billbarr

LOL, that's OK Sheila. You know of course that I am going to add to those positive comments here and say that I love Athens. I have been travelling there annually for way too many years and still feel sad when it is time to return home.

sheila

Bill Barr who posts here, just loves the place. Adores it. So I'm prepared to be convinced.

I love the sense of ancientness, but remain to be convinced on the rest.

Just out of interest have any of you read Paul Johnston's (not THAT Paul Johnston, silly)new books about his detective Alex Mavros, set partly in Athens. They're really good. They give a sense of the real place

suze

I think the use of the word "a dump" is not fair to ANY city - what does it mean really? I am not a huge fan of Amsterdam, as mentioned by m_kingdom, but certainly would not call the entire city a dump. Or that the hometown of London is more of a dump? This kind of overgeneralization negates any comments I might otherwise consider from a poster.

billbarr

Sheila

I haven't read the book you have mentioned so will seek it out.

One I recently finished and you may enjoy is The Summer of My Greek Taverna by Tom Stone. The tale begins in Crete and moves along to Patmos. It's an honest and entertaining journal.

m_kingdom has written all I would have about the city. I can add nothing else.

I am looking forward now to the Olympics and the greatly increased TV coverage of a city and country I love.

Best regards,

Bill

yipper

Hi,
I heard so many bad things about Athens, that I was pleasantly surprised the first time I visited. It is not one of Europe's beauties, but I find a lot of charm in Athens. I have been there three times and enjoy it more each time. I do think it is the life style and the ancient ruins. Do not expect a lot and go with an open mind, and you will be surprised. Go after the Olympics when, hopefully, most of the construction will be completed.

panoulis

I am a greek who lives in Athens for almost 20 years now. When my family and I first came here, back in the early 80's, I can tell you for sure that the air pollution was much worse than it is today. I still remember the dark brown cloud covering everything, my mother washing the balcony everyday to remove the dust and the daily alarms at the tv news warning the high levels of pollution. Now the dark brown cloud has disappeared. Really it is very rare nowadays to "see" the pollution as you could see it 15 years ago. And don't forget that Athens is surrounded by mountains, that "trap" the pollution and is located in southern Europe where the weather is so much hotter. If "clean" Paris had the same conditions, then believe me you wouldn't write so many nice things about it in your threads.
Of course Athens is not a beautiful city in total. But I don?t think it?s centre, where all the tourists go is an ugly place. There are places that have nothing to jealous of the most beautiful European cities (if any of you has walked the central avenues, Panepistimiou, Stadiou, Vas. Sofias, Irodou Attikou etc. has been to Lycabettus hill, Plaka of course, Psiri, Thissio, Kolonaki will definitely agree with me). You can see so many beautiful neoclassical buildings (among disgusting modern ones unfortunately) at the roads, so many shops, cafes, restaurants, so much life that make this city undoubtedly interesting!
Boring city???? Give me a break please!! However says that either has a low IQ, or thinks that all the fun is in the Plaka area. Plaka is the playground for tourist! It?s not the real city! How many greeks have you seen in Plaka? You have to go where greeks go to see the real thing and then make an opinion. Go to see the sea-side avenue with the huge post modern clubs, feel the energy at Glyfada, the elegance at Kifisia and Kefalari and then come and tell me that Athens is a boring (ha! ha!) and ugly city.

Bravo m_kingdom2. It seems that you got the point!

m_kingdom2

Panoulis:

The trouble with too many (American?) tourists is that they want in your face beauty, whilst I am one who believes that people who say "beauty is what's on the inside not outside" are on the whole ugly, I feel the opposite is true for cities!

Paris has wonderful architecture, but the French are nowhere near as warm and welcoming as the Athenians, Paris has its own character, but for me lacks a certain something. I enjoy some faded grandeur and timeworn elegance. Look deeper, discover the true place!

Most people think that Malta is unattractive, I find it charming, the shelled out buildings, the shabby (and very shabby) chic appeals to me, grand architecture is special in moderation, too much loses its appeal!

KS452

mk2 has affinity for très shabby chic? Who would have thunk it? My, my.

She also has said "Amsterdam is a dump - seedy, and very average architecture".

I think it's safe to assume that anyone espousing drivel such as that should have their advice carefully weighed.

m_kingdom2

Athens has charm, character, and the people are on the whole very warm and refined.

Amsterdam lacked any refinement, the people were far too open, it was seedy and felt menacing, I couldn't wait to leave. I could've quite happily swapped my London for Athens on a semi-permanent basis.

Eleni

Athens is most definitely not a dump. I really love spending time there. There is so much to do, and I have never had anything other than a wonderful time. We live part of the year in Greece - not Athens -- and often spend a series of always pleasant days in Athens. Most areas are very very safe, the restaurants are wonderful (try going to Psirri around 10 are trying out one of the many wonderful restaurants -- Greeks eat much later than some countries), interesting art galleries, fun shopping, consistently friendly people, sidewalk cafes where you can sit as long or as short as you want sipping an iced coffee watching all the interesting passers-by, good walks (for example, going to the top of Mt. Lycovettos), good bookstores (including those with large English language collections), did I mention the food?, and archeological sites that are spectacular despite their familiarity. Greece is not spic and span like Switzerland, but it is exactly it's controlled chaos that makes it so fun. As for falling down buildings or other signs of a casual approach to urban planning, they just make me laugh and maybe shake my head, but it in no way has ever interferred with my enjoyment (the only thing that has ever put me in a bad mood in Athens was sitting to a group of very loud and very ethnocentric Brits who were talking about the Greeks as a less than desirable group -- no offense to the many wonderful Brits who travel abroad every year).
As for air quality, I have asthma and Athens does not bother me. The heat does, however. I would never ever go to Athens again in August because of the heat (last time I did so, I got heat stroke). I worry about the athletes! Good luck!

Myrto

You have to take into account that a huge amount of work is going into getting Athens ready for the Olympics. You can't expect all the stuff to be done with no building sites, no disruption and no ugliness.
I think Athens is a beautiful city in parts and very ugly in others. It's one of those places where you simply have to have good tips about where to go. I guess the locals (and I haven't been one for years) like to keep the best places for themselves ;-)
But boring? I don't think any city I've ever been to has a more vibrant, party lifestyle, especially in summer with all the clubs with their terraces on the beach.
Nowadays there are also many beautiful walks through the historical centre of Athens, with the old buildings carefully restored, as well as the fabulous Adrianou walk which has been completely pedestrianized and much enjoyed by Athenians on a warm weekend.

April

I agree that strolling around made all the difference in my opinion of Athens. My first impression upon landing was that I'd mistakenly landed in some third world country on another continent. It felt like a depressing dream and I wanted to leave. If I hadn't spent some days wandering around, it wouldn't have had time to grow on me. I especially liked it in the evening when it felt quite romantic, and before dawn when there were baking smells instead of exhaust. While it wouldn't be in my top 10 places to return to, I have fond memories. I did have to wonder though, why Athenians looked so darned miserable.

(Amsterdam felt menacing? I just thought the Dutch were among the friendliest people in the world.)

amp322

Wow, for once I will totally agree with m_kingdom2, and say that Amsterdam is certainly not worthy of all the hype it receives as a great city of the world. I think people who only travel to certain popular "hot spots", like Amsterdam, are missing the REST of the world. Much of which is far more beautiful than anything in that place.

As far as the Dutch being friendly, that is true. It is the OTHER dirty scumbags who line the area around Central Station who make the place unhospitable. Those of you who disagree can take it up with my Dutch friends Hans & Kris, who avoid the area at all costs!

As far as Athens being anything like LA, please say it isn't so! I remain intrigued by the place, and will have to check it out when it is in top form again, which I suspect will be well after the Olympics!

sempronia

Totally agree with Thin and M_Kingdom..

Athens is fabulous - but it is an acquired taste- it is not a classical tourist city to come to "ooh and aah" over the buildings... Athens is not about the views, it is about feeling...You either feel Athens or you do not...And it is *not* a Western town, do not expect it to be..At the same time, it is the last front of the Western civilization, Easternized though it may be, which makes it all the more glorious and significant and touching.

It is a very visceral feeling of your roots, of mankind's roots; of myth and the mystique; of history; of the ancient buildings contrasted by development; of Western thought and architecture, yet utterly Oriental in its spirit.

No, it is not about visiting places, like someone said. It is about a 4-hour lunch with friends, discussing Plato with a glass (or few bottles) of wine; it is a morning baklava with Greek coffee overlooking the sea; it is about stolling the streets of Plaka and bargaining with a vendor over a price of some beautiful, handpainted icon, only to become best friends with him for years to come; it is about dancing till dawn and watching the son come up; it is about feeling the sun on your skin and tasting the sea...

If you don't get it, you don't get it..

Giovanna

Apparently I see Athens through the same eyes as m_kingdom and ThinGorjus. For years I wanted to go there and when that dream finally came true I was not disappointed in the least. What could be better than waking up in the morning, walking out onto our balcony and looking up at the Acropolis!

We were there for five days, three before and two after doing some island hopping. Boring, not so unless you're hyperactive. Strolling through the Plaka, stopping for a coffee, talking with shopkeepers, going to a local market and buying cheese, fruit, olives and wine and having a picnic on our balcony was heaven!

Construction, everything torn up--of course, it's in preparation for the Olympics, something near and dear to the Greeks (and should have been there years ago). When we were there Syntagma Square was torn up, something to do with the metro. We visited the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier in spite of it. Have you ever been to an ancient European city where cranes and scaffolding weren't present? Did it ruin your trip?

Acquired taste? Probably. They say that about Scotch too and it's my drink of choice!

milley_5

Giovanna, we chatted about this wonderful city almost a year ago just after I did a trip report about my visit there and then to Mykonos.

I loved Athens and the boss and I are visiting again in October. I am so much looking forward to it.

I hope you return there again soon and also get the chance to have a Shirley moment on my favorite island, buy your Byzantine ring there and look out for the orchestra.

milley

Mark_va

I didn't think Athens was a dump. Just not a show-piece type city like Paris. Has some great things of interest, then you get out to the islands which are the real attractions (aside from the Acropolis, of course).
Actually, it reminded me of parts of Brooklyn, NY. If you look at the layout of the city from the top of the Acropolis, its actually pretty cool.
They let things get a little old and dirty which I guess they're fixing now for the Olympics.
Mark

m_kingdom2

My dear, old battered things have charm. I still use my Gucci suitcases from the 70s, they're scuffed, but all the more characterful for it!

Giovanna

Hi Milley: How nice to hear from you again. Yes, I'm still pining about not buying my Byzantine ring. I do hope to return someday, but at the moment we are currently planning for possibly a trip to Buenos Aires this fall and Croatia next spring. Ah to be independently wealthy and able to go where and when you please!!

TracyB

Hi, we were in Athens last fall, and I was pleasantly surprised how much we like Athens..We only spent 4 nights (which was enough), but we had an awesome time..Walking up and down the narrow streets under the Acropolis, stopping for a beer..shopping,..Now, don't get me wrong..It is certainly not the most beautiful city in the world, but there are much worse..I guess it just depends what type of experience you had while you were there, and ours way very good..People were extremely friendly and the view of the Acropolis from our hotel (Attalos) was superb..