My wife and I are going to be in Scotland a full 4 days. We are staying at the Sheraton Hotel very close to Edinburgh Castle.
Rough draft itenirary:
Day 1: All Edinburgh
Day 2: St. Andrews (day trip by train)
Day 3: Guided tour- Trip to Stirling,..and on to Trossachs (day trip)
Day 4: ??? See rest of Edinburgh

This Itenirary might just be fine for us as it is, ...but we wanted to know the feasibility of going to Glencoe somewhere in this plan if possible. We are willing to adjust the intenirary anyway possible.

Nope - not unless you drop the guided tour. You could rent a car for a day and drive up to Glencoe and than back through the Trossachs and back to Edinburgh.

If it was me -- I'd rent a car for 2+ days and leave Edinburgh early in the AM, drive along the coast of Fife/see the fishing villages and on to St Andrews. Then after visiting St Andrews head west and drive to maybe just beyond Stirling for a stop over. Next morning drive up through Glencoe and then back through the Trossachs and drop the car in Edinburgh.

As it is you are staying in central Edinburgh but want to see everything from St Andrews to Stirling to Glencoe which is most of central Scotland.

So 1) if you don't want to drive, and 2) want to stay in Edinburgh -- then pick one day trip and spend the rest of your time IN Edinburgh.

If you want to see mostly countryside - you need to get out of the city.

Thanks Janisj,

I did some more research and would "like" to do the following:

I agree with you on renting the car. I now feel that my wife and I will see Edinburgh for 1 full day only.

Day 2 - then rent a car and head off to Stirling (couple hours there) and then to Trossachs (couple more hours) and then finish up in Oban for the evening at B&B.

Day 3 - early start again,.. and do the day tour (beginning at 10 am) to the Islands of Iona and Mull. End of day 3 sleep in Glencoe.

Day 4 - early start (7am usually) for a long day with lots of beautiful driving scenery,...drive from Glencoe to Inverness (approximately 80 miles-2 hours) follow "Telford's work (20 miles of canals and locks between 40 miles of lakes). See Loch Ness,..then brief time in Inverness. Continue route to Culloden Battlefield for maybe 1 hour.
Time expectation will put us at about 1 pm or so. Finish off the day driving "A-9 (good scenic highway) heading south and stop off for an hour at St Andrews (approx. 2-2 & 1/2 hr drive) ,..seeing Fife fishing villages along the way. Then back to (leaving St. Andrews about 5:30 pm) Edinburgh for dinner and rest.
Fly out next day to Dublin. Can add another day in Scotland but would rather not,..due to cutting time in Ireland.

Just a couple of comments right now . . .

1) You will not likely get started at 0700 <B>any</B> morning.

If you stay in B&Bs - they usually won't finish serving breakfast until 8:30 or 9:00 (they can't check you out while cooking/serving other guests their breakfasts). Then by the time you pay your bill and load the car - you will be <u>lucky</u> to be out the door by 9 AM.

2) Your new day 4 is basically impossible . . . . The driving idea is good. But Glencoe to Inverness to Culloden to St Andrews to the fishing villages to Edinburgh is a good 3 days worth - not something to fit in one day between breakfast and 5 PM.

So yes - drive. But you really don't have time to drive that far. Edinburgh > Stirling > touring the Trossachs > Oban > Mull > Glencoe > Inverness > Culloden > St Andrews > East Neuk villages > Edinburgh would be a very full week, not a 3 day drive. W/ just 4 days total - you should pick a couple of areas (maximum) outside of Edinburgh - you just don't have time for more. You can't <i>see</i> half of Scotland in three days.

(note: if you use one of the route planning websites like AA or Michelin - you need to add between 30% and 50% to the drive time calculations)

Hi Janisj

I plan on staying in hotels due to the earlier start times for us. Days 2 & 3 seem fine starting around 8 am (Day 2) and 9 am (Day 3)- for day trip to Iona and Mull.

I understand your explanation of your concern for my Day 4. How about if I stretch Day 4's activity into another Day?

I feel a possibilty would be to sleep in Pitlochry after driving to Loch ness and Inverness etc. Then the following Day (#5),...begin at "10 am" and visit St. Andrews/Fife,..before arriving in Edinburgh no earlier than 4 pm.

It is your trip -- so we can't decide for you. But that sort of plan would drive me absolutely crazy. Being on the road by 7:00 or 8:00, driving through glorious countryside w/o much time to stop and see anything, staying in places I really don't want just because I can get an early start. Just isn't my style.

Can you drive your itinerary it in that much time - sure. Will you have time to see/do much - not really. Plus you are cutting Edinburgh to a bare minimum.

IMHO its better to see less places but actually have time to "see" them instead of driving around half a country checking things off a list.

Day 4 isn't an "activity" - it is a drive around the entire center of Scotland. If the main point is the drive - go for it. One day or two won't really make that much difference, but two will help a little.

Hi Janisj

I have some flexibilty and can alter my plans if I see it being too hectic in the beginning of the journey.

Day 1 2 & 3 IMO really seem fine where I believe there is not any need to wake up extra early to do what we want to do. Day 2's itenirary of driving to Stirling and spending three hours there and then off to Trossachs-Loch Lomond another leisurely 3 hours before staying in Oban seems reasonable. Day 3's plans have us heading off to Iona/Mull and end up staying in Glencoe-healthy time frame which also seems not hectic.

Day 4 I believe needs some fixing (maybe in a big way). That is why I have decided to add an extra day. Day 4 would be to see Glencoe and then enjoy a drive (not day-long drive) seeing some sights-"Caledonian Canal etc. up to Inverness for a stop over.

Day 5 Drive back on the "A9" (which I hear is a "wonderfully scenic" highway) to St. Andrews and Fife.

I agree with you when you suggest all travelers should not be rushed and should spend time enjoying what there is to see. I believe it is important to spend the right amount of time at the sights and move along in the adventure without driving so much in a day.

If I feel my plans on days 4 & 5 are asking too much of me,..I will change plans for those days and cut something out, which I have the flexibility to do.

One final try -- "Trossachs" isn't a location. They are a whole scenic region. One doesn't go "to Trossachs" - one drives through and explores the various waterfalls/lochs/scenic bits.

Stirling - 3 hours - √
Trossachs/Loch Lomond - 3 hours √
Oban - √

Yes, each checked off the list - But where is the time for Doune Castle, Inchmahome, Kilchurn, Dunstaffnage or Branklinn Falls or the Falls of Leny, or Loch Katrine or Balquhiddar?

Now - of course you wouldn't have time for all those places, but each is worth a stop. As it is you are driving from point A to point B and missing all the bits in between.

Your 3 (or 4) day drive is totally doable -- as a <u>drive</u>

chipnittly

Please please please, listen to janisj

IMO if you want to just say to the guys in the pub yeah we went to x and y and z then driving about like this will do the trick, but if you actually want to see something then you are making a big mistake with this tour itinerary.

Firstly, leaving edinburgh at 7am! you will probably still be leaving edinburgh at 9am! because the traffic can be a nightmare at times. Then this A9 scenic route, yeah it is a scenic route but also some of the roads you are talking about taking are treacherous.

I have driven many many times in Scotland - as it is my home country, and I have driven the country roads. And believe me, if you try to do all of this in the amount of days you have got you might end up, god forbid, with your car on it's roof.

If you dont know the roads, you are going to have to slow up your trip to go round the many many bends, particularly on the way to Oban.

Have you considered a Bus Tour? that way, they are experienced drivers, who fit in all the best bits of the locations, and give you some time in these places.

Alternatively there is a great train facility in Edinburgh where you can get tickets to visit most of these places too.

For example, the overnight sleeper train from London to Fort William stops at Edinburgh and you can board around 5am ish. The route is fantastic to see some of the best of the west of scotland, particulary once you get past Helensburgh.

You arrive in Fort William around 10 ish, you could see Fort William and head down to Crianlarich and take train to Oban, or take the fabulous train trip from Fort William to Mallaig. etc etc and so on.

You could buy a rover? ticket, that way you have a number of days travel, or if you are from outwith the UK you can buy a britrail ticket and you can jump on and off trains.

I think you are going to stress your head right out by even attempting this amount of driving. plus you will miss the best of scotland, because you will get fed up and end up stopping in one place because you cant face getting back into the car.

Just my opinion

Scotsgirl

one more thing, I hope your wife is a patient lady lol cos i am sure you two will be ready for a divorce by the time you get out the car with your current plan.



Scotsgirl

oh and sorry, one other thing.

did you consider driving in the rain?

we have this type of rain we call drizzle, its like really fine rain, but it causes the roads to be more slippy.

Scotland is my home, and I love it dearly but it tends to rain a lot! especially as you go over the more mountainous areas, and in the winter months you have the snow or sleet, and it gets dark early.

I am not trying to put you of AT ALL, about visiting my beautiful country, Im just trying to warn you that your driving also has to encounter weather conditions.

Please be careful!

Scotsgirl

You are getting a lot of good advice.

You simply can't drive as many miles in a day in Scotland as you can in the US, Canada, Australia, or even France. Other than motorways, you have to allow at least 1.5 times as much time for the same number of miles as you would elsewhere, and if there is an accident you may be backed up a very long time since there are few alternate routes. Not only do they have drizzle, we were in Glen Coe -in August- with horizontal rain and temperatures of 42 degrees F, and we were hiking, but that is another story.

Even hotels in smaller Scottish towns and cities are most unlikely to be able to get you on the road consistently by 0700. It is a different mindset, and B&B's are even more so.

I have done much of this route by train: Edinburgh, Glasgow, change stations, West Highland railway to Ft William and Mallaig beside Loch Lomond, through Rannoch Moor and beside Ben Nevis to Ft William, where you could stop for the night and take a local tour of Glen Coe next day. Then on to Mallaig and Skye by ferry and bus to Portree for night 2. Day 3, take the train from Kyle of Lochalsh to Inverness, then the train to St Andrews. Hence back to Edinburgh.

It's all scenery, but you get to enjoy it, perhaps with a wee dram of malt in hand, rather than trying to steer your way through it in a long line of traffic.

Thanks Scotsgirl and Janisj for all your help. I am learning about what Scotland is about and constantly revising my itinerary. I do appreciate the patience.

I have a hotel stay (4 nights- Sept.10-14) at the "Sheraton Hotel & Spa" in Edinburgh and was willing to change my accomodations to better see Scotland. After reading Scotsgirl's post about possible tours,..I think it just might be the best option available at this time.

There are 1-day tours out of Edinburgh to the areas Im interested in- just not as much depth as I would have liked. Ex: more sights (Doune Castle, Inchmahome, etc.- also Mull and Iona day trip). However,..some of these tours are thorough enough in their own right.

I am looking at "Rabbie's Scotland Tours" - www.rabbies.com
Any more suggestions after viewing their website - knowing what I wanted to initially plan and how to satisfy??? I feel some of the 1 -day tours they have could suffice.

I generally recommend driving/independent touring -- but in your situation a couple of one day tours out of Edinburgh would be a good idea.

Rabbies gets very good reviews on here. Another good company is http://www.timberbush-tours.co.uk/

If you can keep the additional day in your plan, I'd consider
day 1 - in Edinburgh;
day 2 - Rabbies or other guided day trip;
day 3 - Rabbies or other guided day trip;
day 4 - St Andrews on your own by train;
day 5 - in Edinburgh. If you can't keep the 5th day, then I'd only do one guided day trip.

Some companies also offer 2-day tours that might work for you. Something like:
Day 1 - Edinburgh;
Days 2-3 - check out of the Sheraton, 2-day/1-night mini coach tour, then check back into the Sheraton on the evening of day 3;
Day 4 - St Andrews;
Day 5 - Edinburgh.

Oh - I was going to add . . . You face the same sort of issues on the Ireland part of your trip. In fact the driving is often even slower in W/SW Ireland than in Scotland (and the morning starts even later).

The good thing is you'll have a few more days for Ireland, but long driving days are even harder IMO. So be sure to take it easy and don't try to see/do everything.

You'll have a great trip - just need to keep in mind you can't travel fast in either place . . . .

Hi Chipnittly

I had a quick look at

http://www.scotlinetours.co.uk/index.html

http://www.visitscotland.com/shop/ho...cottish-tours/

And if you can afford something a little more posh....

http://www.littles.co.uk/3daytourofscotland.php

my uncle used to work for them, but has since retired, and he often did these types of tours, the drivers are great people, just normal down to earth guys, with a touch of class about them. I dont know how much it costs, but I see their 3 day tour covers much of what you wanted.

p.s. I am not recommending little's as a company, but as their drivers are real good people. I dont know about the rest of their business etc.

Scotsgirl

Thx Scotsgirl and Janisj for providing info about the other tour companies !

Do you recommend any tour company over the other?

Based on what I have been asking to see in Scotland, I am now trying to decide which tour and which company (a few 1-day tours? 2-day tours? or a 3 day? etc. etc).

Is Isle of Skye recommended in a tour,.. after seeing much of Central Scotland (in other words,..would it be a bit redundant after touring before that area-example: scenery, castles, etc.) I understand every area has it's own history and is unique.

So much to see,..and will be back some day.



Is

Each of the companies listed are well though of so it probably doesn't make that much difference. But I'd definitely stick to the mini-bus or small group tours. 36/40 people in a massive coach means you can't get to any of the small/off the beaten path places and end up eating in tourist places that accept coaches (bleccch!)

Unfortunately, you just don't have the time to see Skye too. Skye requires a minimum of 1 full day/2 nights - but one day really isn't long enough. It is very large and lots of the scenic areas are single track roads (1 lane road for 2 way traffic).

The scenery on Skye is semi-unique so it doesn't really duplicate anyplace else. But - w/ just 4 or 5 days total you need to cut back, not add places.

The areas you want to see would easily fill 10 days/2 weeks. Don't try to squeeze them into 3 or 4 days.

ive not used any of them so cant say unfortunately.

keep us updated though

scotsgirl

If you're staying at the Sheraton then I suspect you'll be needing the spa!

Two points which struck me from your original plan. Firstly, I'd be really concerned about trying to drive down the A9 and then take in St Andrews and the East Neuk. It's three hours driving straight from Inverness to Perth at the best of times, without taking in the scenery! It's also a bit of a notoriously dangerous road for speeding (dual to single carriageway sections) so although I wouldn't avoid it I do take care when I'm driving it.

It's also about another hour from Perth to St Andrews, and then you probably need about another two at least to properly explore the East Neuk on your way back to Edinburgh.

Secondly, the Edinburgh traffic. I drove in from Fife this morning, and it wasn't too bad coming out - but it is unpredictable, so you do have to factor this in to your timings.

Friends of mine from Minnesota used Timberbush tours when they visited us last year, and although they found the day pretty tiring it was very good - so much so that I wouldn't mind doing it myself, and I live here!

Getting to St Andrews - you can do it by train via Leuchars, but you could also look at buses, although they take longer. There are direct ones from Edinburgh, and if you time the trip right (and probably with a couple of changes) you might be able to come back via Anstruther on the bus too. Stagecoach operate here - their website is http://www.stagecoachbus.com/region_2.html (if the link doesn't work, I'm not too good with HTML so excuse me!)