Socrates & the Hemlock
#3
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Thomas: The cave is a legend and this is *most* likely the site. I visited it last Feb. The site is in the southwest corner of the Agora and hard to find. I used the Blue Guide Athens (now out of print). If you have a map of the Agora, the prison is 185m due south of the SW corner of the Hephaisteion (2 guidebooks, 1map and 3 different spellings
. Some quotes from the Blue Guide, "ID'ed (not without controversy) as the state prison where Socrates met his death by drinking hemlock, as described by Plato".."8 small cells to left and right of a central passage".."Two of the small cells are linked ,fitting the 2-roomed setting of Socrates' final hrs".."small flasks found in the excavations would have been suitable for storage of hemlock". HTH Regards, Walter <BR>p.s. The Blue Guide Greece on pg.138-9 has a site map of the Agora, the prison isn't marked but the extreme bottom left *corner* of the map (section 13) shows the Prison. <BR>
. Some quotes from the Blue Guide, "ID'ed (not without controversy) as the state prison where Socrates met his death by drinking hemlock, as described by Plato".."8 small cells to left and right of a central passage".."Two of the small cells are linked ,fitting the 2-roomed setting of Socrates' final hrs".."small flasks found in the excavations would have been suitable for storage of hemlock". HTH Regards, Walter <BR>p.s. The Blue Guide Greece on pg.138-9 has a site map of the Agora, the prison isn't marked but the extreme bottom left *corner* of the map (section 13) shows the Prison. <BR>
#4
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Thomas: Go to www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~loxias/agora.htm click-on the map and click-on the yellow square in the bottom left corner. This map refreshed my memory
The prison is as I said hard to find but look at the map and you'll see 2 footpaths (1 up/down-N&S & 1 left/right-E&W). The prison is in the *corner* of these 2 paths and is just made up of foundation stones. To be sure it's the right location stand on the up/down N-S path with the Prison in front (you're facing East) of you. You'll be on the same level as the foundation stones, the left/right E-W path will be on your left and will rise creating a slight wall on the left side of the prison and the back (earthen) wall of the prison will be directly in front of you, and the right side will be open like the front. The site is not marked and there really is nothing to see (foundation stones) it's so easy to just walk right by and it's off the tourist track so *no one* visits it. But it was one of the high points of my trip. HTH Regards, Walter <BR>
The prison is as I said hard to find but look at the map and you'll see 2 footpaths (1 up/down-N&S & 1 left/right-E&W). The prison is in the *corner* of these 2 paths and is just made up of foundation stones. To be sure it's the right location stand on the up/down N-S path with the Prison in front (you're facing East) of you. You'll be on the same level as the foundation stones, the left/right E-W path will be on your left and will rise creating a slight wall on the left side of the prison and the back (earthen) wall of the prison will be directly in front of you, and the right side will be open like the front. The site is not marked and there really is nothing to see (foundation stones) it's so easy to just walk right by and it's off the tourist track so *no one* visits it. But it was one of the high points of my trip. HTH Regards, Walter <BR>
#7
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Walter, I was able to locate the site you mentioned and I printed the map of the prison and the small earthenware pots. But I couldn't figure out how to print your replies. Instead I got the list of pages on the left side of the screen. Any suggestions?
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#9
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Athens Agora (for search engine) Ok
, this will be easier to follow and more detailed, I made notes on my recent trip
. The Hephaisteion is on a hill and at the base of this hill in front (E) of the Hephaisteion are the foundations of (N to S) Temple of Apollo, 2 Bouleuterins, Metroon and (last) the Tholos. Find the Tholos (it's 70M SE of the Hephaisteion and marked) which is a circular foundation. With your back to the Tholos looking E to the Agora Museum there is a (small) ditch (Great Drain) 15M in front of you. This Drain runs N-S, now look towards the Acropolis (45deg to the right) and you'll see the ditch turns 45deg and heads SW, walk over and stand in the drain looking SW. In front of you is a Boundary Stone (marked) *in* the drain, now the wall that it is against (left side) belongs to a row of houses/shops and 1 of them belonged to "Simon the Cobbler" (a inscribed cup & hobnails were found-*case 20), this was a Socrates' hang-out
. Now follow this SW ditch (walk along the left side) for 120M and you will come to a small path which crosses the ditch (you will have to climb up ~1m to the path so you'll know when you get to it
. Now in front (5m) of you is the Prison (it's on the left side (like you) of the ditch and it's right wall runs right along the ditch). Just *past* it you'll see marble fragments that have been recently stacked up in a large neat rectangle-good landmark. The Prison is just foundation stones but you'll see the corridor thru the center. On the left the 1st room is a quad this was the prison administration followed by 3 cells. Now on the right there are 5 cells, you'll notice that the 1st one unlike all the others has no access from the corridor and can only be entered by the 2nd cell which has a corridor entrance. This fits the 2-room prison cell setting of Socrates' cell also small flasks (*case 20) were found around the prison which could have been used for hemlock. ***In the Agoro Museum check-out Case #20 which contains Simon's cup/hopnails and the flasks & plate found around the prison also a picture of the prison. HTH Regards, Walter <BR>
, this will be easier to follow and more detailed, I made notes on my recent trip
. The Hephaisteion is on a hill and at the base of this hill in front (E) of the Hephaisteion are the foundations of (N to S) Temple of Apollo, 2 Bouleuterins, Metroon and (last) the Tholos. Find the Tholos (it's 70M SE of the Hephaisteion and marked) which is a circular foundation. With your back to the Tholos looking E to the Agora Museum there is a (small) ditch (Great Drain) 15M in front of you. This Drain runs N-S, now look towards the Acropolis (45deg to the right) and you'll see the ditch turns 45deg and heads SW, walk over and stand in the drain looking SW. In front of you is a Boundary Stone (marked) *in* the drain, now the wall that it is against (left side) belongs to a row of houses/shops and 1 of them belonged to "Simon the Cobbler" (a inscribed cup & hobnails were found-*case 20), this was a Socrates' hang-out
. Now follow this SW ditch (walk along the left side) for 120M and you will come to a small path which crosses the ditch (you will have to climb up ~1m to the path so you'll know when you get to it
. Now in front (5m) of you is the Prison (it's on the left side (like you) of the ditch and it's right wall runs right along the ditch). Just *past* it you'll see marble fragments that have been recently stacked up in a large neat rectangle-good landmark. The Prison is just foundation stones but you'll see the corridor thru the center. On the left the 1st room is a quad this was the prison administration followed by 3 cells. Now on the right there are 5 cells, you'll notice that the 1st one unlike all the others has no access from the corridor and can only be entered by the 2nd cell which has a corridor entrance. This fits the 2-room prison cell setting of Socrates' cell also small flasks (*case 20) were found around the prison which could have been used for hemlock. ***In the Agoro Museum check-out Case #20 which contains Simon's cup/hopnails and the flasks & plate found around the prison also a picture of the prison. HTH Regards, Walter <BR>
#10
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I just wanted to add this to my past post. The "Blue Guide Athens" is back in print and I just recently found a newly published (2000) historical guidebook which also which gives more archaeological evidence to this Prison area location. "The Traveler's Key To Ancient Greece" by Richard G. Geldard. <BR> Also the newly (2001) published "Oxford Archaeological Guides-Greece" also ID's this area as the Prison. They say that the "marble fragments...in a large neat rectrangle" that I mention above actuallys marks the courtyard of the Prison (courtyard can be seen in the "prison.gif" picture above. [ISBN 0-19-288058-0 $20US] Regards, Walter<BR>



