I hope Bush doesn't ruin my vacation
Nov 11th, 2003, 11:09 PM
#21
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Yes, 100,000 protestors have the ability to create quite a disruption--we have seen that first hand here in Brussels.
It's too bad the Bush administration hasn't shown more sensitivity to Blair's current precarious political status and the undercurrents of anti-American (or anti-US government) policies--any serious disruptions to Londoners is only going to inflame passions further. The gracious thing to do would have been to send out signals that they didn't WANT a state visit or to gently decline the invitation, suggesting a state visit would be more appropriate when the war had wound down to the point that most British troops were back home. Even the most ardent admirers of Bush can't really say his Administration has been noted for its grace or sensitivity to others, particularly its allies.
It's too bad the Bush administration hasn't shown more sensitivity to Blair's current precarious political status and the undercurrents of anti-American (or anti-US government) policies--any serious disruptions to Londoners is only going to inflame passions further. The gracious thing to do would have been to send out signals that they didn't WANT a state visit or to gently decline the invitation, suggesting a state visit would be more appropriate when the war had wound down to the point that most British troops were back home. Even the most ardent admirers of Bush can't really say his Administration has been noted for its grace or sensitivity to others, particularly its allies.
Nov 11th, 2003, 11:48 PM
#22
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Just hope you aren't in the air when the pres arrives! We were at the Santa Fe, NM airport when he arrived. It seems they don't announce his arrival in advance for security reasons, and so those planes in the vicinity are put is a holding pattern in advance of his landing and until he is safely deplaned. Reportedly people were airsick from circling for quite a lengthy period.
Nov 12th, 2003, 12:35 AM
#23
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Some further observations:
- The visit is planned for Nov 18-21
- The reason the May 2001 demonstrations were so heavily controlled was that 100,000 people were predicted for them too. There's a cycle to these things: they get hyped, most of us avoid the area, so crowds are below expectations. And you can always rely on November weather to rain on any parade.
- But if you were close to those 4000 people, you would have had a tough time. Whereas if you were anywhere near the 500,000 or so demonstrating last winter for fox hunting, or against the Iraq invasion, you'd have had an enjoyable time. Moral: small, hard-core demos are a lot nastier than really big ones. Avoid them
- The Metropolitan police is reported in The Times this morning as saying it will announce each day's road closures that morning. It is clearly keeping most arrangements secret, so there is a limit to how far visitors can advance plan. All today's papers report that there will be no event in The City, so the Tower looks unaffected
- It's important to remember that a lot of the "London will be chaos" stories come from anti-Bush sources (like Ken Livingston), for whom this visit is an opportunity to find fresh sticks to hit both Vlair and Bush with
- Fodors seems to have censored other speculations about the route. But it's very unlikely he'll use a public airport (and you're likely to be kept in a holding pattern over London any day of the year). I can't see him being near the major museums, though access to the Abbey might be tricky on some days.
- State Visits CAN be fun. We have a standard process for this: whether it's the Sheikh of Abu Dhabi or POTUS, The Mall gets decorated (it is already), and there's lots of soldiers on horses and all the rest. Don't go out of your way to avoid it.
- Cities are about disruptions. Life was disrupted yesterday for the Two Minutes' Silence. Oxford St will be closed on Nov 21 anyway for the Christmas Lights ceremony. The processional area from the Palace to Parliament will be closed briefly the week after Bush' visit for the State Opening of Parliament. And there'll be no end of bad weather, broken-down buses, passengers jumping in front of trains, or idiot Americans starving themselves in public and stopping the traffic. Life. What happens in big cities.
As the old joke has it: "How do you make God laugh? Tell Him your plans". Whatever bit of London gets closed, there's a lot worth doing in the 99% of it that won't be.
- The visit is planned for Nov 18-21
- The reason the May 2001 demonstrations were so heavily controlled was that 100,000 people were predicted for them too. There's a cycle to these things: they get hyped, most of us avoid the area, so crowds are below expectations. And you can always rely on November weather to rain on any parade.
- But if you were close to those 4000 people, you would have had a tough time. Whereas if you were anywhere near the 500,000 or so demonstrating last winter for fox hunting, or against the Iraq invasion, you'd have had an enjoyable time. Moral: small, hard-core demos are a lot nastier than really big ones. Avoid them
- The Metropolitan police is reported in The Times this morning as saying it will announce each day's road closures that morning. It is clearly keeping most arrangements secret, so there is a limit to how far visitors can advance plan. All today's papers report that there will be no event in The City, so the Tower looks unaffected
- It's important to remember that a lot of the "London will be chaos" stories come from anti-Bush sources (like Ken Livingston), for whom this visit is an opportunity to find fresh sticks to hit both Vlair and Bush with
- Fodors seems to have censored other speculations about the route. But it's very unlikely he'll use a public airport (and you're likely to be kept in a holding pattern over London any day of the year). I can't see him being near the major museums, though access to the Abbey might be tricky on some days.
- State Visits CAN be fun. We have a standard process for this: whether it's the Sheikh of Abu Dhabi or POTUS, The Mall gets decorated (it is already), and there's lots of soldiers on horses and all the rest. Don't go out of your way to avoid it.
- Cities are about disruptions. Life was disrupted yesterday for the Two Minutes' Silence. Oxford St will be closed on Nov 21 anyway for the Christmas Lights ceremony. The processional area from the Palace to Parliament will be closed briefly the week after Bush' visit for the State Opening of Parliament. And there'll be no end of bad weather, broken-down buses, passengers jumping in front of trains, or idiot Americans starving themselves in public and stopping the traffic. Life. What happens in big cities.
As the old joke has it: "How do you make God laugh? Tell Him your plans". Whatever bit of London gets closed, there's a lot worth doing in the 99% of it that won't be.
Nov 12th, 2003, 01:34 AM
#24
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First of all, Bush will most likely land at one of the many U.S military bases surrounding London so I doubt there will be any airport problems. Second of all, why not take advantage of the situation? Grap a picket and go make your disatisfaction heard. What a great oppurtunity for you!
Nov 12th, 2003, 04:00 AM
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You are right, this is a travel forum, and this isn't the place to discuss what makes, or doesn't make, an effective protest. My apologies.
You can always take this opportunity to do a sidetrip out of London, say to Bath, Cambridge, or Oxford, if you are concerned.
You can always take this opportunity to do a sidetrip out of London, say to Bath, Cambridge, or Oxford, if you are concerned.
Nov 12th, 2003, 05:48 AM
#28
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CNN World Edition just released the following projected make up of the crowd of London "demonstrators". It looks to be fairly typical for these kinds of far left events:
05% POLs looking for votes
15% horny guys looking to get lucky
05% horny girls looking to get lucky
10% emergency resposnse personnel
10% lost tourists
15% bored and curious citizens
15% news crews
10% thieves and pickpockets
10% office workers going to/from work
05% fruitcake activists with no lives
05% POLs looking for votes
15% horny guys looking to get lucky
05% horny girls looking to get lucky
10% emergency resposnse personnel
10% lost tourists
15% bored and curious citizens
15% news crews
10% thieves and pickpockets
10% office workers going to/from work
05% fruitcake activists with no lives
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