the basics - 14 nights, first time in Italy, probably only opportunity to visit. Love history, food of course, nature/hikes, countryside, art, ancient ruins - in other words not much we wouldn't like. My nephew who just spent a summer in Sienna said we shouldn't miss Cinque Terre, that it was the most beautiful place he had ever been. Given that in the past the times we spent driving through countryside and in little towns were some of our favorite memories I'm trying to balance city and country. So here is take two _

5 nights Rome (skip Pompeii, go for Ostia Antica)
skip Florence (or maybe do as a day trip) -
4 nights Sienna and use as base to explore Tuscany
2 nights Cinque Terre (or one night if it can be enjoyed with just 3/4 of a day)
3 or 4 nights Venice.

does that sound reasonable? I know there are so many special places and things to see and experience that there is no perfect answer, but insights are always welcome.

oh and we will be there mid May so hoping to miss the worst of the crowds.

When someone mentions history, food and art as interests, it surprises me to see that Florence might be skipped or visited in just a single day. Obviously, there is much to see in Italy, and your time is limited, so choices have to be made. If the choice was mine, I'd skip the Cinque Terre. I also wouldn't stay IN Siena but in a smaller town in Tuscany and visit Siena for a day.

OK, I just looked at your "bones of the trip" thread. I like your original itinerary more than "take two." But, your trip, your choices....

FYI, here is the earlier thread:

the bones of the trip

What Jean said.

Plus good decision to go with Ostia Antica rather than Pompeii.

High season in Italy begins with Easter, so you won't miss the worst of the crowds. In fact, hotel rooms typically reduce prices in July and August.

I certainly wouldn't go to the Cinque Terre for one night. It will take you over 4 hours to get there from Siena, and almost 6 hours to get from there to Venice, with at least two changes of train in each direction. It's absolutely not worth it.

You might consider Lake Garda instead of the Cinque Terre. The total travel time would be somewhat less, but I still wouldn't go for just one night.

Will you have a car in Siena? Certainly don't bother with CT for less than one full day (two nights), but it eats up an awful lot of travel time. If you are doing a driving trip throughout Tuscany we can suggest other nature alternatives.

To be clear, the OP is contemplating 2 nights in the CT, not a single night.

I think people are responding to that part.

Just to be clear Siena.

I'd stay out of Siena rather than in the town, but the passeggiata is fun in the evening if you decide to stay there

ok this is helpful, thanks (and forgive my spelling - it is just never my strong point). I guess it had looked like one could stay in Siena and take day trips to various Tuscany towns. I'm not sure if we will have a car, or depend on guides. Will depend on my husband's health as he is the driver. What towns in Tuscany would you advise staying in as an exploration base. I was looking at Chianti, but there are so many options.

I hear the group consensus that if we were to do CT it should be for at least two nights. One question I'm having a hard time getting a sense of is how steep the climbs would be. I think taking the walking paths between towns would be the bit we would like, but our health and stamina are sadly not what they once were (nor what I like to imagine they still are!).

I'm trying to balance big city with small town, village or country time. Big cities tend to have awesome museums, food, etc., but they also have crowds. We loved Paris and Lisbon, not so much Athens or Madrid, but have loved the driving around in the countryside everywhere we've been, hence my willingness to sacrifice a city (Florence) in the interest of getting some time in the country. Since we fly into Rome and out of Venice I want to give them each their due.

anyway, your advice has given me a lot to think about!

The CT has been overexposed. There is a flat walk between 2 towns, but as I recall, the walk between the others is more strenuous. We had a great time there for 4 nights in about 1995 - but that was at the beginning of the RS extravaganza. Now, we settle into the Val d'Orcia and don't travel much elsewhere.

Our last visit to Italy in '2017 was:
- 4 nights in Lucca
- 2 weeks in the Val d'Orcia
- 1 week in Venice
- 5 nights in Florence

This was the latter part of September & first couple of weeks in October.

My wife's Shutterfly book
https://stududley.shutterfly.com/55
Click Full Screen

My Italy itinerary - with a heavy dose of Tuscany

See attached

Stu Dudley

Tuscany, a few years earlier. Trip started in Verona, Bologna, then the Val d'Orcia

https://stududley.shutterfly.com/39

Stu Dudley

AFAIK, the flat trail to which StuDudley refers -- the Via dell'Amore -- is still closed. I walked the main lower trails at a time when I was extremely fit, and found some of them a bit challenging because the path is very, very narrow in parts, making it difficult to pass (and people were walking in each direction) and because some of the paths were extremely slippery. Good weather and appropriate footwear are, IMO, musts. (Actually, there were rangers checking the appropriateness of footwear when I was there.) I don't know what the crowds are like in mid-May, but I'm not sure I'd count on finding few crowds -- it's an incredibly popular area, with many day trippers from cruises and elsewhere. Here's some info:
https://www.cinqueterre5.com/en/cinque-terre-trails

As Stu says the Val d'Orcia is really special. My favourite places in that area include Buonconvento (I just know I'm going to make a spelling mistake now) which is near a very ancient monastery (in the hills to the east), Montepulciano, Pienza and San Quirico. Montep (clue in the name) is very very steep. Pienza and Buonconvento are dead flat and Quirico is just a little hilly. Staying in B&Bs is possible in all four towns and there are agriturismi https://www.agriturismo.it/ nearby. Agri. are farm stays normally with breakfast, a chance to meet the locals and look at farms/vineyards etc, evening meals can sometimes be arranged or can be the norm, it depends. Pienza is full of hotels because tourists go there in droves in coaches to stay.

You'll also find local tourist info offers lots of walking info and much of this takes place on "white roads" via bianchi which are gravel paths/roads with very little traffic, obviously Tuscany is hilly but if you want to walk in CT you might find this a little easier and the views can be wonderful.

I'm pretty sure the 'ancient monastery' bilbo is referring to is Abbazia di Monte Oliveto Maggiore. It's about halfway between Buonconvento and Asciano. I think it's definitely worth a visit, but you have to plan your arrival carefully as the abbey closes for a few hours in the middle of the day. Also, if it's raining, there is a long-ish walk from the parking area to the abbey buildings.

https://www.monteolivetomaggiore.it/

We just returned from a trip to the area, stayed 6 nights in Rapallo and used as a base. We did only a day trip to the CT. We originally were going to spend a night (or two) but many of the trails we wanted to walk are closed due to damage from storms and not set to reopen until 2021. We therefore did the hike from Monterosso to Vernazza. The trails from Vernazza-Corniglia-Manarola-Riomaggiore are all closed. Here is a link to a site that gives the current status of the trails. https://www.cinqueterre.eu.com/en/ci...rent-situation

Since we could only walk that one trail, we decided to do just the day trip, which we really enjoyed. The walk from Monterosso to Vernazza took about 2 hours, maybe just under that, and was very good but not easy by any means. The first 30 minutes or so from Monterosso is all up steep stairs as you climb through the orchards. After that, it does flatten out a bit, but there are stairs on and off throughout, and then on the way down as you approach Vernazza there are stairs that make it tricky just because the footing is uneven. We are not "hikers" but do enjoy walks like this and while we made it fine it was very tiring in some parts of the walk. But we really did enjoy it, and you certainly can take your time and rest whenever you need to. It's possible that the trail from Vernazza to Corniglia may open up some time soon (the others are closed long term) and I understand that is somewhat flatter.

Enjoy.

I will just pile on regarding staying outside of Siena in a smaller hilltown. Siena is much bigger than most people realize and the roads around it can be quite confusing to navigate. It was really the only spot in Italy where I have had any problem at all. If you want the Tuscan countryside experience, STAY in the countryside! So many beautiful towns to choose from! Try to drive. If that is just impossible, maybe stick with Siena and have a driver/tour to go out at least most of your days in Siena. You might be able to have a tour pick you up at a smaller town too.

Yes, the lower trails in the Cinque Terre are still closed except for Monterroso to Vernazza. That is the one section we did not hike back in 2000, before it was made a park with admission fees and rangers. We had hoped to take a boat ride back the entire way, but since we were there in mid-May, it did not run on the day we visited. We stayed in Santa Margherita Ligure (which we just loved) and took the train down to Riomaggiore. I can't imagine how crowded the villages must be these days! Agree going just for 1 day is not worth the travel time required.

I will just pile on regarding staying outside of Siena in a smaller hilltown. Siena is much bigger than most people realize and the roads around it can be quite confusing to navigate. It was really the only spot in Italy where I have had any problem at all. If you want the Tuscan countryside experience, STAY in the countryside! So many beautiful towns to choose from! Try to drive. If that is just impossible, maybe stick with Siena and have a driver/tour to go out at least most of your days in Siena. You might be able to have a tour pick you up at a smaller town too.

Yes, the lower trails in the Cinque Terre are still closed except for Monterroso to Vernazza. That is the one section we did not hike back in 2000, before it was made a park with admission fees and rangers. We had hoped to take a boat ride back the entire way, but since we were there in mid-May, it did not run on the day we visited. We stayed in Santa Margherita Ligure (which we just loved) and took the train down to Riomaggiore. I can't imagine how crowded the villages must be these days! Agree going just for 1 day is not worth the travel time required.