Long live the king!

May 1st, 2013, 11:06 PM
  #41  
 
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>>I find the King to be possibly corrupt what with the Madagascar shady deal he tries to hide!<<

It was Mozambique, there was nothing hidden about it and he extricated himself from it, at some financial cost to himself, I believe.
PatrickLondon is offline  
May 2nd, 2013, 01:55 AM
  #42  
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Exactly Patrick.

If you are going to make accusations like that Pal at least check your facts first.
hetismij2 is offline  
May 2nd, 2013, 07:40 AM
  #43  
 
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There is no religious element to the ceremony, even though it takes place in a church>

why not in the royal palace itself - no because a church does put religion into it - that statement above is simply silly - an oxymoron if there ever was one.

Being in a church puts a religious context on it.
PalenQ is offline  
May 2nd, 2013, 07:47 AM
  #44  
 
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More recently, Willem-Alexander has recovered from a scandal over his purchase of a holiday villa in Mozambique, which he sold last year.>

Well I was only echoing the words of the NYTimes as above - recovering from a scandal - scandal to me means misdoings but I guess it was all above board and the NYTimes using scandal was just scandalous?
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May 2nd, 2013, 07:56 AM
  #45  
 
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If you are going to make accusations like that Pal at least check your facts first.>

If you are going to make accusations about me then why do you not check your facts first?

From Wiki:
Main article: Machangulo affair
On 10 July 2008, the Prince and Princess of Orange announced that they had invested in a development project on the Mozambican peninsula of Machangulo.[22] The development project was aimed at building an ecologically responsible vacation resort, including a hotel and several luxury vacation houses for investors. The project was to invest heavily in the local economy of the peninsula (building schools and a local clinic) with an eye both towards responsible sustainability and maintaining a local staff.[23] After contacting Mozambican president Armando Guebuza to verify that the Mozambican government had no objections, the couple decided to invest in two villas.[24]
In 2009, there was controversy and a swirl of rumors about the project and the prince's position in relation to it.[24] Politician Alexander Pechtold questioned the morality of building such a resort in a poor country like Mozambique.[25] There were allegations of corruption involving a contractor on the project and project delays in constructing the schools and clinic.[25]
In November 2009, there were a number of parliamentary debates on the issue and Prime Minister Jan Peter Balkenende was called to answer questions. He explained that the project was a private affair of the prince, but that extra distance had been created between the prince and the business of the project to avoid entanglements by creating a foundation to manage the prince's interests. The press called the independence of that foundation into question, because it was run by a personal friend of the prince's and a co-investor in the project.[25][26]
On 20 November 2009, the prime minister returned to parliament to announce that the prince and princess had decided, because of the public and parliamentary controversy, to sell the property in Machangulo once their house was completed. To this end he read a letter in parliament written by the prince personally. The house was due to be sold on completion in 2010. Its sale was confirmed in January 2012.
PalenQ is offline  
May 2nd, 2013, 10:37 AM
  #46  
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Mozaambique yes, not Madagascar. It was not in anyway corruption on the part of Willem-Alexander. Naive of him, yes, but corrupt of him? No. It made barely a ripple on the surface here.

The ceremony has always taken place in the Nieuwe Kerk, which is de-comissioned, so not actually a church in a religious sense any more. There is no religious aspect to the ceremony at all. The only song sung is the national anthem, which the new King also sang you will have noticed. It is actually a parliamentary session.
hetismij2 is offline  
May 2nd, 2013, 11:19 AM
  #47  
 
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OK not much of a -Gate really but that sordid affair would be something the Queen of England et all or her immediate heir would be involved in - hedck with half the world's wealth given to them at birth why do English royals need to be corrupt - well the whole royalty institution is corrupt IME - a doltocracy where being born first and to whom makes you a king or queen.

That said from what I can gather most Dutch are satisfied with their monarchy so that is the key thing - not something being forced on them and they willingly subject (no pun intended) themselves to having it.

Lond live the king! At least a new face on the euro!
PalenQ is offline  
May 2nd, 2013, 04:03 PM
  #48  
 
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It's funny: that Act of Abandonment he referred to in his speech actually holds that is the King who must be subject to the people, and not the people who should subject to the King. He's a historian by university training and I think invoking the Act was quite clever: he's moving away from the monarchy as a divinely sanctioned institution towards the monarch as servant of the people embodied in and represented by parliament. The only political power the king could have wielded, at the forming of governments, was taken away last way, but it's clear that the ceremonial aspect of the monarchy will now be expanded.
menachem is offline  
May 2nd, 2013, 06:30 PM
  #49  
 
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I thought I was on the US forum and someone was talking about Elvis, Graceland and Memphis. Seriously, they all looked beautiful and it is very exciting.
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May 2nd, 2013, 07:07 PM
  #50  
 
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I'll miss Beatrix saying "Leden van de Staten General" not to mention her hats. She had a dignified reserve I thought but seemed like a good person.

However, my favorite monarch of all-time and I don't just mean for the Netherlands, I mean in world history, was Koningin Juliana, her mother. Juliana just seemed genuinely compassionate, peaceful, down-to-earth and a bit quirky/fun, one of the few royals of any nation I could actually imagine as a friend. I think about her in her boots wading in water in the Watersnood in 1953, helping out, offering words of kindness to the devastated citizenry. A quality human being. I also like what I know about Koningin Wilhelmina, her mother.

By the way, as some of you know I'm improving my Dutch and I noticed at the "inhuldiging" that the queen and others say an oath that goes something like "Zo vaarlijk helpen mij" or "zo gevaarlijk helpen mij" but that doesn't make sense to me. I feel like my ear is hearing it wrong... what is that oath they're saying?
Daniel_Williams is online now  
May 2nd, 2013, 11:29 PM
  #51  
 
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"Zo waarlijk helpe mij God almachtig"

"So truly help me God almighty"

True = waar

There is a choice between the oath (reference to the supreme being) and the promise "Dat beloof ik" (That I promise). It was a real surprise to me that there were a couple of members for the quite radical and formerly maoistic Socialist Party who stated the oath, not the promise. Gasp.

Interestingly, Lutz Jacobi, a Frisian member of parliament made her statement of loyalty in Frisian. Twitter exploded! (Frisian is the second national language)
menachem is offline  
May 3rd, 2013, 01:09 AM
  #52  
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There is a question as to whether her statement was actually legal isn't there?

My son came round yesterday to work on his car, but he was totally exhausted. He works for Dutch TV and spent a week preparing for it all, then was on duty from the start of the live coverage to the bitter end - 9 am to 11 pm, plus of course all the work before and after that, and getting to and from Amsterdam. Wednesday was another long day taking it all down again.
All the sound came through him. He never a saw a thing as he was stuck in a mobile sound studio all day, and all he got to eat were gevulde koeken and coffee by the gallon. Not even an oranje tompoes!
hetismij2 is offline  
May 3rd, 2013, 01:58 AM
  #53  
 
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@hetismij2: pat on the shoulder to him than, well done!

The statement purely is a ceremonial thing. There even are a couple of nitwit politicians that did not take the oath. The statement made by Jacobi was valid though since Fysian is recognized as an official language of the Netherlands, see
http://www.rijksoverheid.nl/onderwer...-taal-erkennen

One funny thing: one of the medals the new king showed on his jacket was the medal for finishing the eleven cities skatingtour
The_lonely_traveler is offline  
May 3rd, 2013, 02:18 AM
  #54  
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Yes, he also wore medals for attending his mother's inauguration, and for his own wedding. Such a hero .

I did read that if they took the oath it had to be in Dutch, even though Fries is a recognised language. The Volkskrant had a bit about it I think.


As for Juliana, she was my neighbour, (I live in Soestdijk) and I saw her a few times in local shops - most memorably in a bookshop in Baarn. Little old lady looking for abook, standing right next to me. I did a double take!
We used to see W-A and his brothers and cousins on occasion too when they were visiting her.

All the local kids used to try to sneak into Soestdijk and see how far they could get before the Marrachausee caught them - the Marrachausee had orders from Juliana to let them get so far and no further and to turf them out with a scolding.

A bit different to the huge security fence around Drakenstein.
hetismij2 is offline  
May 3rd, 2013, 02:46 AM
  #55  
 
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W-A was at university in Leiden in the history department in the same year as me, and I knew some people from his fraternity (Minerva). Saw him in the corridors in Leiden quite a lot as we shared a professor for Dutch Maritime History haha!

Yes that fence around Drakenstein is quite a fence.
menachem is offline  
May 3rd, 2013, 05:56 AM
  #56  
 
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Thanks menachem,

I'm a bit embarrassed I asked actually as I've known the word "waar" since near the beginning... I've answered about a zillion questions "waar of fout" in an exercise book. I don't know why that didn't occur to me!

Thanks hetismij for your story about Juliana in the bookstore!

Best wishes, Daniel
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