Everyone on Fodors talk seems so knowledgeable with regard to travel. We went to London, Paris, Black Forest and Florence two years go. We booked the trains and flights ourselves and took a few tours we found (Golden, Grayline) in Paris and Florence. However, especially in Paris we got lost here and there and I feel like we didn't experience all that we could have in any of the countries we visited. Does anyone recommend taking guided tours, or are they a rip off, or is it best and cheapest to book ourselves, and book a few independent tours? Do you feel that package tours, (Guided or Independent) from agencies like Liberty travel are cheaper? We are planning on going to Ireland, back to Paris, and Munich this year.Also, is it best to book hotels on the internet, or call directly? I sure would appreciate some help. Thanks!

We usually find the guided tours offered by locals through the TI to offer good value. Most are great but sometimes they will be so so. But I don't know if that is what you were asking about.

Hello ledhead. Well you have already taken a trip to Europe on your own so you are knowledgeable compared to the average person!

My opinion, guided tours are so limited and cost so much more than if one plans their trip on their own.

Getting losts, ah ledhead it happens to all of us. And no matter how much research we do I think it is true to say that once home and then later we read or here about a site or sight that we did not know about or visit while in that particular country. A good reason to return, yes?

I would suggest that before you next trip that perhaps you go to your local library and check out a few books that pertain to Ireland, Paris and Munich. If there is one book that really catches your eye you can than purchase that book. But at no cost checking out books at the library is a good way to get familar with the places you are planning to visit.

Also, although not the best, do try the Search Box here on Fodor's to pull up Fodorites trip reports. And do use Google..you will find a wealth of information.

Most people I know have great success usually with booking hotels in Europe via the internet. But if you feel better about phoning the hotels do that. One thing I know about Italy is that businesses respond better to faxes then to emails..they take faxes more seriously. But I am not sure if that is true in the other European countries.

If you have specific questions regarding the various places you want to visit do post your questions here. Try to make the title of your thread in a way so that you will catch the eye of the Fodorites that can really answer your question. You did that here with this thread of yours.

Also, a lot of Fodorites like to book day tours for the various cities they will be in. Rather a best of both worlds, independent travel with some guided tours for part of the day. Best regards and have fun planning your next trip to Europe.

I'm planning a four week trip from Oz in June with time in London, some time touring England, then Paris, and either Rome or Venice. Its my first trip to Europe and will be going with a friend (as hubbie doesn't want to fly all that way and would rather go barra fishing). I've decided to go the independant way, partly to save money but also so we can choose where we go and how long we stay. Its all quite exciting but somewhat scary too. Just celebrated a milestone birthday and kids are grown up so if I dont go now I never will.

Ledhead, how long did you have in Paris and London on your last trip, and what were your highlights?

There's a great thread called '100 Things to do in Paris' or similar (there's more than 250 ideas in the list) which may help with Paris part.

I'll first offer a disclaimer and say that my husband and I lead small group trips to a specific area of France.

My other disclaimer is that we've personally always been independent travelers, making 13 trips to Europe in the past 15 years... one of them lasting 14 months. Years ago (before I used the internet) I got a little help from a travel agent in booking some hotels, but other than that, I've done my own travel research, planning, and arrangements. It's work, but I enjoy it. I also now teach a non-credit class at our local university on "Planning Your European Vacation." I like talking about travel, and I enjoy helping and encouraging others.

All that said, I know message boards like this tend to be oriented to more independent travelers. This is one of the place we come for help. But not everyone wants to be an independent traveler. And some people need the support provided by a tour.

Some people don't want to do the work that others of us consider fun. They may have demanding jobs, or other priorities. And they may prefer to pay a premium to have someone else do it for them.

Some people enjoy the social aspects of a tour. Rather than traveling with just a spouse or friend or by themselves, they like being with a group

Other people lack some element of confidence, especially if they're an inexperienced traveler. They aren't comfortable heading off to a foreign country alone, especially if they don't speak the language or don't want to drive there. (Others of us think that is part of the fun, but people are different...)

Some people want the expertise that may come with a group tour... someone else who has figured out the best itinerary, the ideal hotels and restaurants, the best times to visit, where to park, the hidden spots and secrets you wouldn't find on your own. They don't want to study and cart around guidebooks-- they'd like someone else to share information.

There are all sorts of tours-- large groups, small groups; tour groups that travel on big buses, small vans, on foot or on cycles; tour groups that are budget oriented and tour groups that go four star all the way; groups that spend each night in a different place and some that base for a week or more in one place. There are some great tours and leaders, and many people do choose to travel in Europe on a tour.

I think it's most important for people to experience other environments and cultures, to achieve their dreams of visiting whatever places call out to them. Know yourself and think about what approach to travel would enable you to have the best possible experience within your own budget.

For many people independent travel is the way to go. But for others the right kind of tour really may make sense.

Kathy

I think you can have the best of both worlds if you travel to the destination independantly...then book a tour with a local guide that can give you commentary on the history.

I've found that with the development of the internet, it's getting easier to plan your local activities before you arrive. You can book most musuems online now...guided city tours and small local interest tours such as wineries etc. Hotels are very easy to book on the internet and there are so many great sites these days that cover large areas such as Tuscany.ne

I have done both escorted and independant and although I enjoyed both....I much prefer independant touring as you have more freedom to deviate from the itinerary. If you like a place you can linger...if you don't...you can move on. You also get more of the local flavour in my opinion as you interact more with the local people.

I don't think there is any wrong or right answer...each has its pros and cons and is down to personal preference.

No right or wrong answer, it's a personal choice. And even that answer might vary depending on the destination.

I go on my own. I would not want the structure of a bus tour, having to travel with a bunch of strangers, getting up early every morning, having someone tell me when & what to do... I'd rather be lost in Paris! That said, I don't much care about seeing anything in particular in any given city. It's more about just being there soaking up the atmosphere.

I don't think all tours are a rip-off but you do need to read carefully to understand what you are (and aren't) paying for (is my impression). I think they can be cheaper than traveling on your own, especially if you want to see lots of places in a short period of time.

Sorry...than should read

Tuscany.net

I think it's a personal choice and both are fun. I have done both and enjoyed every moment. I do think that children might be bored by certain large bus tours though. There is a lot of sitting in the coach. If you want to to a bunch of places, then the package deals do come out less expensive in my experience.

I think that bus tours definitely have their place...we have taken several, both good and bad, and so much depends on the facilities they provide, and I think you get what you pay for in every respect...have done fairly small groups (Caravan has good tours) and were exceptionally pleased. Took a large trip around Britain several years ago and it was a disaster..to many hours on the bus, limited facilities and dining opportunities due to our size, set menu's, rigid programs, etc. Best to study well each group you might be considering.

My sister and I are often travel companions. When we travel together, she always plans our trip and books transportation and hotels. She researches and makes most arrangements online. She loves to do this, so she ends up making fantastic spreadsheets containing an amazing amount of information.

When I travel alone, I use guidebooks (which I love to read anyway) and to a lesser extent, the internet. I tend to reserve a hotel room for my first night and possibly my last night. I may also reserve a car, but when I'm alone I really prefer to go by train, since I enjoy talking to people I meet on the trains.

I do sometimes take day tours, but my experience has been that the big organized tours are more expensive than traveling on one's own. I prefer smaller, more individual hotels, and I like the freedom of wandering around and wasting a lot of time rather than being herded efficiently from one event or sight to another.

Thank you all for your great input. I am a separated 49 year old woman, who likes to travel with her two best friends, my daughters, (17 and 18). Your reassurance that I am doing the right thing booking vacations independently was greatly appreciated. With limited money, and just the three of us, I now know independent with some side tours is the way to go. Frankly, I love researching travel sites and reading travel books!

P.S. to Caseya: Good for you deciding to travel with a friend. I held back too long myself because my husband wasn't a traveler. But I soon realized, life is short, you gotta make yourself happy too! We had 5 days in Paris, and 4 in London. Loved both! Highlights in London were Tower of London, tour to Stratford-upon-Avon to see Shakespeare's birthplace, Ann Hathaway house and play, the endless shops and restaurants near Picadilly Circus. We saw the Palace, but aren't so interested in the Royals. In Paris, (my favorite) we took an evening cruise on the Seine, had dinner at the Eiffel tower, walked the length of the Champs Elysee, went to the Louvre, and visited Monmarte (Sacre Couer and the area. We want to go back to Paris at least for a few days after we go to Ireland possibly, or we may do Paris, Munich and Austria. Personally Caseya, I would rather go to Florence then to Venice. While Venice is nice, there isn't too much to do, whereas in Florence, you have the hills of Tuscany tours to take, the Uffizi gallery with its world famous art, the Duomo, the Ponte Vecchio (lots of beautiful Florentine jewelry - I bought a bracelet cheaper then it would have cost here), and many other museums and churches and great shopping. Good luck and let us know how you did!

To LoveItaly: Thanks for all the info! What a great idea to go to the library and check out the threads here! Will keep you posted when we take our next Europe trip hopefully in August. Good luck on your next one!

Ledhead, I'm so glad you're enjoying travelling! Don't overlook what kdcwood pointed out about small group tours. We usually travel independently but enjoyed those small, intimate groups (not large package tours). For one thing, it was actually LESS expensive than going it alone and it was a lot more relaxing because for once I wasn't responsible for every last detail. The folks I toured with clearly loved sharing the little out of the way treasures and other delights they'd found over the years. They hired excellent guides for some portions and allowed us to explore on our own other times. It was a great balance. We would never have found or experienced the utterly charming hospitality of Locanda Solomeo otherwise, for one, and the group was so cleverly chosen that we still have friends to this day we made on those trips.

And again, good for you! My father, bless him, simply refuses to travel regardless of destination. My mother would willingly travel alone so we decided to take her with us on our trips. She is a wonderfully patient and delightful companion, adores my husband (it's mutual), and we all have a wonderful time together. Because we live on opposite ends of the country, travel time is together time. I'm sure your daughters feel as lucky as I do.

When you plan your own trip you not only get more for your money, you get to see what YOU want - and to travel at your pace. You can make your own compromises between luxury and location - and if you decide on lunch snacks on the run and nice dinners - or vice versa.

Also - you don't have to get up at 7am when you feel like sleeping in after a late night out, or spend hours "shopping" for tatty souvenirs at places that give the guides kickbacks, or rushing on to the next (boring) sight when you're not ready to leave where you are.

The agents at chain travel stores are essentially useless - since they have rarely been anywhere you're going - and couldn;t help you even if they wanted/had the time to.

We are heading to Paris for the first time this summer, and we booked Michael Osman to guide us around for a couple of days. I think it's a nice compromise, because you get the benefit of a guide, without being stuck with a large group. His rates are extremely reasonable (but he's a little hard to reach--keep trying to email him if he doesn't respond). He's gotten wonderful reviews on this forum, and he's been extremely nice in his emails.... Here's his website:
http://www.geocities.com/parisfinder/index.html

For independent tours.. ive heard the best reviews for contiki which caters to 18-35 year olds and trafalger for 35 and up ..