sandralist

Sarge56,

If everything you want to see in Bologna is closed up for Easter Monday, consider this as a day trip out of Florence:

Take the early morning bus from Florence to Greve in Chianti for the annual collector's market, which is held on Easter Monday:

http://www.greve-in-chianti.com/anti...ctors_fair.htm

You can look at page 19 of this bus schedule for bus times:

http://www.acvbus.it/orari/365.pdf

You can eat lunch from the food stalls, but around 2pm, take a taxi to the Castellina in Chianti train station (it's actually in Castellina Scalo) and catch the train to Siena.

The taxi will cost you a pretty penny, and you will probably need to arrange it with a driver in advance. You can find recommendations for drivers in that area on TripAdvisor or Slow Travel. You should also ask for a quote for being driven all the way to Siena.

You will arrive in Siena about 4pm, which is when most of the masses of tourist hoards will be winding up their day and leaving. There are trains and buses out of Siena to Florence late into the evening, so if you get one about 8pm, you will have had plenty of time to see the Campo, the cathedral, the views from the walls and enjoy a gelato or a glass of wine. I don't think museums will be open Easter Monday in Siena, but shops should be since Siena is primarily a tourist town, unlike Bologna.

bvlenci

Sandralist is correct about the balsamic vinegar. 90% of what's sold as balsamic vinegar is plain wine vinegar mixed with grape must (to give it sweetness and cut the acidity) and caramel coloring (to make it resemble the real thing). For what it is, it's very overpriced, and yet the prices are a fraction of the cost of a real Aceto Balsamico Tradizionale di Modena DOP. If it's not called exactly that, it's not the real thing. A very small bottle of the real thing can cost as much as €70, and you won't find it in most food shops, but only in gastronomic specialty shops. It also won't be on the shelves of a shop. I don't a gastronomic shop near where I live that keeps it in a locked cabinet.

It's also true that the food Emilia Romagna is noted for is the plain traditional cuisine. To ask that it be innovative is to ask too much. However, there are innovative restaurants in Bologna. It's got a long tradition, and its fans don't want it to change.

I don't really understand what a foodie is. Suddenly everyone is a foodie. When someone asks where you can get the best pizza in Rome, for example, does that mean they're a foodie? It's a concept that seems very strange in Italy. An Italian who's looking for a pizza, but as long as the pizza he's eating is good, and cooked as he likes it, and doesn't cost too much, he couldn't care less whether there's a better one on the other side of town.

sarge56

Thanks so much everyone!

sandralist- you'll be happy to know that I will be perfectly fine with the pasta in Bologna. As I said, a simple plate of tagliatelle with ragu works for me. (And that is funny about the sauce.. when I eat pasta at a restaurant here, I always ask for the sauce either on the side, or "1/4th the sauce" they normally use! Always been a "light, light sauce" person!

I see no reason that I can't shop at both little shops and Eataly in Bologna. I love little shops and family-run businesses. I will check out both.

I know where good balsamic comes from- so thanks for the info on where I can find that in Bologna!

café- thanks for the restaurant rec in Florence. The best meal I ever ate was in Florence. Alas, that restaurant has closed and I've found nothing to beat it.

If anyone knows of a place in Florence where I can get some perfect pasta purses filled with pear and gorgonzola and served on a bed of arugula with a balsamic-cream sauce... PLEASE reply! haha

Thanks, again, all. The more info the better. I'm just going to have to see if I can find out what will be open/closed day after Easter. (I can see stuff being closed Th/Fr before Easter, but am flummoxed by closings the day after.)

SkipHudgins

We decided about a month ago to stop for few days in Bologna on this fall trip. Never stopped before. Now we have great ideas about what to do and where to eat.
Thanks to all for the info on Bologna.

sandralist

The day after Easter is a national holiday in Italy, and it is customary to celebrate it with an excursion into the countryside. Most of Bologna will be empty so there would be little reason for the shops and restaurants to stay open. They will stay open in Siena because even Italians will head there with their kids as part of being out and about for the holiday.

http://www.explore-italian-culture.c...raditions.html

There is always a chance the shops will be open. I don't know. But if you want to go to the shops in Bologna, you should check first.

I wasn't implying you wouldn't be happy with a simple plate of tagliatelle al ragu. I was responding to DAX's disappointment in not getting something more like contemporary restaurant style. I do encourage everyone going to Bologna however to branch out beyond tagliatelle al ragu if at all possible. Tagliatelle al ragu has become a popular dish in many parts of the world while many of the great pasta dishes of Bologna can only be eaten in Bologna.

In Italy it often possible to ask for a "bis" or a "tris" of pasta -- and what that means is either two different pastas on the same plate or three. It is a great way to sample pasta in that region. Sometimes you will see it on the menu listed that way but other times, if you don't and ask, the restaurant is often delighted you are so interested (sometimes they can't do it but at least you tried!)

DAX

I should probably explain why I like Eataly. I like being able to enjoy foodie quality food inside a nice book/food store with more space and convenient hours. Their young staff was happy to answer all my questions and they had a more relax attitude to let me bring books to thumb through to our lunch table. It was great to have all the great food and books on the table. The multitasking helped us save time and spend more euros in Eataly. We did have to wait a bit for an available table but we had all the food materials and books to look through.

My wife did not appreciate how the lady at Atti was rather uptight though we could understand that the store was understaffed with a long line of customers inside and a group of school children waiting outside the door. Being next door to each other, both Atti and Tamburini were jammed with tourists and locals when we were there, we ended up not buying anything from them.

We found two small local neighborhood stores where the owners could help us more and provide better service. One particular store owner went out of his way to deliver our purchases to our hotel so we could wander without carrying bags. He also chilled a good bottle of prosecco that we wanted to enjoy later that day.

Another thing that I love was the dumpy traditional bakery on Via Galleria that sells Mostarda Bolognese which is a red pastry/cookie containing sweet mostarda. I was told that it only exists in Bologna. Admittedly I bought too much every single day to the point that everyone got tired of it.

DAX

Sandra, I just read all your posts on this thread and appreciate your insights. I envy your situation to live near Bologna. I wonder if you had a chance to try some of the small local restaurants in the hills south of Bologna where supposedly good traditional Bolognese food still exists. I would love to hear your take on those places maybe share some names.

I have to say that I am surprised by your comparison of Bologna to Memphis in the US because I always think that Bologna enjoys a much higher food reputation in Italy. A lecturer in Bologna compared it to Lyon in France which is similarly known for its local regional food but with plenty of creativity, thanks to Paul Bocuse who modernized their tired traditional cooking.

I confess that occasionally I am guilty of venturing into Michelin star restaurants mainly because my friends & I are foodies. We appreciate the art of preparing food to present more flavors or new flavors using local regional products, not the yuzu or the molecular cooking, mind you.

Sandra, since you mentioned Leoni, I am curious if you have ever tried his cooking. I heard that Marcello Leoni used to have a restaurant far outside of Bologna with 2 stars, but his new Leoni restaurant inside Bologna has not gain much recognition at all. I wonder why iPortici won the star instead of the venerable Leoni. We actually had a reservation there but we ended up eating in an old inn restaurant that was highly recommended by a local that I met over lunch. The guy wanted us to try a good example of traditional Bolognese cooking which he said no longer existed inside Bologna. He called a couple restaurants himself and managed to get us a table on the same day. We did enjoy our €35 multi course tartufi dinner menu in the little hilltop hamlet. That said I am now curious what we missed out since you suggested Leoni over i Portici.

sandralist

Mostarda Bolognese only exists in Bologna. It is a special treat and it is lovely filling inside pastries.

The chef at I Portici is Neapolitan. He cooks in the international style, obliterating regional distinction. It is hard to recommend to people going to Bologna who say they want to eat Bolognese food. The meal I had at I Portici was unpleasant, but I don't like that kind of food to begin with, so I'm no judge of it. I wasn't recommending Leoni over I Portici (although I have eaten at Leoni's). I mentioned it as one of many restaurants in Bologna that cater to people interested in Michelin style eating.

I think people are mistaken if they believe Michelin stars are given to restaurants for the quality of their food. Michelin caters to an audience that wants a certain kind of decor and intellectualized elaboration of food. Increasingly Michelin has rewarded novelty and presentation from chefs over honoring traditional flavors. If Michelin were to give stars to solid restaurants with traditional menus, their basic clientele would complain about being guided to those places. Michelin followers are looking for fashion in restaurant eating (it's not art).

Good traditional Bolognese food still exists in Bologna. It rarely includes truffles. I have eaten at plenty of restaurants throughout Emilia Romagna, in all directions from Bologna, so I don't know which ones you are referring to. If you are referring to restaurants in the hills south in Bologna that are touted on Chowhound, you have to take what you read on Chowhound about any city in Italy with a grain of salt. The most frequent posters there (by their own admission) have not eaten at other restaurants for years and years and years. They have two or three favorite restaurants they go to, where the staff are friends, and that's it (which doesn't stop them from claiming everyplace is terrible.) They generally prefer upscale, expensive restaurants that have modern twists to the cooking, one suspects because they are Americans and Americans grow up with variety rather than tradition, so they celebrate the new. But I think if you ate Bolognese food in Bologna and didn't care for it, what would be the point of driving out of town to eat more?

I think people who enjoy Michelin should follow Michelin. It works for them. People more interested in classic cooking while traveling in Italy will do better with the Slow Food guide (Osteria d'Italia).

sandralist

Actually, nobody ever put it better than Marcella Hazan:

"When my family and I ate out in the Italy of my youth and early decades of my marriage, we would look for any plain trattoria where we could find the kind of cooking that was closest to what my mother and father were putting on the table at home. The person making the meal may have been the owner or his wife or his mother, or someone working in total anonymity. He or she was never referred to as the chef, but as il cuoco or la cuoca, the cook.

This was the old world of Mediterranean family cooking, a world where satisfying flavors had been arrived at over time and by consensus. That world hasn’t disappeared, but it has receded, making room for a parallel world, one where food is often entertainment, spectacle, news, fashion, science, a world in which surprise — whether it’s on the plate or beyond it — is vital. This is the world of chefs."

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/29/op...azan.html?_r=0

As much as I can in Italy, I live in the first world Marcella Hazan describes.

DAX

I see your point Sandra and I've heard from some people in Bologna how they don't like seeing outsiders taking over the cooking scene in Bologna. It's ironic that chefs from Naples or Tuscany do really well in Bologna. You may have heard that Eataly is the most successful slow food invasion from Torino, they are now doing a joint venture with the city of Bologna to build their biggest Eataly in the world right in Bologna which will open in 2015. I suppose economic greed led the city to embrace these outsiders instead of supporting their own homegrown cuoci (if you don't like the term chefs). How close to Bologna do you live? Within the BO region or beyond?

Emilia Romagna has always been one of our favorite areas, though my wife favors Modena over Bologna. We do buy l'Osteria d'Italia and the poorly put together local italian guide book for restaurants from Bologna itself. In fact we did one whole trip just following Osteria d'Italia recommendation which was good and cheap as we basically ate in "dumpy" restaurants on local community tables elbow to elbow with Italian speaking tourists, I enjoyed the italian immersion however it's not as much fun for our friends who don't understand Italian. Over time I come to understand that the Michelin guidebooks go beyond taste and tradition into presentation and service. They actually do include the old traditional restaurants that Osteria d'Italia recommends however they don't necessarily give their accolades as they have further criteria.

sandralist

Like I said, sounds like Michelin works for you, and you are right they are focused on presentation (although I often find the service creepy or tense and nowhere near as instincitvely gracious as in a traditional Italian eatery). Your idea of dumpy is probably my idea of human beauty. I am said to hear the news about Eataly in Bologna, if it is true. (By the way, it is "cuoche", but I also mispelled "Osterie d'Italia".) Many sufficiently large cities in Italy have a lot of successful restaurants that serve food from other regions of Italy. Nothing ironic about it. I don't have a problem with it in Bologna. When I want seafood in Bologna I usually go to Sicilian cooks (same in Rome).

I also like Modena, perhaps a bit more than Bologna, but that is because the market is so wonderful. I seldom eat the most talked about restaurants there, certainly not the ones with Michelin stars.

But I think this may all be moot for this thread because if Sarge56 finds out all the shops and restaurants will be closed on Easter Monday, she is likely to cook up another plan for that day (and I would advise her that way).

cafegoddess

"café- thanks for the restaurant rec in Florence. The best meal I ever ate was in Florence. Alas, that restaurant has closed and I've found nothing to beat it. "

I think you will not be disappointed with Zibbibo. They have two locations, I have only been to the one by the hospital. You can take bus #14C and it will drop you right by the restaurant.

sarge56

Thx!