We leave tomorrow for our trip to England - I vaguely remember reading in Rick Steves book that he recommends putting a "L" in the backwindow of the rental car to indicate a student driver. I can't remember if it is supposed to be a green L or a red one - one color indicates you can't drive on Motorways. <BR> <BR>Is this Legit? He presented it as a way to make other drivers more aware of you and cautious if you goof up a roundabout, etc...sounded logical but don't want to break the law...

There is an informal practice in the UK for newly qualified drivers to display a green L sign (with 'New Driver' written under it) to indicate their novice status (and presumably to ask for patience and indulgence from other drivers). Red L sign means you are a learner driver practising for your driving test and something quite different. Most drivers tend to ignore such signs, and don't change their driving style (except perhaps to pass such cars at earliest opportunity). Though you may be a novice at driving in UK, I assume you are an experienced driver and don't see much point in your following this practice. Just drive confidently and safely, and try to adjust your driving style to other road users. Outside of major cities, driving is quite pleasant and most drivers are considerate and you should have no problems.

I give travel seminars and this is one question that comes up almost every time. Rick Steves does wonderful travelogues and his books are moderately useful - BUT every once in a while he springs a LuLu that is just weird. <BR> <BR>This idea is one of those. To be honest, if you have a "L" plate it is more likely than not to antagonize the few aggressive drivers you'll meet up with. The "get out of my way you daft learner" attitude. Almost a target. Driving in the UK is mostly very easy - except in the big cities where public transit is the way to go.

I am so glad I asked!! Thank you very much for the tips. We are cautiously planning on avoiding big cities - renting car in Telford to go through Wales although we are turning the car in in Bath, which makes me a little nervous because it is a city, but by then we'll have a week of driving Left under our belts.

<BR>I respectfully disagree with Janis' statement: <BR>&gt;Driving in the UK is mostly very easy <BR> <BR>In fact, I _strongly_ disagree. <BR> <BR>I moved to the UK from the Midwest 15 years ago, when I was in my late 30's, so obviously I was an experienced driver by then. But of all the difficulties I encoutnered in adjusting to life here, learning to drive well over here was the most challenging. <BR> <BR>There is a lot more to it than just driving on the left instead of the right. <BR> <BR>Before moving here, I had driven in the UK on vacation a few times. I always thought it was "mostly very easy," too - until I learned how to drive _properly_ over here. Only then did I realise what a hazard I had been to other drivers here, and how lucky I was not to have had an accident! <BR> <BR>And I often see American and Continental drivers making the same mistakes here now, completely oblivious to what they're doing. <BR> <BR>In fact, I usually advise Americans _not_ to drive over here if they can avoid it - for the sake of us who live here, if nothing else! <BR> <BR>There are a couple of threads on this board that cover the topic of driving in the UK fairly comprehensively. Please do a search for 'driving' and you should find them. <BR> <BR>

I've driven in England a lot, many times on my own, and I think the advantages in terms of what you can see far outweigh the things you have to be careful about. Just as you would take special care when driving in a new city/area in U.S./Canada you should obviously need to do that while driving in England. Some other advice: on the M roads don't use the middle lane as we do to coast along, that's what the left hand lane is for. Use the middle lane to pass, and the far right if you are really in a hurry and want to fly. I find if I keep reminding myself, particularly when I am taking a corner, that as the driver I am always on the middle line, than I am rarely confused about where on the road I'm supposed to be. Always signal when you are turning! If someone flashes their lights at you on a narrow road, it's okay for you to go ahead, they will wait until you are through. If you are driving on a lot of narrow roads pay attention to where the last pullover area was, you may have to back up to it. Be super alert in the roundabouts, I've never had an accident in one, but I think it's because the Brits pay such attention. Don't try and get into the inside lane with a big lorry to your left, they often use both lanes to turn around the roundabout. I'm sure it's not a sanctioned move but if I get to a roundabout and am not sure where I am going, I head for the middle, check out all the options/exits and then carefully! signal my way and move out. Don't park anywhere near a cross walk, they are very sticky about this area being clear (as they should be), and hand out tickets when in other situations the bobby might look the other way. Except on the M roads I've rarely found the N-S-E-West designations, you usually have to know the next large town along the road (even if it's further than you want to go) and head that way. Many times if it's a small town you are headed to it may not be on a signpost until you get quite close. Have fun! Feel free to contact me if you have other questions.

Joel: I'm sorry you found driving in the UK so difficult. I lived in England for 5 years in my late 20's / early 30's and have gone back once or twice each year for the last 20 years. I have raced Sports cars (in England and here in California) and have helped teach defensive driving courses. I would MUCH rather drive almost anywhere in the UK than in California. Generally the drivers in the UK are better (mostly because they don't start at 16 years old and because the driving tests are so much harder). <BR> <BR>Having said that - if you are a timid driver at home you probably will freak in the UK. But if you are competent at home, you will do just fine in most parts of the UK (Not in the Major cities -- London, Glasgow, Birmingham, Manchester, etc. Even tho' I know my way around, I use public transport in most city centres)

Martha: Don't worry about returning the car in Bath. We did the same thing. We had the car for a week and dropped it off in Bath. We headed straight to our hotel, dropped off the luggage, got directions to the nearest gas station and to the car return. After driving for a week, Bath was not that difficult. You'll be fine.

Hi <BR>speaking from past experience, be sure you have a good city-road map of Bath <BR>when you drive in to return the car, <BR>including indications of one-way streets, etc. <BR>Bath is small, but driving into any city center, on the right side or on the left side, can be nightmarish when you don't know the local streets, particularly in an old city like Bath.

I took driving directions off of <BR>theaa.co.uk. They were lifesavers!

<BR>Hi Janis, <BR> <BR>Yes, a professional racing-car driver might find driving in the UK fairly easy - they're _used_ to driving bumper to bumper at 80+ miles an hour! <BR> <BR>I'm surprised you've avoided the city driving in the UK, though. You ought to try it - the adrenalin rush is, like, totally awesome! <BR> <BR>But another thing Americans really need when driving over here is plenty of patience for rush-hour traffic and for the numerous roadwork-induced tailbacks! <BR> <BR>In the summertime, on the "motorways" (freeways) and "A-roads" (major highways), it's a case of "hurry up and wait". And wait. And wait... <BR> <BR>

I was happy to let my husband do all the driving in England on our trip there last summer. I was the navigator who would occasionally remind him to keep left, especially difficult if you are making a turn onto a road. Whether you are turning right or left, it just feels odd. Something I did that I think made the roundabouts easier was to consider them like clocks, as if you are entering them at 6 o'clock. I would say, "Exit at 3 o'clock" or 10 or 12 or 2. Some roundabouts have roads going off in all directions. <BR> <BR>In 1964 we bought an MGB convertible that we picked up in London. It was equipped for the U.S. with the steering wheel on the LEFT, which felt more natural but made it more difficult to see. With no previous experience driving on the left, we had to drive it off the lot and make our way out of the city. We headed straight for Dover and crossed the Channel, with only a stop for the night in Canterbury. Later we shipped our car home from Antwerp and returned to London by train (giving our car time to arrive in New York).

Joel: Not a "professional" race car driver. Simply a sports car enthusiast who autocrossed my street car in the US and took driving lessons w/ Jim Russell in the UK (which included Formula Ford races on a closed track). I don't "race" on the street. In fact, I seldom get into the fast lane on an M (except to overtake). <BR> <BR>I never said I've never driven in UK cities. Have done - many, many, many times - it is just that it is usually easier to use publc transport due to the lack of parking, etc. <BR> <BR>And I agree, most US tourists are better off staying off the motorways (especially in the M25 region) due to the tailbacks. But they are sightseeing - you don't do that on motorways. Except in the southeast around london, the A and B roads are not usually congested are make for lovely driving.

Back to the original message.. <BR> <BR>It is illegal for anyone but a student drive to display red 'L'-plates. <BR>Student drivers displaying red 'L'-plates may not drive on Motorways and must be accompanied at all times by an experienced driver. <BR> <BR>Although unlikely, a bored policeman may use this as an excuse to stop you. <BR> <BR>Green 'P'-plates should be displayed if you are entitled to drive unaccompanied, but dont expect them to get you much symapthy from other drivers.

<BR>Janis wrote: <BR>&gt; A and B roads are not usually congested and make for lovely driving. <BR> <BR>Maybe compared to LA they're not congested, but compared to the Twin Cities they are! <BR> <BR>Everything's relative, I guess. <BR> <BR>Last Spring, what should have been a 5-hour drive down the A-303/A-30 to Cornwall took us 11 hours because the "lovely" A-road narrowed from 4 lanes (a "dual carriageway") to 2 a few times en route. This was _not_ because of roadwords or accidents; it is the way the road - one of the most-used in the UK - is actually constructed! <BR> <BR>I call that congested. <BR> <BR>(My wife, who's English, now refers to that road as the A-666, by the way!) <BR> <BR>But anyone planning to drive in the UK should enter 'driving' in the Text Search box at the top of this page, highlight 'United Kingdom' in the scroll-down list of countries, and see if they can find the threads on driving in the UK on this board. <BR> <BR>If, after reading those, they still want to drive over here - good on 'em! <BR> <BR>

Joel, did you know that there's a real A666 where I live ( Bolton UK ) ? It's also got a name - "Saint Peter's Way" !!!!!!!

<BR>&gt;there's a real A666 where I live ( Bolton UK ) ? <BR>&gt;It's also got a name - "Saint Peter's Way" ! <BR> <BR>Oh, no! <BR> <BR>Is there no end to British irony?! <BR> <BR>I'll stay off _that_ road for sure, though! (Crossing myself feverishly.) <BR>

martha (and anyone else who plans on driving in Bath), please be forewarned that the road patterns in central bath have recently been changed. Maps will probably be partly inaccurate. <BR> <BR>When we were there on August 5 and 6, even the natives were still struggling with the new traffic patterns, apologizing about their inability to give us simple directions. You might want to call the rental agency's Bath office directly for detailed directions, rather than relying on maps.