Is "horror story" about Italy true?
Jan 4th, 2003, 09:19 AM
#1
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Is "horror story" about Italy true?
I plan to go to Milan (5 days), Venice (2 days)and Florence (7 days) from Sept20-Oct4 2003.<BR><BR>I just read an unflattering travel article in the local newspaper, about how bad it is to see Italy in Sept; I can quote some passages:<BR><BR>"There are just too many people per square inch in Europe. Crammed onto ledge-sized sidewalks, or stuffed into tin-sized cars, the crowd soon morph into a frenzied, horn-blaring, seething mass of humanity, from which any right-minded person should flee, screaming for the silence of the bush, or even a strip mall" ...<BR><BR>The following about Florence: "Once, turning on to Via Cerretani from a side street, we actually had to lne up to get onto the sidewalk, waiting for 5 mins before darting into the opening in the crowd ..."<BR><BR>The following on Venice: "Imagine our horror when we emerged into a sea of fellow travellers. To our dismay, we learned that Venice gets even more crowded than Florence in high season. Sometimes they even close the city down, turning away visitors for days..."<BR><BR>I have been to many big cities in the world which are called crowded, with no problems: I love New York, Hong Kong, Tokyo, London, Toronto etc., but I've never been to continental Europe. I don;t believe that Florence or Venice can get any "worse" in being crowded than Time Square in New York, or any given street in Hong Kong or Tokyo. But reading this article makes me re-think my itinerary, that maybe I should plan my days around smaller towns (day excursions) than waiting for 2 hours to get into the Uffizi (even with reservations)??<BR><BR>Can someone shed the truth? This is not something you can consult in any travel magazine. Thanks
Jan 4th, 2003, 09:32 AM
#2
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I was in Venice in June of 2001 and two massive cruise ships were in port. Frankly, the result were not attractive! But there are always quiet alleys and small lagoons where you can escape the crowds.<BR><BR>Likewise Florence that month was horribly crowded. If it had been my first exposure to that city I would have been sorely disappointed.
Jan 4th, 2003, 09:41 AM
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It is true that Venice and Florence can get crowded in high season, but I personally think they are more crowded in the summer months. At least at the end of September/beginning of October, there won't be large groups of students and families traveling with school-age children. These cities are still a bit crowded in Sept. and Oct. because those are beautiful months to visit Italy. If you are used to crowds (Florence and Venice have nothing on Hong Kong) I say go and enjoy. Just make those reservations for the museums ahead of time. Seeing Italy with some crowds is better than not seeing it at all.
Jan 4th, 2003, 09:41 AM
#5
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John<BR>I think people can find fault in just about anything and granted Italy has it faults every month of the year.<BR><BR>Don't let others spoil your fun. I see no problems with you going to italy in September. You certainly won't have the crowds in September that are present during the summer (especially August). I have been to Venice in September and did not experience what they are talking about. I have not been to Milan and my trip to Florence was not in Sept so I cannot comment on those locations.<BR><BR>Go on your trip, have a good time, enjoy Italy and see its faults as charming.
Jan 4th, 2003, 09:41 AM
#6
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September was my first introduction to Italy and I felt exactly that way about Florence. Have been back twice more at other times, and frankly still feel the same,but I've never felt that about Venice. Sure it gets busy, especially when the cruise ships are in, but not at night, and it is always easy to escape to a quiet corner. We just couldn't seem to escape it in Florence. I hope with 7 days in Florence you either are totally into spending days at a time in museums or else you have a lot of daytrips planned. Personally I'd reverse it for 7 days in Venice (I can't get enough of it) and just 2 days in Florence. And not sure what your plans are for the 5 days in Milan. Have you thought about spending a few nights outside the cities, like in a smaller Tuscan Town or on one of the lakes or the Dolomites?<BR>
Jan 4th, 2003, 10:04 AM
#7
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I haven't been to Venice. But I have been to Florence twice. Unless you are into museums big time, I agree with Patrick. I just don't know about spending that much time there.<BR>If you think you would like to stay in Tuscany that long, I would plan two days in Florence and then pick a small town outside of Florence proper to stay.<BR>Rent a car for a few days, and do daytrips all over the area. <BR>There is some lovely country to see and you can avoid the city crowds.
Jan 4th, 2003, 10:56 AM
#9
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The problem is mass tourism--the tour busses and the cruise ships moving thousands of sheep to the same places at the same time. That is the reason I travel in April or Oct. and spend half of my time--or more--in villages of less than 10k population. It is not just Italy--try Salzburg, Toledo or Rothenburg during high season. And, expend your horizons beyond San Marco, the Uffizi, and the Roman Forum. That is where the busses bring the sheep.
Jan 4th, 2003, 11:03 AM
#10
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September and October are my favorite months in Italy, especially in Tuscany where the light is ethereal that time of year. There is also something subtle about the harvest as a backdrop, even in the cities. Florence has become overrun with busloads of tourists on top of being itself a bustling city. I live in NYC so this is nothing to put me off if I want to go there for a few days. Milan is more of a wide-open sprawling city so can handle its crowds which are more like to be there for business (fashion and design shows) than just touring around--not as "cute" as Florence or Venice. September is not the high season (the late shoulder season I think)and it is better then than the summer months re: crowds, and the weather is more gentle (It can get brutally hot in Florence in the summer).
Jan 4th, 2003, 11:55 AM
#11
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How much credibility can an author really have when they say a "right-minded" person should flee a European crowd (no matter how intense) for a strip mall? <BR><BR>John, Venice and Florence can certainly be crowded with tourists, but it's not THAT bad. I suspect the author of that article has some real "crowd issues." <BR><BR>Also, in Venice anyway, it's not as if every single place you go, you encounter the author's "seething mass of humanity." Piazza San Marco and the Rialto Bridge area are always thronged with people, but there are plenty of other places -- like the Campo Santa Margherita (in Dorsoduro), to name just one -- where you can go to escape the crowds. <BR><BR>
Jan 4th, 2003, 12:25 PM
#12
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We were in Italy last month for the third time in 5 years. We thought November would be light with respect to tourists. Rome was packed and the trains were packed. Sorrento, Naples, Pompeii and Capri were very nice. I would think that the biggest cities are now getting very crowded year round, but the others are not too bad.
Jan 4th, 2003, 03:51 PM
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Thanks for all your input.<BR><BR>My 5 days in Milan is quite "fixed" because I will actually be attending a conference in Stresa, which I believe is an hour by train west of Milan, at the south end of Lago Maggiore. I heard some very postive things about Maggiore so I'll spend some time traveling along the lake, take a boat ride, or a train into Milan when I'm not attending the conference. I had thought about taking a day trip to Switzerland or Austria, but I don't think there's much to do with Julie Andrews and the Von Trapp family not being there.<BR><BR>The reason I picked only 2 days in Venice is that I heard there's not much to do in Venice in the evening. Maybe that's has something to do with the average age of the population there being the highest in Italy (I heard). It,s not that I am a bar-person etc. but it would be nice to have some nice life to "enliven" a city (e.g. some late night cafe). But I also read from this website that there are free church concerts every night (?), so I'm still struggling with deciding if I should just spend 2 days in Venice, or extend that by a day or two.<BR><BR>With Florence I thought that even if the city is terribly crowded, I can always do some day trips, assuming that there are more places to go outside Florence than Venice (although I also heard that Lido near Venice is wonderful). From this website I've learnt about Siena, Pisa and since I have 7 days there I can even take a day trip to Rome.<BR><BR>I hope I am making the right decision ... I'm still struggling and have not made any hotel reservations yet.<BR><BR>Thanks.
Jan 4th, 2003, 04:25 PM
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One of my staff went to Venice on his own via train from Munich, and spent two nights there. He was alone, and still enjoyed it! (It is terribly romantic, so for some, being alone at night in Venice might be less appealing.) Go somewhere friendly for dinner, (I think one place we went was called da Bepi...I'll look it up if you want)...a Rick Steves' suggestion, but not thronged by people as some expect from one of RS's picks. We sat inside with the locals instead of outside with the tourists, and totally enjoyed ourselves. They don't hurry you away from the table and will actually TALK to you. Very laid back, sociable place. Avoid the places that line the canal (they give Venice the bad rep for mediochre food) and check Rants and Raves section on Fodors for good spots. <BR>Venice has been a #1 tourist attraction for something like 900 years?!?! Of course it will be crowded, and with good reason. You really might want to limit your time in Florence to 2 or 3 nights and spend those other nights in a smaller town, like Pienza or Montelpulciano. Regardless, I think you will understand after spending time in Stressa how delightful the country is. And do reserve times to visit the big museums in Florence. It isn't hard to call (from here, maybe 6 weeks before you leave) and set up a time, then walk right past the long lines to pick up your ticket and into the museums. <BR>
Jan 4th, 2003, 05:37 PM
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To Uhoh:<BR><BR>you mentioned a restaurant, the name might be da Bepi ... would you please check/confirm the name and whereabout? Is it expensive?<BR><BR>Also would you know about any good restaurants where locals go? I guess we all try to avoid the "tourist traps". <BR><BR>I tried sending you an email to your address but received an error message saying "user unknown"<BR><BR>John
Jan 4th, 2003, 07:40 PM
#18
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Sorry about the non-email address...long story but I can still give you real advise: <BR><BR>Trattoria da Bepi is the restaurant. It is closed on Thursdays. Location is midway between the Rialto Bridge and Ca d'Oro, next to the Santi Apostoli church. (You could get off a vaporetto at either stop...the church is about a "block" in from the Grande Canal.) It is not expensive. Another good restaurant (on the other side of the Grand Canal, not too far from Peggy Guggenheim's Museum -- Wow did that gal know how to spend her money well -- is a little place called La Cugnai. It has been mentioned favorably by other DC area Fodorites, too.
Jan 4th, 2003, 07:54 PM
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How could I forget - our VERY favorite meal in Venice was at L'Incontro in S. Margherita. The address is Rio Tera Canal (Ponte die Pugni). It was really hard for us to find -- we wished we'd scoped out the route in the daylight -- but it was worth it. We probably spent about $80 for two people, three courses with a bottle of wine and a bottle of water, so it was one of our more "expensive" meals.
