oops!

that should be before catching a 3:30 train to Bacelona.

The other option follows:
tues - arrive Avignon early evening from Paris. Sleep Avignon.

weds - Avignon, pick up rental car at 4:00. Visit Pont du Gard on the way to Vaison la Romaine. (Is this doable?) Sleep Vaison.

thurs - drive and explore the Rhone area around Vaison. Sleep Vaison.

fri. - Drive to Roussillon. Sleep Roussillon.

sat - explore Luberon area. Sleep Roussillon.

sun - visit the Isle-sur-la Sorgue market and St.Remy and Les Baux on the way to Arles. Drop car by 4:00pm. (Is this doable?) Sleep Arles.

mon - Arles, 3:30 train to Barcelona.

Comments on the two options are appreciated! I don't like the two "one night stands" with option 2, but like that we cover more ground.

Thanks again Stu - I am definitely sold on the car rental! Due to the cost, however, I would like to limit it to 4 days (which both of my itinerary options allow). I did some price checking and found that it is indeed about $45/day for a manual, but $90/day for an automatic! What a dramatic difference. Regardless, I think we'll go with the automatic as I don't drive stick, and don't have one to practice on between now and then.

Arrrgh!!! Car rental places in Arles seem to all be closed on Sunday, so that puts a wrench in option 2.

Adapted itinerary would have to be:

tues - arrive Avignon late pm. Sleep Avignon.

weds. Avignon. Sleep Avignon.

thurs. Pick up car 9:00am, visit Pont du Gard and ??? on the way to Vaison. Do a drive in the afternoon around Vaison. Sleep Vaison.

fri. Put together a drive between Vaison and Roussillon - explore en-route. Sleep Roussillon.

sat. Drive areound Luberon. sleep Roussillon.

Sun. visit Isle sur las Sorgue market and then St.Remy and Les Baux (will anything be open?) on the way to Arles. Sleep Arles.

mon. Drop car by 9:00am. Explore Arles until 3:30 train to Barcelona.

weds - Avignon, pick up rental car at 4:00. Visit Pont du Gard on the way to Vaison la Romaine. (Is this doable?) Sleep Vaison.

You will get to Vaison pretty late - perhaps around 8PM or so, but it's doable. My Michelin Green Guide says that the Pont is open till 9PM. You might consider staying in Uzes this night so you can visit Uzes - one of my favorites. That would give you two one-nighters however.

thurs - drive and explore the Rhone area around Vaison. Sleep Vaison.

Fine

fri. - Drive to Roussillon. Sleep Roussillon.

Take my Lavender Route (in reverse) for a very scenic way to get to the Luberon. You can easily see most of the Luberon in less than two days.

sat - explore Luberon area. Sleep Roussillon.

Fine



sun - visit the Isle-sur-la Sorgue market and St.Remy and Les Baux on the way to Arles. Drop car by 4:00pm. (Is this doable?) Sleep Arles.

That's a lot in 1 day. The market gets going at 9 & you can get a good taste of it if you leave at 10:30. It's about 1 hr from when you decide to leave the market till you arrive in St Remy. That puts you there at 11:30 - before the store closings. St Remy will have many (but not all) shops open. Perhaps leave St Remy at 1:30 (pizza on the run for lunch) and head to Les Baux. It will be crowded - especially if your trip coincides with one of the many Franch holidays in May. See Les Baux till 3:30 and then get to Arles about 4 or 4:15 - not much time to spare. They will usually give you a 1 hr grace on the return time, so I think if you return it by 4:45 you will be OK. This is Sunday, so I suspect that all the rental offices will be closed and they will take your word (I hope) that you returned it by 4:00. If you go to the AutoEurope web site and put your return date as a Sunday, you can see the days/hours that the various offices in Arles (there may only be one) will be closed. Perhaps inquire on Fodors to see if anyone has returned a car to a "drop box" and "fibbed" a little on the return time. You may be in luck on a Sunday.

Stu Dudley

Thanks again Stu! The autoeurope website wouldn't allow me to book a car to return on Sunday in Arles. Maybe I could if I booked by phone. . . It hadn't occured to me that dropping off on Sunday (if they let me) might actually allow for a bit of flexability . . . and I do have a copy of your itinerary, the lavender route sounds perfect for connecting Vaison and Roussillon.

For my lavender route from Vaison, head east & take either the D5/D72 or the D5/D40 towards Montbrun - both are lovely. Take a short up-and-back to Brantes (& make sure you go north of Brantes a little for a good view).

Stu Dudley

Check the autoeurope web site for locations in Arles and then check the hours that they are open.

Underhill, I checked the autoeurope website, and all of the locations in Arles are closed on sundays.

However, I am thinking of yet another itinerary option, similar to the last, which reduces the travelling around, and bases me in or near St.Remy (which seems to be popular on this board!).

Tues - arrive early evening Avignon. Sleep Avignon.

wed - Avignon. Sleep Avignon.

thurs - pick up car 10:00am, drive to Luberon and do Stu's drive. Sleep Roussillon or St.Remy.

fri - Stu's Lavendar Drive. Is this doable in a day from St.Remy? Sleep Roussillon or St.Remy.

sat - Visit Pont du Gard and Uzes. Sleep St.Remy

sun - Isle sur la Sorgue market and Les Baux. How long of a drive is it from St.Remy to Isle sur la Sorgue? How early would we have to leave? Sleep St.Remy.

mon - drop car in Arles by 10am. Visit Arles until 3:30 train to Barcelona.

Alternatively I could spend thurs and fri nights in Roussillon if it makes the driving easier. . . is it worth moving hotels? Or is everything easy form St.Remy?

I am running around in circles with this thing! I can't settle on where to base myself! I am trying to decide between Vaison la Romaine, St.Remy and Roussillon. The MOST I can do is two of those locations (two nights each).

I have 4 days with a car, I have 3 of them roughed in as follows:

1. Pont du Gard and Uzes
2. Luberon driving day (Stu's route)
3. Isle-sur-la Sorgue market and a visit to Les Baux (and St.Remy if we don't spend the night)

I can't quite decide on the 4th, and this is what is giving me trouble deciding on where to stay. I can do one of the following:
- Stu's Lavendar route,
- a day driving around the Cotes du Rhone
- maybe a day in Camargue to mix things up . . .?

Thoughts? Is it possible to combine a Cotes du Rhone drive with the Lavendar route in one day? Or should i just forget about this area? Is heading up to Vaison too far for such a short trip? Rick Steves raves about this area - is it very different from the Luberon?

Thanks for all you help and patience!

>> Is it possible to combine a Cotes du Rhone drive with the Lavendar route in one day?<<

You could do both in the same day if you don't stop & dawdle at too many places. We did it in 1 day AFTER the l'Isle sur la Sorgue market, but it was a long day (we took friends on the route). You probably should skip the Gorges de la Nesque section, however. Just stop in the towns of Sault (for lunch), Montbrun (for a photo - no need to explore the interior of the perched town - it's better from the outside than from the inside), Seguret, Vaison - Medieval section south of the river & Roman ruins if you need to see more Roman stuff, Gigondas if you want to taste some wine, and Simaine la Rotunde (this will cost you 45 mins - so plan accordingly).

Of the three areas you are considering staying in, I think the Luberon is a must. Many/most people think this is the prettiest area in Provence. Next, I prefer the Rhone/Dentilles, but others prefer the Alpilles/St Remy region because of St Remy & les Baux.

I would stay in the Luberon, and then let your schedule dictate the other region where you stay.

I am not a fan of the Carmarque - but others enjoy it because it's different. If I wanted to add another day of sightseeing in the car, I would head north to the Gorges de l'Ardeche & admire this scenic gorge, visit the fantastic cave of Aven d'Orgnac, and then hit Grignan & visit the town & castle there. This is kinda out of the way, but if you stayed 1 night near Uzes after the Pont (visit Castillon du Gard also - it's a short visit), and the next night near Vaison - you could loop up to the gorge/cave & Grignan without too much loss of time going & coming.

Stu Dudley

Ok, I think I have it just about finalised!

tues - arrive early evening from Paris. Sleep Avignon

weds - Avignon. Sleep Avignon

thurs - Pick up car at 9:00am. Drive North to Vaison and then to Roussillon. Cobble together a route using Stu's Lavender and Dentelles routes. Sleep Roussillon

fri - Luberon Drive. Sleep Roussillon

sat - Pont du Gard, Castillion du Gard, Uzes. Sleep Arles

sun - Isle sur la Sorgue market, St.Remy. Sleep Arles

mon - drop car at 9:00am. Arles. Train to Barcelona at 3:30pm

My only final questions are:

1. Should I stay in St.Remy instead of Arles? Arles feels more central.

2. I would also like to add Les Baux. Where would be best? First thing on Saturday? Or at the end of the day on Sunday?

I am finally feeling like I have a handle on this!

There's no need to be limited to opening hours of car rental agencies IF you rent with Avis through the SNCF (French railroad) Web site. After hours, you pick up the car keys from the train station master, and you can drop the keys at the end of the rental at any time. Actually, I'm surprised you can't do with latter with any rental service. We do it often with Avis France. Never a problem.

Saltymuffin,

We went to Provence last April after visiting Barcelona and I completely understand what you are going through planning your trip!! We took the train from Barcelona straight over to Montpelier and rented our car there. I ordered a copy of Stu's Provence trip suggestions and it was very helpful - full of ideas. He is such a great resource on this board and so helpful. It looks like you have your plans pretty well laid out now.

I just want to tell you that my husband and I stayed in St. Remy for the first 2 or 3 nighs and we loved it there. Great restaurants and great location for Pont du Gard, etc.

We love history and I want to let you know how phenomenal Pont du Gard is. We spent almost the whole afternoon there just looking and walking and it also has a very good museum as part of it, so please make sure you give yourself at least 2 hours there.

Next favorite place was Les Baux! It is very large and interesting and fun. Again, give yourself at least 1.5 to 2 hours there. Try to get there early as parking is at a premium.

I am certainly no expert, but reading this thread brought back some good memories of our Provence trip last year! Have a great time!! Barcelona is wonderful - full of great sites to see.

Ginny

Thanks Dave in Paris and Ginny,

Dave, it is possible that autoeurope would allow me to book a car to drop off after hours if I were to call - I only tried the website (my trip isn't until May, so I have time to work out the details!). I did try the Avis website, and it also refused a Sunday drop off. Do you have a link to the car rentals on the SNCF website? I can't find it. Is it only available in French?

Ginny, Pont du Gard and Les Baux are both "must see" spots for us - I just have to figure out where to fit in Les Baux, I understand that early and late are definitely best to avoid the crowds. I am glad to hear that St.Remy offered a good selection of restaurants etc. I would like to spend our evenings somewhere that we can park the car and walk to dinner. St.Remy would likely be much less trouble for Parking and coming and going etc. My only concern if we stay in St.Remy is what to do with our bags in Arles during the day before our train to Barcelona. I will have to research to see if the train station has lockers.

I would bet the train station will have lockers. Hope you find out they do. Keep us updated.

Ginny

Since I am in a similar place in planning, I have been checking back for the responses you get from the other well-traveled 'fodorites'. Keep the feedback coming and thanks!

If you're going to visit Les Baux on a weekend, do it late in the day. Most of the tourist buses and groups have left by 5:30 - 6PM. I live just outside of Les Baux and I see the tourist buses arriving earlier in the day every year... so evenings are still best. And depending on when you're coming, you can see a spectacular sunset from there...

Patricia

I have been to St Remy and Arles several times most recently three weeks ago and they are both wonderful places to visit. While Arles has such wonderful historical sites and is quite central St Remy is a more comfortable place for an overnight. It is a small town with great amenities, very easy in and out driving, easy parking, and a beautiful ambience. Make sure you have ice cream at the cafe ( I forget the name but is was a big glacerie ) on the main square across from the carousel. The grapefruit flavor (pamplemousse) was amazing. I am still thinking of it. Do not miss the Glanums and les Antiques as you exit town toward les Baux...You can feel Van Gogh walking in these parts.

Arles is a bigger city and has a bigger city feel. Parking is not as easy and like all larger towns there are questionable areas and some of those areas have questionable characters loitering the streets at night. The area around les Arenes, the amiphtheater, was nice and very active at night and felt comfortable. I am only referring to after dark in this paragraph....We had a great and reasonable meal in Arles at the Restaurant L'Hostellerie des Arenes
on an upstairs terrace overlooking the Arenes. Spectacular view and delicious lasangna and cheap.

We visited les Baux in the late afternoon. It was less crowded and was breathtaking as you approach the town with the sun lower down over the white ruins...Made for some great photos.

You are correct to be concerned about dropping off your car after hours. Our car rental through sixt would not allow us to drop off the car before they opened. We had a 5:15Am train from Toulon and the agency did not open until 8Am. Luckily I was able to leave the car and keys with a cousin who was able to do the return when they were open otherwise sixt had no provisions for after hours drop which I found unusual.

<< Make sure you have ice cream at the cafe ( I forget the name but is was a big glacerie ) on the main square across from the carousel>>

That would be "Roma"... they make all their own ice creams and sorbets. A routine stop for us on our way home once the weather warms up !

Patricia

Thanks Patricia. That ice cream was great. Yes, the girl did say they make it there. MMM