Paris/England

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Feb 27th, 1999, 05:21 AM

Christine

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Paris/England

We are trying to plan a trip to Paris (5 days) and London (5 days). Does anyone have suggestions on itineraries that would include the best of both cities?

Feb 27th, 1999, 08:56 AM

catherine

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In London my favourite places are. 1. Camden town market. 2. Covent garden. 3. Tate gallery 4. British museum 5. Green park. 6. Inns of court. In Paris my favourite places are. 1. Musee d'Orsay. 2.St Chapelle. 3.Pere'Lachaise. 4.Isle St Louis 5.The Marais, esp place de vosges. 6.the Panthenon. 7.the musee Cluny. I love both cities, but Paris is my love!Everything is wonderful.

Feb 27th, 1999, 02:20 PM

wes fowler

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Christine, While in the planning stages, pick up a copy of the "Eyewitness Travel Guide - London" published by Dorling Kindersley. If it's not available in your library or bookstore, order it on-line from Amazon or Barnes and Noble. It is an EXCELLENT guide for the traveler. In addition to maps that spell out walking tours, interior diagrams of places like the British Museum and St. Paul's, you'll find excellent detailed maps of the city with underground stops identified as well as major tourist sites. Probably the most useful information involves photographs of pound notes and coins, telephones, mailboxes and the like that give you an opportunity to familiarize yourself with "foreign" stuff before you have to use it. You'll also find listings of hotels and restaurants, street markets and information about both major and minor tourist attractions with addresses, opening hours and nearest tube stops. It's a far better guide that Fodor's, Frommer's, Birnbaum's or any of the others. If you're flying to Gatwick Airport, there's a train, the Gatwick Express, that goes from the airport to Victoria station in about 30 minutes and costs about 12 pounds, the cheapest, quickest route to the city. It has ample space for luggage. If you're flying into Heathrow, there's a new high speed line that goes to Paddington station in about 20 minutes; it, too, offers ample space for luggage. There are London tourist information offices in Victoria station, at Heathrow and on Lower Regent Street. Pick up a copy of the A-Z Visitors' London Atlas and Guide. It's about the size of a postal card but has excellent detailed maps of London with major buildings, churches, theatres, etc. all identified. Print is large and easily readable. Underground stations are all identified and bus routes are indicated. Opening and closing times of museums and major sites are listed as well as closest underground stops. It's an indispensable guide and costs less than 2 pounds. Pick up copies of London Planner and Time Out at the tourist information office to find out what's doing in the city. They list special events, theatre offerings, concerts, gallery and museum exhibits for the month, restaurants and the like. Pick up a copy of the Central London Bus Guide as well. The numbers 11, 15 and 38 busses follow the same routes as the major tour bus companies. Take a seat in the top front of a double decker city bus and you can get an orientation of the city at far less cost than in a tour bus. Passes for the underground are usable on the busses as well. Regarding Visitor Travelcards. Some authorized travel agents can secure them or you can contact Britrail Travel International, 1500 Broadway, NY, NY 10036, tel: (212) 575-2667. I'm not certain they're a bargain unless you plan on an early start on your daily travels. In '96, the 3-day pass cost $25.00; a one-day pass (good after 9:30 AM and available at tube stations) cost $4.50. In three days, savings were over $10.00 using the daily passes. Hang on to them, by the way; you need them to exit the tube stations. Must sees: Harrod's and its food court or the less well-visited but equally impressive Fortnum & Mason's food court. Westminster Abbey. Take the tour, it's money well spent. The Tate Gallery: see the permanent exhibit of J. W. Turner's paintings that anticipate the Impressionist movement. Speaker's corner, Hyde Park only on Sunday. Soap box orators, some on the lunatic fringe, exercise free speech to the delight of onlookers and hecklers. The British Museum. Like Harrods, you could spend your entire stay in the Museum and still not see all there is to see. Do see the Rosetta Stone, the Portland Vase and definitely the Elgin Marbles. Fortunately, all are in close proximity to one another within the museum. Pick up a floor plan at the information desk. Stop at the same day box office in Leicester Square in the heart of the theatre district to see what bargains may be available. Visit St. Martin's in the Fields at Trafalgar Square. A church not built by Christopher Wren, it houses an inexpensive, good restaurant in its crypt, a brass rubbing center and stages periodic concerts. Make a brass rubbing and treat yourself to an unusual souvenir of your trip. Tower Bridge: the bridge celebrated its 100th birthday in 1994 and has an excellent exhibit and tour with holographs and animatronic historic personages. It ends with your walk across the Thames from the enclosed catwalk between the bridge's two towers. You get a sweeping panoramic view of London from the Tower of London past St. Paul's cathedral up to Westminster Abbey and Parliament's Big Ben. Most impressive! St. James Park offers an opportunity for a lovely stroll lakeside and a picnic with foodstuffs from Harrods. By all means attend the Ceremony of the Keys at night at the Tower of London! A ceremony that's been performed nightly for over 700 years, it's worth the effort to get tickets. Write to Ceremony of the Keys, 2nd Floor, Waterloo Block, HM Tower of London EC3N4AB. Include two international coupons (available at your post office). Indicate the names and addresses of you and your spouse, desired date and alternate dates and include a large, self-addressed envelope. Allow four to six weeks for a reply. Take the underground to Camden Town. It's on the Northern Line. The Camden Lock Market on Regent's Canal offers handmade crafts, fashions, books, and antiques. You'll find street performers as well. Then, take a canal ride from Camden Town to Little Venice, in northwest London, an absolutely charming part of the city. You'll see houseboats and floating restaurants at Little Venice. At the ride's terminus, you'll find the Warwick Avenue underground station and a bus stop. The Underground is on the Bakerloo line. Visit Sir John Soane's Museum, 13 Lincoln's Inn Fields, Holborn underground. This is a wacky, eccentric collection of beautiful and peculiar stuff in a handsome mansion designed by Soane. He was an architect and Renaissance man who bequeathed his house and collections to England in the early 1800's with the stipulation that nothing be changed. It's a little like rattling around in Grandma's attic with everything from Egyptian sarcophaguses to Regency furnishings. Don't sees: Don't waste time going to Buckingham Palace to see the Changing of the Guards. You'll see nothing significant other than the backsides of other tourists! Instead, watch the changing of the Horse Guards at 11 AM daily, 10AM Sunday. You can get really close to the horse-mounted guards and experience the remnants of Britain's penchant for pomp and circumstance. Horse Guards is on Whitehall about halfway between Trafalgar Square and Parliament. Where to eat? London's museums have some extremely reasonably priced attractive restaurants. By all means eat in a pub. You can usually get a roast beef dinner on Sunday afternoons in one of the neighborhood rather than tourist oriented pubs. Some pub foods defy description: "bangers and mash": sausages and whipped potatoes; "bubble and squeak": potatoes again and cabbage (gets its name from the noise the cabbage makes in the frying pan as its moisture cooks off); "toad in the hole", London's answer to the corn dog - sausage wrapped in batter and fried. The "Plowman's lunch" consists of two generous slabs of English cheese, half a baguette and a small, undressed salad. Steak and kidney pie is just that. The following websites have invaluable information or links relating to Great Britain and London: www.visitus.co.uk/llinks.htm www.great-britain.org/ukguide.htm www.uktravel.com - check the A to Z guide www.londontown.com - London Tourist Board website www.whatson.com - Theatre and concert schedules, reviews, seating plans, prices www.beduk.co.uk - British Bed and Breakfasts www.kgp-publishing.co.uk - British and London Bed and Breakfasts www.dedicate.co.uk/@uk - 100s of links to regional, city and town tourist websiteslink,dedicateucate,ci, Want any more info re London? Feel free to Email me. Here we go with some thoughts on Paris. I don't know what research you've done on hotels but here are some thoughts. Hotels on the Left Bank (Rive Gauche) of the Seine are significantly cheaper than those on the Right Bank (Rive Droit). Many of those on the left bank are smaller, 40 to 50 rooms, converted townhouses or mansions and in residential neighborhoods. There are a couple of websites I suggest you take a look at: www.paris-touristoffice.com has information on what's going on in Paris, exhibits, concerts, etc. and a link to related websites that includes accommodations Many of the recent travelers to Paris who have posted to the Fodor Forum have had highly complimentary things to say about the Hotel Muguet, 11 Rue Chevert in the 7th Arrondisement between Les Invalides and the Ecole Militaire and quite near the Eiffel Tower. There are two websites that feature this hotel. Check: www.paris.org/paris-cgi/pdb/hotel.cgi?ht/2239 for some written comments by guests regarding the accommodations and staffing at Muguet. Then check: www.paris-hotel.com Click on "reservations". When you get a screen with the map, click on #3 Les Invalides. This will take you to a detailed map of the area and a listing of hotels in the area. Click on #6, Hotel Muguet and you'll find photos of the hotel, its rooms and a rate schedule. Queen sized doubles appear to be under $100.00 a night. Do use the Metro to get about and buy a 10-trip carnet to get about. Savings with the 10 trip tickets are about 40% of the cost of individual tickets. Remember to hang on to the Metro tickets. You need them to exit the turnstiles at the end of your trip. (Same goes for the London underground, while I think of it). Two recent travelers to Paris to whom I had given some suggestions mentioned their confusion regarding signs in the Metro. "Sortie" signs lead to the exit; "Correspondance" signs at Metro stations where more than one Metro line converge point to where you go to pick up one of the other lines. Don't know why I never thought to mention that to earlier correspondents I've written to. With only five days in Paris, most of your time is really going to be devoted to the "touristy" sights: Notre Dame, the Eiffel Tower, Champs Elysee and the Louvre. If time permits, you might want to look into the following: Plan to have lunch one day at the rooftop terrace of the department store La Samaritaine. On the ninth floor, it offers a panoramic view of the Seine and Paris. You might want to tie a visit in with your visit to the Louvre since it's in close proximity. Pont Neuf and Louvre are the closet Metro stops. Plan a picnic another day by shopping for baguettes, ham and cheese (jambon et fromage) at one of the shops near your hotel, then dine al fresco in the Luxembourg Gardens, one of Paris' loveliest parks. Luxembourg is the nearest Metro station. At dusk, walk to the western end of the Tuileries gardens. The gardens end at the Place de la Concorde and are raised some 20 feet above street level. Sit on one of the benches and watch the lights come on! The fountains, Hotel Crillon, Champs Elysees, Arc d'Triomphe, the Grande Arche at Defense and Les Invalides will all be stunningly illuminated. It's a wonderful (and cheap) thrill! By all means, after visiting Notre Dame, go visit Ste Chapelle for an extraordinary and stunning contrast. Ste Chapelle is in a courtyard of the Palais de Justice just two long blocks from Notre Dame on the Ile de la Cite. Where Notre Dame is monolithic and cavernous, Ste Chapelle, built at almost the same time, is like being inside a kaleidoscope, brilliant with the colors emanating from its stained glass windows. Visit the Palais Royale and its gardens. (This and a walk along the Rue de Rivoli are good ventures if it's raining. There are sidewalk arcades on the Rue de Rivoli and in the Palais courtyard that will keep you dry.) Some of the shops within the Palais' arcades are interesting. One is a second hand clothing store: the "clothing" consists of fashionable gowns created by France's premiere designers: Fath, Dior, Chanel, Givenchey. Make sure your wife's looking the other way as you pass. There are two interesting and puzzling ornamental fountains in the courtyard. They are filled with huge metal spheres that mysteriously move about for no apparent reason at all. The Palais used to be filled with gambling casinos, cafes and brothels in the old days. Now most of the Palais is dedicated to government buildings with shops and a couple of cafes remaining under the arcade. If you plan to visit Napoleon's tomb at Les Invalides, make a side trip to the Rodin museum. It's alongside Les Invalides. The museum is located in what was the Hotel Biron, a mansion given by the state to Rodin in his later years to serve as his home. It's a lovely building, with an equally lovely garden (and outdoor café). One of the buildings that served as his workshop has many of his models and sketches on display. The gardens and the museum are filled with his works and that of his one time model and mistress, Camille Claudel. It's a lovely small museum in a quiet setting that is well worth a visit. Finally, if time permits and you want to see some of old Paris, visit the "swamp". The Marais (French for swamp or marsh) is a neighborhood with an interesting history of ups and downs. Once fashionable it became a slum over 200 years ago, was rehabilitated only to go into decay in the early part of this century. Now revitalized, the area is filled with mansions, many converted to museums, the Picasso, for one, the Musee Carnavalet, a museum devoted to the history of Paris from its beginnings. I think this is enough, coupled with the "touristy" sites to fill your days in Paris! If you've got any questions or if you feel I can be of any assistance, feel free to Email me. Bon voyage! Wes Fowler

Feb 27th, 1999, 03:17 PM

Geoff

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Wes you gave some wonderful advice. I don't have anything to add, but do want to clarify a situation you may not be aware of. Underground Passes - The $25 price for a 3 day you quoted is correct, but for all zones, not just the central London zone 1. Most tourist don't stray outside of zone 1 and the extra cost isn't necessary. Now for the hitch - the pases are sold in the US by Britrail. But Britrail has chosen to offer only the all inclusive, expensive passes. If you buy the pass over there, you can buy exactly which zones you really need for a whole lot less money. For example I was there in Sept. and bought a 7 day for just zone 1 and paid 13 pounds. That's less than the $25 for the 3 day Britrail sells here! So those multi-day passes really are a good deal, just you gotta buy them over there. The daily also don't start until 9:30 as you said, plus they don't cover the night buses. (and a 7 day pass does) PS. If you're traveling on a weekend they also sell a weekend that's quite a bit cheaper than 2 daily's.

Mar 1st, 1999, 07:48 AM

Robin

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Christine: In the past month, there's been lots of good discussion on 'Top Ten' sites to see in Paris. I can't remember the exact names of the headers, but do believe there's one titled 'Top 10 of Paris' and also, 'Paris Excursions'. I'm planning an upcoming visit to Paris & have found alot of help from this forum.

Mar 1st, 1999, 08:11 AM

Robin K.

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Hello again Christine! When I was in London in November, one thing that I'd wish I'd done is purchase a 'Travelcard' to use on the underground and/or buses. I realized too late that it would have been easier to have one of these passes as so much of London is easily accessed via public transportation. Actually, I'd say that the London tube is probably one of the best & most efficient "people moving" systems in the world. Anyhow, passes can be purchased for 3,4 or 7 days & also for zones 1-2 (where all the 'touristy' stuff is located) or for further out. If you need more specifics, look for the discussion topic "London underground passes" - those folks have it all covered there.

Mar 1st, 1999, 08:14 AM

Robin K.

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Mar 1st, 1999, 07:22 PM

mimi

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Just want to thank Wes for his very thoughtful response and to echo his recommendation of the Eyewitness Guide. It's terrific! I spent an embarrassing amount of time at Barnes and Noble debating the merits of the various guidebooks . . . finally decided to splurge and go with the Eyewitness Guide and never regretted it. Not only are the information and graphics superior to all other guides (sorry, Fodor's) but it's well made of high quality laminated paper . . . will easily survive being stuffed into your purse or bag each day. Well worth the extra cost and weight (compared to other guides.)

Mar 4th, 1999, 03:17 PM

Christine

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Thank everyone for the wonderful information and places to visit. We have alot of planning to do.

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