually needed 2 cars for our group. And point taken on hotels for Paris/Nice - grateful for that.

Assuming i go with Stu's itinerary as below: i have the following questions:

1) Any gites suggestions for Luberon, St Remy's and Aix?
2) Read on Wikipedia that "The term gîte originally meant quite simply a form of shelter. Gîtes today vary from being luxury holiday homes to very basic apartments. Some gîtes don't provide linen as standard, so many gîte holidaymakers take their linen with them. However, many gîte owners do include linen at least as an option." - how was your experience with them
3) Any personal favourites for restaurants/ bistros/cafes for any location below. Not particular about cuisine - just yummy food

- May 12 Friday. Fly to CDG and immediately take the TGV from CDG to the Avignon TGV station. Rent a car and spend 4 nights in the Luberon. Rent a car.
- May 13 Sat. visit the Luberon villages
- May 14 Sunday. Farmers market in L'isle sur la Sorgue. Get there early (8:00) Bonnieux & Gordes will have shops open in the afternoon.
- May 15 Mon. Visit Colorado de Rustrel & "rest" in the afternoon
- May 16 Tues. Drive to St Remy & stay 3 nights. Visit Arles & les Baux
- May 17 Wed. Market day in St Remy if you need another market. Visit Avignon
- May 18 Thurs. Visit the Pont du Gard & Uzes.
- May 19 Fri. Drive to Aix & stay 2 nights.
- May 20 Sat. Market day in Aix. Visit Marseille.
- May 21 Sun. Drive to Nice & stay 3-4 nights. Return the car.
- May 22 Mon. Nice & surrounds
- May 23 Tues. Nice & surrounds.
- May 24 Wed. Take the TGV to Paris. I would skip Lyon. You have already visited many large cities and Paris is next. It might be smart to eliminate 1 destination.
- Spend your remaining time in Paris

Thank you once again!

Gites usually rent by the week, especially during season. The ones I am familiar in The Luberon with usually only sleep 2 or maybe 4.

With seven people, you will need a house but again, those are usually by the week rentals during season. You are likely going to need hotel rooms. There may be houses that you can rent for a few days, try vrbo, homeagain.

Personally, I would spend a full week in The Luberon; it is a great base for exploring what Stu has outlined. Houses and gites often rent Saturday to Saturday, so plan accordingly.

Head to Nice after. Or to Paris. We liked Nice, but we LOVE Paris.

We've rented 67 gites through Gites-de-France. Like Deb stated - all of ours have been Sat to Sat. I think there are accommodations from vrbo or others with lesser rental minimums. For a large group, a rental of a large gite for a full week might be less than a 3 day multi-room hotel rental - even if you only stay in the Gite for 3 days. However, there is a bit of "overhead" in renting a gite. Often (actually, most often) the gite proprietor will not speak English. Reserve your accommodations ASAP. We're staying for 2 weeks in Provence this June & I reserved our gite about August last year. Here is something I wrote several years ago.
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...e-web-site.cfm
Also, I do not divulge info about specific gites we've rented in Provence. We keep returning to these same gites & it's getting harder & harder to rent them as they become more popular with non-French/European people.

If you can fly Open Jaw to Nice - start there then on to Provence, then Paris. Shorter train trips that way. Reserve your trains exactly 3 months in advance (France time) for a huge price savings.

We've vacationed 40 weeks in the Cote d'Azur & Provence. I developed a 33 page itinerary that describes our favorite villages, cities, scenic drives, markets, restaurants, etc. I've sent this itinerary to over 3,000 people on Fodors. If you would like a copy, e-mail me at [email protected] & I'll attach one to the reply e-mail. Specify that you would like the Provence/Cote d'Azur itinerary - I have others.

Stu Dudley

Less known than Stu's itineraries are the green Michelin guides.
However they managed to sell a few millions of their guides.
Highly recommended for any region in France.

Our favorite spot in Provence is Goult - perfectly located in the Luberon. It's not as "touristy" as Gordes, Roussillon, Menerbes - but just as interesting. Has a weekly farmer's market, at least 4 restaurants & a cafe in town, and a grocery. The place where we stay is only 2 bedrooms. But here are two other possibilities.

https://www.holidaylettings.co.uk/rentals/goult/197614
https://www.holidaylettings.co.uk/rentals/goult/5262464

If you fly to Nice via CDG, make sure you depart Nice from CDG - not Orly.

Stu Dudley

FWIW, neither my late husband nor I ever drove in France or Italy. When we stayed in Nice, we got a great van tour that visited Cannes and several other towns in that area. We also took a van tour from our hotel in Aix that went to several places in the Luberon (where driving is more convenient than bus or train).

It has been a few years so I suggest you google what's new. The vans picked us up at our hotels.

Will it cost more in train tickets than car rental? As others have said above, you are going to need a van or more than one car, yes?