One day in Rome, from Switzerland. Worth it?
Jun 4th, 2006, 07:27 PM
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One day in Rome, from Switzerland. Worth it?
We have our trip pretty much planned, there are 5 of us, thinking about a night train from Arth-Goldau to Rome and visiting Rome/Vatican City for the day, returning that night on the night train. Anyone done it?, would it be worth sleeping on the train 2 nights? (it is all we can fit in). Any clue to the cost? We are already renting a car and not purchasing Swiss passes or Euro passes at this point, but don't want to drive to Rome. I found the SBB web site and have requested a fare but haven't heard back yet. Any suggestions?
(Thanks PM for the info!!)
(Thanks PM for the info!!)
Jun 4th, 2006, 08:01 PM
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mleafd
I have taken the trip from Lucern to Rome (and back) and though it was through the night, I didn't get any sleep. I spent the weekend in Rome and I took the train back on a Sunday. In any case, the train begins from Rome. I thought it would be empty but I was wrong.
People will toss luggage into the window of the train cars, reserving where they have put their luggage. Though I was one of the first passenger, I didn't get a seat until the train passed Bolognia. I stood for hours.
Seat place reservations are ignored. I can be so full that you couldn't get through the wagon you have reserved.
Certainly it was twenty years ago. I was younger and the system might have improved but Italy is Italy. It's fun but be adaptable.
Blackduff
I have taken the trip from Lucern to Rome (and back) and though it was through the night, I didn't get any sleep. I spent the weekend in Rome and I took the train back on a Sunday. In any case, the train begins from Rome. I thought it would be empty but I was wrong.
People will toss luggage into the window of the train cars, reserving where they have put their luggage. Though I was one of the first passenger, I didn't get a seat until the train passed Bolognia. I stood for hours.
Seat place reservations are ignored. I can be so full that you couldn't get through the wagon you have reserved.
Certainly it was twenty years ago. I was younger and the system might have improved but Italy is Italy. It's fun but be adaptable.
Blackduff
Jun 4th, 2006, 09:01 PM
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How young and robust are you? Sure it can be done.
Take the Cisalpino fast train CIS157 that leaves from Arth-Goldau at 19:50 and gets into Milano Centrale at 22:45.
Reserve couchettes (costs extra but you can stretch out) on the train D1911 that leaves Milan at 23:20 and gets into Roma Termini at 07:15.
Going back up north, take the EuroNight ROMA train EN314 that leaves Roma Termini at 20:40 and gets into Arth-Goldau at 08:08 (no need for a change of trains). This train only has couchettes and sleepers, no sit-up carriages.
Take minimal baggage, be totally pickpocketproof, and go for it.
It'll cost a bundle, but only you can say if it's worth it... The international fare is not being quoted on the websites, but as a hint, the return trip from Arth Goldau to the Italian border costs 102 CHF in 2nd class. Add the Italian portion plus the couchettes-sleeper etc.
Ask for a quote at www.rail.ch
WK
Take the Cisalpino fast train CIS157 that leaves from Arth-Goldau at 19:50 and gets into Milano Centrale at 22:45.
Reserve couchettes (costs extra but you can stretch out) on the train D1911 that leaves Milan at 23:20 and gets into Roma Termini at 07:15.
Going back up north, take the EuroNight ROMA train EN314 that leaves Roma Termini at 20:40 and gets into Arth-Goldau at 08:08 (no need for a change of trains). This train only has couchettes and sleepers, no sit-up carriages.
Take minimal baggage, be totally pickpocketproof, and go for it.
It'll cost a bundle, but only you can say if it's worth it... The international fare is not being quoted on the websites, but as a hint, the return trip from Arth Goldau to the Italian border costs 102 CHF in 2nd class. Add the Italian portion plus the couchettes-sleeper etc.
Ask for a quote at www.rail.ch
WK
Jun 4th, 2006, 10:47 PM
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In my opinion, it will only leave you disappointed you didn't have more time in Rome (plus you will be exhausted). Rome is great, but I don't know that it is so much better than some other, closer options you might have.
Just start planning your next trip...Italy!
Just start planning your next trip...Italy!
Jun 5th, 2006, 03:33 PM
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Thank you all for your input...
I've requested quotes on the EN train from Goldau to Rome, no change in trains, couchettes in a 6 berth compartment approx 1400 CHF round trip. We would leave at 23:52 from Goldau and arrive in Rome at 09:50. (but maybe the Cisalpino train would work better, getting us into Rome 2 hours plus earlier, thanks Wally) We would be returning at 20:50 from Rome to Goldau at 08:08 then next morning. We are a family of 5, 2 adults and 3 'youth'. We probably will never be able to take the 'kids' to Italy (next time) but that is a thought for us Adults.
The other thought is would it make sense to get rail passes for this trip that would get us discounts on the lifts and trains and boats we will be taking on our other adventures in Switzerland?
Boy... I think I have this figured out and then I think some more....
Northshore, Why?
I've requested quotes on the EN train from Goldau to Rome, no change in trains, couchettes in a 6 berth compartment approx 1400 CHF round trip. We would leave at 23:52 from Goldau and arrive in Rome at 09:50. (but maybe the Cisalpino train would work better, getting us into Rome 2 hours plus earlier, thanks Wally) We would be returning at 20:50 from Rome to Goldau at 08:08 then next morning. We are a family of 5, 2 adults and 3 'youth'. We probably will never be able to take the 'kids' to Italy (next time) but that is a thought for us Adults.
The other thought is would it make sense to get rail passes for this trip that would get us discounts on the lifts and trains and boats we will be taking on our other adventures in Switzerland?
Boy... I think I have this figured out and then I think some more....
Northshore, Why?
Jun 5th, 2006, 10:28 PM
#8
Hi M:
Word of warning. I took the exact same train from Goldau to Rome last year. We arrived at 11.30 because of delays. Barely got any sleep down. The compartments were comfortable enough but you heard the brakes quite well and the compartment did move back and forth. Every time we stopped at a station, people were yelling or blowing whistles outside. You are going to do this twice.
Also, organise a guide for your trip in Rome. They'll be able to show you most of the main sights within 3 hours. Then you can rush over to the Vatican and walk back to the Termini, having a quick meal along the way.
If you are still bent on doing this, there's a pizzeria near the train station in Goldau where you can have a nice bite to eat and wait for your train. It's called Terminus.
Word of warning. I took the exact same train from Goldau to Rome last year. We arrived at 11.30 because of delays. Barely got any sleep down. The compartments were comfortable enough but you heard the brakes quite well and the compartment did move back and forth. Every time we stopped at a station, people were yelling or blowing whistles outside. You are going to do this twice.
Also, organise a guide for your trip in Rome. They'll be able to show you most of the main sights within 3 hours. Then you can rush over to the Vatican and walk back to the Termini, having a quick meal along the way.
If you are still bent on doing this, there's a pizzeria near the train station in Goldau where you can have a nice bite to eat and wait for your train. It's called Terminus.
Jun 6th, 2006, 02:51 AM
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NOBODY, and I mean NOBODY here (including the "retired travel writer"
enjoys riding the rails in Europe more than I do, and that includes numerous night trains but IMO this idea is even extreme for ME!
BUT, unlike some of your buddies here, I'll propose an alternative and that is
get on the train to Zurich and fly on a budget airline (www.skyscanner.net) for about $50 each O/W to Rome; even R/T that would be cheaper than the 1400 CHF you are thinking..and you'd have more time in Rome, too, probably.
Just a thought...
enjoys riding the rails in Europe more than I do, and that includes numerous night trains but IMO this idea is even extreme for ME!BUT, unlike some of your buddies here, I'll propose an alternative and that is
get on the train to Zurich and fly on a budget airline (www.skyscanner.net) for about $50 each O/W to Rome; even R/T that would be cheaper than the 1400 CHF you are thinking..and you'd have more time in Rome, too, probably.
Just a thought...
Jun 6th, 2006, 05:22 AM
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A six-berth-compartment is just horror...
You will not get much sleep (if any), and you will be extremely tired when you arrive in Rome. And visiting Rome requires a lot of walking. And imagine waiting in a line for 60 min after a night on the train!
Instead, look for a budget airline ticket!
You will not get much sleep (if any), and you will be extremely tired when you arrive in Rome. And visiting Rome requires a lot of walking. And imagine waiting in a line for 60 min after a night on the train!
Instead, look for a budget airline ticket!
Jun 6th, 2006, 05:27 AM
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If you want to show the kids a bit of Italy, why don't you drive to Lago Maggiore and show them Isola Bella?
Maybe you add Milano and/or Lago di Como. I can easily be done by car.
Rome deserves more time.
Maybe you add Milano and/or Lago di Como. I can easily be done by car.
Rome deserves more time.
Jun 6th, 2006, 03:27 PM
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You are all the seasoned experts... this is totally new for me...It's like I have two people in me one saying 'go for it' and one saying 'what the he.. are you thinking?'
I had briefly considered a flight... i'll look into that as well.
Again.. thank you all for your wise words of advise...
I had briefly considered a flight... i'll look into that as well.
Again.. thank you all for your wise words of advise...
Jun 6th, 2006, 03:41 PM
#13
If you are still determined to get to rome in the day, can i try to persuade you not to go for the vatican and St. Peter's? Because that's all you'll do. Even without a guide,getting the no64 or no 40 bus, from termini station you could fit in the Forum, the colosseum,[buying your tickets at the palatine hill but not going in] the capitoline hill, down into the centro storico and round the piazza navonna, the pantheon and the trevi fountain, and the last time slots for the villa borghese [bookedm in advance]. Then cab back to the station [or airport if you've gone that route].
Or just have a wonderful day wandering around the most beautiful and interesting city, going in random churches and monuments, and drinking in the atmosphere - you'll have just as much fun!
Or just have a wonderful day wandering around the most beautiful and interesting city, going in random churches and monuments, and drinking in the atmosphere - you'll have just as much fun!
Jun 6th, 2006, 04:57 PM
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Don't take the later train from Arth-Goldau, there won't be much left of your day in Rome, especially if it gets delayed. Instead, change trains at Milan, it's cool to move about a bit late in the evening, then you can really settle down for the remainder.
But don't let the naysayers dissuade you - you gave us enough reasons to show that this will be a buzz - it may well be the highlight of the trip for the kids.
So what if it's not the best night's sleep of your life - it's *exciting* and different, and of course you hear the manoeuvering noises and whistles and brakes and PA announcements and doors slamming, that's part of the train experience.
Be brave, do it and have a blast - it's all a matter of being in the right frame of mind and adventure spirit, and you give me the impresssion that you and yours are of the right ilk to pull this one off!
WK
But don't let the naysayers dissuade you - you gave us enough reasons to show that this will be a buzz - it may well be the highlight of the trip for the kids.
So what if it's not the best night's sleep of your life - it's *exciting* and different, and of course you hear the manoeuvering noises and whistles and brakes and PA announcements and doors slamming, that's part of the train experience.
Be brave, do it and have a blast - it's all a matter of being in the right frame of mind and adventure spirit, and you give me the impresssion that you and yours are of the right ilk to pull this one off!
WK
Jun 8th, 2006, 09:21 PM
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When are you going on this trip? I just returned from Rome today and on the way to the airport in our van the line at 1030am was at least a half to a third of a mile long waiting 6-8 persons across to get into the Vatican Museum to see the Sistine Chapel etc. For one day, you might even NOT get to see the Vatican things you want to see? I agree with the above posters who suggested doing something on the lakes in northern Italy/Torino/Milan,etc.
Jun 9th, 2006, 12:32 AM
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I love the lakes area and the idea of it BUT it isn't Rome if that is what your heart is set on.
I still think this would be a lot easier, and I stil think cheaper, if you flew.
It would be even better IMO if you flew AND stayed overnight giving you at least two days there.
So, what did you decide?
I still think this would be a lot easier, and I stil think cheaper, if you flew.
It would be even better IMO if you flew AND stayed overnight giving you at least two days there.
So, what did you decide?
Jun 9th, 2006, 10:07 AM
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Too much effort, stress and expense for a very, limited sub-par experience. Do it when you can enjoy rome at a comforable pace and soak in the experience. Bring the "kids" when they are older, not taking them now is no loss.
Jun 9th, 2006, 10:26 PM
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We haven't decided yet... getting close and I'm not sure if we should go ahead and book it... on the train or wait and see how our trip goes and then decide when we are in CH. We are excited about going to Rome and think that even in a day we can see something in Rome that says... 'WOW!!!!' this is history!! Our 'kids' are 21, 20 & 18 and are excited about traveling in Europe with us. We are looking at this trip as one of a lifetime, and we may never get to spend time like this with them ever again. ie, without spouses, grandkids etc.
Unfortunately, we only will have this day to make it work. I looked at the flights and am leary cuz I don't know the airlines... and if we go in the evening and stay the night then i'm still paying for lodging that night when I could be paying for a train ride instead... does that make sense to anyone else?
Like i've said before, this is a new adventure for us and actually, I've never been off the West Coast of the US, a little inland like Utah/Arizona & Idaho but that's it!!! We are going for it... now what is your advise about reservations, we leave in 2 weeks.. make them here or there? and I'm planning on the Goldau to Milan, then sleeper to Rome arrive at 0715 and then straight to the Vatican... by noon get over to the Panthlon (sp?) and the piazza Norvona? and then Piazza de flori... hopefully time for the collisium... I know it will be a stretch... but then again... it's a trip of a lifetime. We are only there for 2 weeks and have planned the rest of the trip to include 2 Schwingfests on Sundays (my son swiss wrestles in CA), Berner Oberland (sleeping in straw) in Gimmelwald, Jungfrau, Lucerne, Zug, Rhinefelden, Augst Ruins, besides beer, chocolate, werst,
wine, cheese, cookoo clocks, swiss army knives, museums, family, friends, great grandparents homes, Hospenthal, Arth, Muothalal, and many more memorable sites. It is going to be a whirlwind trip... and we are going to soak up every second!!! just pray for us that the weather is GREAT!!! at least on the days that we want to wonder the mountian tops!!
Thanks you all for your inspiration and helpful hints... I'll be watching for more!!
Unfortunately, we only will have this day to make it work. I looked at the flights and am leary cuz I don't know the airlines... and if we go in the evening and stay the night then i'm still paying for lodging that night when I could be paying for a train ride instead... does that make sense to anyone else?
Like i've said before, this is a new adventure for us and actually, I've never been off the West Coast of the US, a little inland like Utah/Arizona & Idaho but that's it!!! We are going for it... now what is your advise about reservations, we leave in 2 weeks.. make them here or there? and I'm planning on the Goldau to Milan, then sleeper to Rome arrive at 0715 and then straight to the Vatican... by noon get over to the Panthlon (sp?) and the piazza Norvona? and then Piazza de flori... hopefully time for the collisium... I know it will be a stretch... but then again... it's a trip of a lifetime. We are only there for 2 weeks and have planned the rest of the trip to include 2 Schwingfests on Sundays (my son swiss wrestles in CA), Berner Oberland (sleeping in straw) in Gimmelwald, Jungfrau, Lucerne, Zug, Rhinefelden, Augst Ruins, besides beer, chocolate, werst,
wine, cheese, cookoo clocks, swiss army knives, museums, family, friends, great grandparents homes, Hospenthal, Arth, Muothalal, and many more memorable sites. It is going to be a whirlwind trip... and we are going to soak up every second!!! just pray for us that the weather is GREAT!!! at least on the days that we want to wonder the mountian tops!!
Thanks you all for your inspiration and helpful hints... I'll be watching for more!!
Jun 9th, 2006, 11:23 PM
#19
Hi Mleafd:
Welcome to Switzerland! I didn't realize you're an American Swiss from California. I'm an American Swiss from Washington (Olympia).
It's great to hear that you'll be going to some Schwinfests. They are a bit boring here because it's a serious sport but the half time show is so nice. Will you be going to the Rigi Schwingfest? That's a wonderful Schwingfest just for the reason that you can sit on a beautiful mountain, look at the Mythen and Wildspitz and enjoy a wonderful Cafe Zwetchgen.
Muothathal? You are going to meet quite a few of your relatives who will want to show you around Switzerland or go hiking with you in the area. Maybe I even know you. If so, I'd love to spend a bit of time with you too.
Think about the Rome trip carefully. It's going to be HOT down there and lots of crowds. Yes, it's amazing and the buildings are incredible but you should be at least two days down there.
Hope to hear from ya!
Welcome to Switzerland! I didn't realize you're an American Swiss from California. I'm an American Swiss from Washington (Olympia).
It's great to hear that you'll be going to some Schwinfests. They are a bit boring here because it's a serious sport but the half time show is so nice. Will you be going to the Rigi Schwingfest? That's a wonderful Schwingfest just for the reason that you can sit on a beautiful mountain, look at the Mythen and Wildspitz and enjoy a wonderful Cafe Zwetchgen.
Muothathal? You are going to meet quite a few of your relatives who will want to show you around Switzerland or go hiking with you in the area. Maybe I even know you. If so, I'd love to spend a bit of time with you too.
Think about the Rome trip carefully. It's going to be HOT down there and lots of crowds. Yes, it's amazing and the buildings are incredible but you should be at least two days down there.
Hope to hear from ya!
Jun 10th, 2006, 06:23 AM
#20
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Hi,Mr/Ms Schuler, We won't be going to Rigi for the Schwingfest... planned our trip around that date but decided that Nate would have a better day at the Appenzeller which is the same Sunday in Urnasch. Rome is still a big question mark on our trip, that's why I don't know if we should book it ahead or just wait. Basically the time that I had available to go to Rome for just that day had originally been set aside to just soak in the Swiss Atmosphere and maybe hook up with those relatives that we want to spend more time with. It's a hard decision... one day i think, yep we're going to Rome then the next I question my decision and want to slow things down... this forum has helped a lot, but I still don't really know what we will decide.
Are you living in Switzerland now? We have been to the Portland, Francis and Tacoma Schwingfests and do know some Schulers from WA with relatives in Central CA.. u related to them?
Are you living in Switzerland now? We have been to the Portland, Francis and Tacoma Schwingfests and do know some Schulers from WA with relatives in Central CA.. u related to them?
