pchen

I am in the beginning stages of planning a 16 day trip (including travel days) to Italy next July. A pair of us (one male and one slow paced days.

We are currently thinking about going to Cinque Terra, but I also hear the Amalfi Coast is amazing. I think we only have time for one of them. Which one should we pick? My brother has a heart condition that doesn't allow him to hike. Is Cinque Terra worth it then?

We don't want to have to worry about booking accomodations during our trip, but also want flexibility to change our itinerary. Any suggestions for accomodations in July?

Here is our temporary itinerary. We are planning to get around by train, but rent a car in Tuscany to see more remote spots. We haven't booked flights yet, so the order may change. I'm more interested in general feedback on our destinations and the amount of time in them.

Rome-Tuscany/Umbria-Cinque Terra-Florence-Venice

Rome
-4 nights
-Side trips to Tivoli and Ostia Antica
-Train to city in Tuscany/Umbria

Tuscany/Umbria-
-2 nights: Explore hill towns in rental car
-Pick up rental car in the first city we're in: what city would be suitable for this?
-Possibly stay in San Gimignano? Not sure.
-Possible towns to visit: Orvieta, Perugia, Assisi, Siena, San Gimignano, Monticiano
Drive to Cinque Terra (stopping by Pisa/Lucca on the way?)

Cinque Terra-
-2 nights
-Drop off rental car in Cinque Terra
-Train to Florence

Florence-
-3 nights
-Train to Venice and pass through Bologna

Bologna-
-Hear it's worth a stay and is less touristy. -Really interested in the food in Bologna.
-Stop on the way to Venice by train, not planning on staying overnight
-We are also interested in other Emilia-Romagna cities like Parma or Modena, but don't know how to fit it in

Venice-
-3 nights
-Side trip to Verona
-Fly back to the States

Whew! That was long. Thanks!

pchen

Oops. Accidentally cut off a bit to the first message...

My brother and I are in our 20s and are first timers to Italy. We love ancient ruins, Italian history, art, architecture, and culture. On the other hand, we would love to sit back and just experience Italy's food, people, and environment. We want a mix between the city and the countryside, between the fast and the slow.

We want to travel on a modest budget, but are willing to pay for amazing experiences if they're worth it.

Thanks!

ira

Hi P,

Usually, one visits the CT to hike the trail between cities.

The AC will be very crowded in July.

The bulk of your trip is north of Rome.

>Tuscany/Umbria-
-2 nights: Explore hill towns in rental car

You will find it hard to get a rental for less than 3 days.

With only 3 days in Venice, I would recommend against a daytrip outside the city.

How about this:

Train from Rome to Orvieto in the AM.
See the town.
Pick up your car and drive to somewhere near Siena. - 3 nights in Tuscany
Drop car in Siena or Florence.
Visit Florence and go on to Venice.

Add a night to Venice or Tuscany.

Enjoy your visit.

JeanneB

I would drop either CT or Venice. Of course, I wouldn't <i>dream</i> of dropping Venice, so CT it is. In order to &quot;sit back...experience Italy's food, people, and environment&quot; I suggest:

Rome: 4 nights
Tuscany/Umbria: 4 nights
Florence: 3 nights (side trip to Bologna)
Venice: 3 nights

IMO, you don't have time to do Verona and Emilia-Romagna. Venice deserves at least the 2 1/2 days and, even then, you'll leave hungering for more.

Given that you've listed several towns in Umbria, San Gim doesn't sound like the best base for you. Siena or even Montepulciano might work better.

Have you considered the uphill climbs your brother will encounter in some of the hill towns?

fun4all4

Hi and welcome to Fodor's. You have clearly done a lot of good research so far and have a good start to your itinerary. However, you have found what I always find when planning a trip (especially to Italy) ..... there is just SO much to see and do and I love it all - it is so hard to choose! So, just a couple of comments - just food for thought:

1. Two sidetrips from Rome may be too many - in fact, even one sidetrip from Rome with only 4 nights including arrival/jetlag may be too many. There is so much to see and do in Rome, especially if you also want time to &quot;sit back and relax and just experience Italy's food, people, and environment.&quot; I'd recommend you leave that flexible and see how the trip evolves.

2. The CT is supposed to be lovely, but it will be very crowded in July and it sounds as if hiking is out. If you had a few more days, you might consider hanging there or somewhere else along the coast for a few days, but it may be best to trim that from your trip which leaves you lots more options and freedom to enjoy the other places you are planning on visiting. Of course, if that is the MUST see, then do it and consider dropping something else.

3. July in Italy is busy and popular. I would not go to Italy without reservations for accommodations at that time of year. Your options will be much more limited with many of the better places already booked ... And, I don't want to spend my vacation days using valuable time looking for a place to stay, especially in prime season. Others may feel differently. I would nail down my accommodations and even sketch out a general plan, then be flexible with the plan (ie. which restaurants, add or subract a museum or daytrip or whatever).

As an itinerary, ira's looks great. Leave out CT, pick up car in Orvieto, and add a night in Tuscany. I would probably add the other night to Rome or Venice as oppposed to Florence, but that is just me. Or, while I don't love one night stays, you could add an overnight in Bologna on your way from Florence to Venice.

Hope this helps! Happy planning and travels!

fun4all4

JeanneB and I were typing at the same time - also good suggestions!

nytraveler

You don;t say much about your brother's heart condition - but the hill towns are exactly that - hills. And frequently the centers are pedestrian only zones - which can mean a LOT of hill climbing - since parking lots are frequently at the botton of the hill outside town walls. Also - in some places train stations are not in the town center - but require some walking/climbing. I would check this out before finalizing your plans.

Is his walking distance limited? Can he do several flights of stairs without trouble? (The latter can affect which hotels you stay in since some budget places don;t have elevators.)

And in July you really MUST have hotel reservations if you want to have decent places without either paying an arm and a leg, being in a far distant location - or giving up amenities like stairs or AC.

nytraveler

Sorry - obviously meant elevator - not stairs.

pchen

Thanks, fodorites, for all your thoughts!

A little on my brother...His heart condition just gets him short of breath easily, and exhausted. He can't do any strenuous exercise. He says he shouldn't hike for more than half a mile. He can walk normally, and with some breaks, can walk up many flights of stairs. It's definitely preferable to NOT have too much walking and such. We still really want to go explore the hill towns, but would it be too hard for him?

It sounds like I should definitely have a strong itinerary and try to stick to it more or less. I am not looking forward to all the other tourists milling around, but that's okay.

I'm not sure if we should make a stop in Bologna. I seem to be getting mixed re ports from different sources, some saying it's the next Tuscany/Umbria, some saying it's skippable and overrated. No one really gives me a good sense of what I should be expecting from Bologna.

We have a new itinerary taking in all of your suggestions.

Rome: 4 nights
Tuscany/Umbria: 4 nights
Florence: 3 nights
Venice: 3/4 nights (depending on flights)

Sounds like training to Orvieto and picking up a rental car is the best idea. We'll drop it off in Florence. How is driving around Tuscany/Umbria? How's the cost of renting? Do drivers need to be a certain age?

In booking accomodations, we don't mind a mix of b&amp;b's, hotels, agricultural stays, and even hostels (double). What types of accomodations would be the best for which cities we want to stay in?

Finally, in trying to find flights, I've been only able to come up with $950 flights. What's the best way to find good deals for airfare?

Again, thanks for all of your help so far.

JeanneB

You might consider dropping the hillier towns. Pienza is relatively easy access. You could base there and tour only to places with an easier walk. Perhaps do some winery tours around Val D'Orcia? (Do a search on &quot;Pienza hotel&quot; and you'll find several hits.) I've read of people parking at the top of Assisi and walking down. I think there was a shuttle back up.

Plenty of posters here can list some accessible towns/stops better than this &quot;armchair&quot; Tuscan traveler. Sometimes you have to force yourself not to concentrate on what you don't see and get the most out of the things you are able to see in your brother's company. Try a seaparate thread asking for advise based on your brother's limitations...ask for advice about easier-to-walk locales and pretty drives in Tuscany/Umbria.

For car rental, most of the US companies have Italian offerings. Try www.autoeurope.com as well. Learn to drive manual shift. Chiusi is another place you could pick up the car. Or Foligno if you want to start near Assisi.

Flights: right now I'm using Kayak.com a lot. There are lots of threads on here listing airfare sites.

Geeklawyer

It doesn't make sense to go somewhere between Tuscany and Florence, since Florence is in Tuscany.

Also, I don't think two days is enough time for Rome itself. Between the Vatican/St. Peters, the Roman forum, Pantheon, Trevi fountain, Borgese museum, Spanish steps, etc you're probably looking at at least three days.

CT is nice, but I wouldn't skip Tuscany or Venice for it.

lovisa

Have you been to Europe before? I think you may be underestimating the amount of walking you will be doing, even if you try to limit it.

Just taking trains requires a lot of walking in the stations, and there are rarely elevators, so you have to go down and up stairs just to make a connection. Rome has long blocks, the famous seven hills, and hot and crowded buses. Venice is completely pedestrianized for obvious reasons, and the part of Florence you'll want to see is mostly pedestrianized. It is almost impossible to visit the &quot;big 3&quot; without a great deal of walking.

You can limit the amount of exertion either by taking a tour for your trip where buses will take you right to your hotels and drop you off at the entrances to hill towns, or by renting a car and eliminating big cities where you won't want to drive or park a car. If you're content to stay in smaller places, then you can arrange to stay in places where there is parking near your accommodation, and you can pick places that are relatively flat, like the aforementioned Pienza. Travelling by car or tour bus does not require nearly the same level of exertion.

JeanneB

I think it was mentioned before, but you can hire a car and driver to take you around the Tuscan countryside (probably from Florence or a country base. It's not cheap, though.

BellaVitaItalia

Gotta chime in on the &quot;CT = hiking&quot; fixation. Yes, there is terrific hiking in the area, but there is so much more to do and see in the Cinque Terre area.

You can take boat tours, wine tasting, snorkeling and scuba diving, explore local, charming villages such as Sarzana, Portovenere, Lerici and Tellaro, take cooking lessons, visit the marble caves of Carrara or the Roman necropolis of Luni, spend a day at the aquarium in Genoa, enjoy the great outdoor market of La Spezia, and so on and so on. Take a look at my blog for more ideas and info: http://bellavitaitalia.blogspot.com/. You will see there is much more to the area than just hiking...

pchen

Thanks again for all of your help! I know that my brother's help will be a limitation, but I believe we will also be able to do some good walking around. He lives and works in Manhattan, and has been fine navigating the city through walking, subways, and cabs. He has also been to Europe a number of times, albeit on business trips. I know that he has taken a lot of cabs in Europe, but he has done some sightseeing by himself where he used more public transportation and walking. I believe I will post on some of the more accessible hill towns, though, just because I do think they will pose a little challenge.

Thanks again for all your help!