I usually plan every trip I go on, but I didn't know if I'd need a travel agent for a trip to Italy. What are your thoughts? Here is my rough itinerary for Oct 2012...possibly May since another TA told me that's the shoulder season. I was thinking about doing Italy-France-Spain but I wasn't sure how complicated that would be, or if I'd spend much of my travel time riding in trains. I was looking at the raileurope vs. eurail passes and unsure if I should do point to point in Italy only and then do another France-Spain pass. Also, I found that Austria borders Italy. We're planning on spending 14 days in Italy and 5-10 days in other countries, but don't want to wear ourselves out. Any suggestions would be very helpful.

Rome 3-4 days *don't know about apartment rentals
Florence 2 days and day trip
Naples/Sorrento (visit to Amalfi coast)...possibly 1 night in Sorrento and base ourselves in Naples
Venice 2-3 days (Murano glass making, Burano (sp)-lace making, shopping, etc. )


Tours:
Cooking classes-I don't mind a group tour on this one

Vatican, Sistine Chapel, Pantheon, Academia, Uffizi--I saw a friends of Uffizi pass, but not sure if it may be worth it. I saw that selectitaly.com charges a hefty add on compared to the 6.50 euros that the museums cost; other sites of interest

Possibly a private/group guide at the Vatican, Collosium, etc. and we would like to apply to go underneath the Vatican--I read about that somewhere...

Am I going about things in order? Thanks!

I love art, culture, and food. I am a budget traveler and care more about the experience rather than lodging. I'm not sure if I would be wasting money on a travel agent, or if I should plan my own trip. We'd like to stay 20-25 days in Europe and want to ensure we're not jumping all over the place.

You are not going about things in order if you are referring to your itinerary. Start in Naples, then go to Rome, Florence and Venice. Or vice-versa. 14 days is just barely enough time to see them. If you plan on only 5-10 days more to go to France and Spain, all you can do is visit one city in each country. You do waste close to a full day every time you move, you know.

You don't need a travel agent. For one thing, they cannot help you with hotels or apartments that are budget priced, as they don't get a commission from them. You can make your own plane arrangements online once you decide your itinerary. For apartments, look at sleepinitaly.com, VRBO.com, italyperfect.com. Post the URLs of places that interest you here and get people's reactions.

If you follow the itinerary as I suggested, you will not need a rail pass, as you will only make 3 trips in Italy.

as charnees pointed out, Rome to Florence is a route North, then from Florence to Naples is a pass-through Rome, not an ideal train ride. Likewise, Naples is nowhere near Venice.

Unfortunately 14 days is not enough for 4 major Italian cities (you list Rome-Florence-Naples-Venice), I'd cut it to 2 if you wish to visit other countries effectively. Or 3 if you really prefer Italy.

In which case, you shouldn't visit Naples, make that a separate Southern Italy - Sicily trip (if you are truly interested in that region).

My advice:
Rome (5 nights) - includes flying in (thus, 3 full days without flight or train ride)
Florence (5 nights) - with day trips (Siena, Lucca, etc)
Venice (3 nights) - optional day trip to either Verona, Padua or Trent.
Zagreb (3 nights - including the day you leave Venice via train) - day trips to Split or Dubrovnik will be nearly impossible (no good way to get into Split or Dubrovnik from land)
Vienna (4 nights - includes the day you leave Zagreb)
Fly out in the morning.

the above route includes:
Italy - Central (Latium & Tuscany) + Northeast (Veneto)
Croatia
Austria

Save France and Spain for a different trip. As reasonable as it sounds "Oh I'll go to Spain, France and Italy!" - it's impossible. even if you had 2 months, I'd still advise away from three huge countries like that.

Austria used to border Italy at the Tyrol-Trent border (now Sud-Tyrol is part of Italy), and it bordered Italy's Istria (now Slovenia) via its Croatian-Dalmatian fief (part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire)

Btw my route is 3 weeks / 21 days.

I would either do Italy/France or Italy/Spain (you can reach Barcelona,Spain by overnight ferry from Italy), not all three.

You can reserve Vatican tours or tickets directly with the Vatican.
http://mv.vatican.va/3_EN/pages/MV_Home.html

For the museums in Florence, you can book directly with the museum website. There is a 4€ fee for booking online, but that's much less than sites like SelectItaly charge. Although the regular museum price may be 6.50€ there is an extra fee if there is a special exhibition (usually 3-4€). It seems there is almost always a special exhibition at the Uffizi. Expect to pay about 10€ plus the 4€ booking fee.

http://www.polomuseale.firenze.it/english/Default.asp?

You won't be able to determine if a rail pass is a good idea until you determine your itinerary. Many times it's much cheaper to fly between countries using one of the budget airlines.
www.whichbudget.com
www.skyscanner.net

Thanks for your responses. Does anyone know where I can find a good map at to get an idea of things? Charnees: Thanks for the helpful tips. I didn't realize that I would be backtracking w/Naples/Florence and Rome. I would really like to see Pompeii so I'm guessing it's best to fly into Naples? I was thinking Rome-Naples-Sorrento-Florence (per the suggestion of a TA). Smart3: I am willing to cut things down if necessary. I consider myself an adventurous traveler, so I guess I'm thinking I can do it all-but I don't want to overwhelm myself. I love the Croatia/Austria suggestions and am going to research these locales. Kybourbon, Thanks for the links. I am still interested in France/Spain, but I need to work the itinerary out and see if Austria/Croatia may in fact be better.

Thanks for the info on TA's. I could probably do this myself and save far more money...and find budget accomodations. Thanks again everyone!

And to think a TA told me not to rent bc it wouldn't be cheaper since I'd get free breakfast at hotels. What do you all think?

www.eurail.com/eurail-planning

Had a great time doing France Italy

cheaply by regional train cheaper than pass last may.

Did something similar in October 2 years ago a little cooler

more frontal rain...Spain a little harder to add might

do Switazerland instead...

Like Paris Geneva Interlaken www.stresa.org www.sirmione.com

www.venice-tourism.com Florence Orvieto Rome Pisa Lucca

www.cinqueterre.com SanRemo Nice Arles or Aix then Paris

Found a cheap RT into Paris the hopped on and off

had a great time did not spend a lot...

www.seat61.com for planning

www.skyscanner.net for flights if you do not like training.

Happy Journey,

If you are a budget travel who 'cares more about the experience rather than lodging' then don't use a travel agent. They are the exact opposite. Once you have an itinerary it is easy to find lodging: venere.com, tripadvisor.com, hotels.com, etc. It can take time to look through the many options, but it's not difficult.

With a total of 25 days you can nicely do three of the four areas of Italy you mentioned plus one place each in France and Spain. I would suggest 4 days Rome, 4 days Florence (with day trip to Siena one day), 4 days Venice (with day trip to Verona or Padua). Then fly to either Spain or France (whichbudget.com, easyjet.com - very cheap flights). And do five or six days in each country. Fly open jaw into Italy (either Venice or Rome, both have cheap flights to Spain and France so you can do Italy in either order) and home from either Madrid or Paris.

Alternately, if you like trains you could train from Italy to the south of France for five or six days, then on to Barcelona and fly home from there.

You really need a good guide book so you can decide which areas of Spain and France you want.

Or do all four areas of Italy - add at least another four days for Naples/Amalfi Coast - and then do either France or Spain but not both.

You have tons of options just don't succumb to the temptation to do everything. Have a minimum of three to five days per stop.

Maps are free on the internet. Guide books are free at library, and then often include sample itineraries.
You can get a crappy free breakfast or purchase your own groceries--obvious which I think is better!
If I was so lucky to have that much time off I would spend it all in Italy, although maybe duck into neighboring countries if you are close by, but the temptation to see a good deal of one country is quite tempting and so much to see just in Italy!

Any decent bookstore will have Michelin and other good maps of Italy. If you "didn't realize you were backtracking," you absolutely need to start your research by familiarizing yourself with the lie of the land - with a map.

I would spend all the time in Italy, unless you decide to spend time on the Ligurian coast, in which case you could easily pop over to France for a day's visit, or if you decide to spend time in the lakes region, in which case you could pop over to Switzerland for the same.

You definitely don't need a travel agent, especially one who comments that breakfast being free makes hotel choices a good deal - just for starters, breakfast is free at countless hotels and B&Bs to begin with, or at least is included in the price.

Italy is large enough and divided in such a way that it is almost like visiting several small countries. South of Naples and the Amalfi Coast (including Pompeii) is very different than other areas. If you have your heart set on Pompeii, then give this area more time, at least three or four days.

Rome needs four days. Florence has many possibilities for day trips, etc. Venice is a completely different experience and there are many day trip options. If you want to save time and money, do more exploring of towns and areas near your bases. If you include the lakes, your time frame is perfect for really getting a good experience in Italy.

However, if you really want to visit another country, look into getting a cheap flight. I have found dirt cheap RT from Milan to Prague, Paris and Istanbul. I've also found cheap flights from Naples and Venice to many places. It will take some research, but you might turn up something that would work for you and give you five to seven days someplace else. Of course, you are giving up some of Italy for that.

Plan this yourself. I don't think an agent can give you what you really want.

Absolutely get yourself a guidebook!! They will have many maps, from all of Italy to regions to cities. Start at the library and see what they have. When you find one you like, buy a copy for yourself. Be sure to read the info in the front about what it's like to travel in Italy. Then you can mark it up, tear out pages, etc as you like. Also start using Google Maps or Mapquest or Michelin to see where stuff is in cities. Even though we now have an Ipad, we always go to Italy with a file folder of printed info about each city/region we visit.

The TA is telling you stuff that isn't so about apartments and hotels. Besides breakfast, you can make yourself an inexpensive simple meal at "home" some of the time, saving money. It may be that he/she is ignorant of what an apartment can be like, or realizes he/she won't get a commission for finding you one.

BTW, we found that Murano glass-making demonstrations are not worth it. If you want to go there to buy some expensive glass objects, that's fine. But the demos are nothing to write home about.

Thanks for the immense amount of advice. I def need to find a quality map. I printed some off online, but a lot only give me the 'main' cities in Italy. I will do deeper research and head to the library. Charnees I am glad you told me about the glass making classes. I think I may have to leave that off the agenda. Plus, I'm too frugal to pay for overpriced glass. I like to score great deals. I think I am going to plan this myself. It takes all the fun away just handing over the reins. I am headed to get a guidebook and look @ quality maps.