Maira

Imagine...a sip and no drag!

The anti-smoking movement is gaining tremendous momentum in Europe. Effective 01/01/04, no smoking in Ireland's pubs! (Imagine trying to enforce this law in Ireland).

France is taking a tougher stand as well; tougher laws on selling cigs to minors as well as the first lawsuit against four tobacco companies.

You think it'll fly?

InvisibleTraveler

Yes. Like Disney, McDonalds, Coca Cola and Starbucks, the anti-smoking and chain restaurants movement is moving east. It's a little known fact that this is revenge for the reality TV shows that have infiltrated our land after originating in England and France.

capo

For the sake of Irish bar and restaurant employees, I sure hope so.

A recent article about this in the NY Times noted, not surprisingly, that the union representing bartenders was in favor of the ban whereas management was opposed to it, certainly not the first time labor and management have disagreed over safe working conditions.

The tide is turning and there's no going back.

capo

"Antitobacco Trend Has Reached Europe"

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/08/11/in...pe/11TOBA.html

Labor vs. Management: "Unions representing pub employees have pushed for the ban, arguing that bartenders are hurt by second-hand smoke. Pub owners, though, are lobbying vigorously against the measure, saying it would be financially and culturally disastrous and that they would prefer to install ventilation systems."

WillTravel

I hope this works out - it will be so much more pleasant when I get to Ireland and I can then reasonably consider spending some time in the pubs.

sls15

I too, hope it works. As a New Yorker, and a non-smoker, I love what it has done here. No one thought it would fly in New York either, but since it's inception, it has been rather easily accepted. Hopefully the rest of Europe will follow...until then, I will grin and bear it in my travels.

StephenG

YES!
YES!
YES!
Best news on this forum in months.Planning a trip in 2004 to Ireland. Last 2 years traveled to England,France and Italy and being from SoCal expect no smoking.
Can only make more enjoyable.
Smokers Suck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

babette

Gee, StephenG, how do you really feel about smokers?

Jack31

Smoking in europe is a cultural thing. I'd be very surprised if this Ireland ban was true. Living in germany people think it's strange if you don't smoke and you are pushed aside as an outcast at a bar if you don't smoke. Generally I'm instantly identified as a american if I am not seen smoking inside a bar. They even still smoke in government office's in germany. Thats unthinkable in the U.S. People need to understand the cultural differance though. Most European smokers know how bad smoking is but simply don't care.

Intrepid

I'm sure I'll get creamed for what I'm about to say but given what seems to be the national "martyr complex" in Ireland this will just give some of them one more thing to bewail and moan about.

gortmara

Jack31, the ban is indeed true and will be coming into effect by the end of the year. A recent survey in Ireland showed that 2 thirds of people are in favour of it. Naturally the media is focusing on those who are opposed to it- i.e hooked smokers and business interests who are afraid they may lose money (and who always put money befoer peoples' health).

ChatNoir

Jackie31, according to the WHO, around 43% of German males smoke, and 30% of women. You must have had a few other "outcast" non-smokers in the bar. Maybe the amjority will take a stand soon.

Bigchiefally

As a Northern Irishman I think this is a great idea. Wish we would bring it in up here and in the rest of the UK too. Who does the law harm? A few smokers who will have to go outside to smoke. Big deal, maybe they will be prompted into quitting. Who does it help? Just about everyone. No more going into pubs for a quick pint and coming out smelling like an ashtray.

Now if the south could just do something to lower their extortionate drinks prices the pubs would be just about spot on...

ira

Hi all,

I recently heard, on NPR I think, that a woman who was told that she could not smoke her cigarette in a bar in NY was permitted to do so when it turned out that she was smoking an "herbal" cigarette that had no tobacco.

Apparently, it's only tobacco smoke that's bad.

ira

I think that it is barbarous to forbid people from smoking while drinking alcoholic beverages.

ira

OOOOPs,

That was supposed to be :-"

marcus

This ban will apply to EVERY workplace and that includes prisons, where apparently 98% of inmates are smokers. I can see the riots already - 1000's of prisoners going through cold turkey at the same time. The Ban WILL be enforced but a lot of bars will feel the pinch. Let's face it - drinking is our national pastime and most smokers I know will be sipping at home from Jan 1st next. Non smokers probably can't relate to it, but having a few beers and smoking go hand in hand (pardon the pun) for us. I really do appreciate the non smokers side of things, but can there not be a compromise, like a totally separate smoking section? My girlfriend hates smoking but never has a problem once we're in a bar with good air conditioning. Yes, we're a minority, but should minorities not be accommodated as well? I'm pi**ed off already.

ter2000

No it won't work. The law will be passed and nobody will take a blind bit of notice. A bit like the cafes in Paris where it's illegal to smoke at the bar, but everybody does it anyway. Most Irish motorists ignore the speeding laws, and the same thing will happen with smoking.

marcus

Hi Ter,
I'm not sure if you're Irish or living in Ireland, but do you remember a few years ago when it was o.k. to smoke on buses, in the cinema, walking through a supermarket. They stopped all that (except for the odd rebel) without much fuss afterwards. Saying that, I'd love if you were right.

QueenMab

Our town passed a ban against smoking in all public places several years ago. The bar and restaurant owners made a huge fuss, and there was initially a slight drop in business, but within a few months, all was back to normal. Smokers pop outside for a smoke and are back in a few minutes, and everyone enjoys the cleaner air. The bars and restaurants are all just as busy as they ever were. Yes, people had to adapt, and that is harder for some than others. But on the whole I think most people would agree it has been a positive change.