We are visiting Italy in June for three weeks (lucky us) and will be using the train to get from one city to another (six different train rides). Is it better to buy a rail pass for those six days (Trentalia) prior to our trip or to purchase individual tickets on the days we will be traveling via rail?

Go to http://www.railsaver.com/railsaver.asp

Enter your particulars, and check the box "Only if railpasses save me money."

Push the calculator button.

It's not the money so much as it's the convenience of getting a ticket and avoiding long lines. Also, I understand there are ticket machines - can our credit card be used to buy the tickets? Are reservations needed or can we jump on a train (we usually are running late)?

Then why did you ask?

I'm outta here.

With a rail pass, you can jump on any regional train. There are no reservations for those trains.

Seats on InterCity trains (IC) can me reserved, for €3, but they don't have to be. You can jump on those trains if you have a rail pass, but you might have to stand.

Italian EuroStar train (ES*) require reservations. These reservation are included in the price of a point to point ticket, but rail pass users have to pay a "supplement" of about $15 on top of the rail pass to use these trains. The supplement will include a reservation.

Train fares in Italy, as in most European countries, are calculated from the distance in kilometres. To decide whether a rail pass is worthwhile, it's the distance you're travelling, not the number of rides that matters.
Basic fares in Italy are cheap and a pass is rarely worth getting unless you doing a lot of rail travel. Ordinary tickets without seat reservations are valid for two months from purchase, so you could buy all your tickets when you arrive in Italy.

>Are reservations needed or can we jump on a train (we usually are running late)?<

They won't let you jump onto a moving train if you are running late.

You will have to take the next train.

Claudia, one thing you must watch out for, if you are new to this board, is that Ira, who posted a response to your inquiry, is a gentleman and very knowledgeable, but he will slip in a zinger or two on you now and then, most often leaving you scratching your head, "What did he mean by that?"

I loved train travel in Italy! We did learn, however, that if we expected to actually be able to sit down on our trip, we ought to reserve a seat in advance. Buying a ticket does not guarantee a seat will be available for you, unless you also reserve the seat. We traveled first class from Milan to Venice and were fortunate to get on the train early (no easy feat when you're dragging luggage) so we were able to find a seat; but our first-class car was full of passengers standing in the aisles with their luggage. Ugh!

I suggest that you call Budget Europe, 1-800-441-2387. The man I spoke to was extremely helpful and friendly and should be able to answer all your questions.

Thanks to all of you who replied - I received some good (and some humorous) responses.

Mary Fran - I will give Budget Europe a call.

You indicated that you have six different train connections in your itinerary. Go to trenitalia.com and check out the prices for each of those connections; it's not that hard. Then compare the total price to that of a six day railpass.

When you do this, make sure you add an additional $15 per person to the cost of the railpass for any leg that you use an Italian EuroStar train (ES*) for the point to point cost, because that is about the cost of the additional supplement you will have to pay to ride a ES* with a railpass.

You should also realize that the point to point cost you get this way is a maximum. There are promotional fares, €29 in EuroStar and €15 Freedom to Travel fares in ICs. These fares require an advance purchase (at least the night before). You might get those fares online or when you arrive in Italy.

Can you buy ticket from the conductor on trains in Italy?

I know in Switzerland, if you're running late, you can just hop on a train and purchase one from the conductor when he comes around. It does cost a bit more than one bought ahead of time.

More and more to discourage folks from buying tickets on trains there is a surcharge on train tickets bought on board and in some countries it is no longer possible. Note that in addition to Eurostar Italia (ES) trains new this year are IC+ trains that also require reservations and a supplement with railpasses - require reservations before boarding for everyone. These are old IC trains that have been refurbished and are now a cross between a ES and an IC train - IC trains still don't require reservations.

PalQ,
I have always heard that the ES* supplement is the equivalent of $15, but I have a feeling it varies with the distance or the cost of full fare. Do you know anywhere that shows the exact cost of supplements? What about IC+ supplements?

Seems the national rail companies aren't exactly making it easy for passholders.

No, a pass is losing its traditional selling point of sponteneity - more and more mandatory reservations popping up as railways try to get rid of too many empty seats i guess. The $15 probably came from RailEurope - it was their flat fee surcharge for ES trains in 2005 when making reservations - it's now $20. I believe in Italy the charge does fluctuate from around $12 to $15 or so but not sure how you would know unless someone recently with a pass has paid them. If you go to www.budgeteuropetravel.com and click on Italian Railpasses on the home page you may find more details - this is a good site with suggested itineraries and details about Italian trains. Otherwise on the trenitalia site i don't think you can make reservations with a railpass so would be hard to find out actual costs. But figure $12-15 - I think IC+ is a bit less. Again i lament the move to obligatory reservations - but i guess i see the need - it's just that if empty seats remain there should be some provision for railpass holders. I've boarded nearly empty TGV trains in France that required reservations - in one case i didn't have time to wait in line for the reservation with my pass and the conductor on the nearly empty train still charged me for it and a heft surcharge for doing it onboard. And now i hear on some TGV trains railpass reservations exist in a limited number even if the train isn't full. Several folks have told me that they were told there were no passholder seats on trains on the Nice-Avignon-Paris line but that they could buy regular priced tickets on that same train!

Hi C,

Thoughts Re railpasses:

Like Traveler's Cheques, they ain't what they used to be.

SNCF, Thalys and Trenitalia offer discount fares.

High-speed trains charge a fee for a reservation if you have a railpass, and you have to spend as much time getting the reservation as you would the ticket.

Low-cost airlines are often cheaper than trains.

Unless your doing a lot of long-distance train travel (and you might want to rethink your itinerary) Railpasses are usually not the best way to go.

I think I read somewhere that EuroStar Italia operates as an independent company (although maybe a subsidiary of Trenitalia). As such, they are not required to accept the Eurail passes at face value. They feel they have a more expensive, premium product and thus charge a supplement to passholders, like Thalys does.

As for the reservation fee charged by RailEurope, ...? They charge $11 for a reservation that costs €3 over there, so what is the relation to their $20 fee and the supplement over there?

Incidently, I think EuroStar also charges the same supplement to someone with a standard fare (regional?) ticket between the same towns.

Hi Larryincolorado

>I think I read somewhere that EuroStar Italia operates as an independent company (although maybe a subsidiary of Trenitalia). <

That's interesting. To the best of my knowledge (TTBOMK) the Italian Eurostar trains (ES*) are just the high-speed Italian trains, owned and operated by Trenitalia, just as TGVs are high-speed French trains.