MissZiegfeld

Hey there--

this is sorta on topic..I want to take french language courses at a school called FIAF here in nyc. They're a bit pricier than some language courses I've seen elsewhere, but I like the fact that they do a placement exam for those who have prior experience with french (which I do), and that they have classes that meet six hours a week (3 hours twice a week). Has anyone taken a course with this school? Any comments?

ekscrunchy

I took at couple of French classes at Alliance Francaise many years ago. The teacher was excellent and the classes were very serious, with lots of homework. Quite strict. I would give it top marks. They recently moved into an impressive new space. If you join, you can take advantage of many activities including films and lectures...in French, of course!

Christina

I believe that is just the Alliance Francaise (some may not recognize that name). They are generally pretty good, although like any place, the teacher makes a big difference. I go to the one in Wash DC and their teachers are excellent, but that is a sought-after post. I imagine NY might be, also.

It should be about as good quality as you'll get, although university night classes should be excellent also and perhaps the same number of hours. They are in my city. The AF doesn't usually offer classes that many hours a week, I don't think, but they have this intensive ones in summer that shorten the term, which sort of mimics many unversity summer school classes. Personally, I can't deal with 6 hrs a week of language classes (nor do I like 3 hr-long classes, and I've had them), but if you like that, it should be fine. Their fees are about the same as most good language schools where I live.

Any good language school gives placement exams. That's pretty standard, although I think Berlitz and some of those sort of let you decide (although I took a conversation class at Berlitz once and the director decided, even though he had little language experience or knowledge -- quite inappropriately, as it turned out, and he made his decisions based on where he wanted bodies, I think, rather than what was appropriate).

I've take some university night classes in languages (Georgetown) and I guess they do let you sign up as you want, although if you couldn't keep up, I suppose they'd tell you. I've also taken as USDA grad. school, and they make you take a placement test. Now they are excellent (but perhaps only in DC, I don't know), but they had 3-hr classes and I just couldn't focus on that after working all day.

Margaretlb

I had a negative experience at the Alliance last year. I signed up for a three month course, three hours once a week. The classes were advertised as "small". I signed up for a beginners course as my only previous French class was 8 two-hour lessons at Berliz in 1999. The "small" class size was 14 students and more than half spoke English as a second language. When confronted about the size of the class, the instructor said that the size would reduce via attrition-well two people did eventually stop coming. With such a large class, there was little opportunity to practice. With so many ESL students, the teacher spent way too much time having to correct basic French pronounciation. The instructor wasted alot of time trying to get the VCR working (some of the lessons were dramatised on video)and said VCR was an ongoing problem throughout the course. The syllabus really was lousy - we spent many on these three hour lessons learing about renting an apartment - well, OK there was vocabulary involved with that. Anyway, to boil it down: I do not feel like I learned anything that I had not been previously taught at Berlitz; I feel the Berlitz course was far superior (I actually learned things which I can't say for AF). Worst $600 I've ever spent compounded by a huge waste of my time as the commute home after the class usually got me home after 11:30pm.

Spygirl

Christina-I think USDA language courses are only in DC, which is a shame, as they offer so many different language courses, and at times that are available to most working folk.

I would always recommend at least starting out with the Alliance Francaise for French courses, as the AF is officially underwritten by the French Govt., just as Casa Italiana is by the Italian Govt. The instruction SHOULD be better at these Govt. supported schools, but frankly I haven't always found that to be the case.

My experience in this country with the AF instructors has been a bit uneven, in that the "francophone Afriques" instructors do not teach Parisian French, and are quite a bit more relaxed on French grammar rules, which I didn't like. Others though, are very good.

The best French classes I've taken have been at Eurocentre in Paris-they were really tough, but excellent instruction.

Christina

yes, I think the USDA classes are only in DC -- at least the language ones. I think they do have some work ones elsewhere (computer stuff or something).

Margaret's post gives you some things to think about. Personally, I think 12-14 students is a small class. The class I took at Berlitz had more students than that, and so have the ones I've taken at night schools at USDA or universities. But you need to ask class size if you don't want that. I actually hated Berlitz, and if anyone focuses only on stuff you don't need, it is them. They were developed and cater to business people, so the entire conversation class used a book that had dialogues on meetings, business hotels, etc. This entire conversation class did not have a single person in it taking it for business reasons. Also, Berlitz didn't even guarantee you'd have the same teacher from week to week, as they like to shuffle teachers around as suits their needs, so there was no continuity.

I have had French teachers from Africa at Berlitz, and they were okay, except I hated the course in general. The teachers I've had at the AF were only from France, but not necessarily Paris. There shouldn't be any distinction in French grammar by whether the teacher was from Paris or Toulouse, etc., IMO. Of course, pronunciation may be slightly different, but it shouldn't be really different if they are teaching there (I mean a teacher shouldn't have a really sloppy accent).

Of course, I haven't taken any grammar classes at the AF here, only higher level literature and other courses, so don't know how that would work. I've never had anything but teachers from France at the AF here, either. Oh, actually I think there was a French Canadian teacher I had once and really liked (now they can have some very different accents there, but she had a good one) -- however, somehow she went to Canada on holiday and never came back because her visa expired or something weird. Then, the director taught our class the rest of the session, and he was wonderful (I remember he was a secondary teacher in France and left because he was posted to some place he thought was really boring and wanted to get out of France; he wasn't from Paris but was excellent).

None of the classes I've ever taken at the AF cost more than about $250, though. Right now, the highest fee is around $335 for their summer grammar classes (which say a max. of 10 students, but I don't know how that goes).

I have had terrible teachers at Georgetown night school in French because they would hire people solely because they were native speakers, even though they couldn't teach anything and didn't know how to teach. The worst teacher I had there was from LEbanon or somewhere and she literally got up in front of the class and just read the textbook (it was a grammar refresher class). That was the entire class. I dropped that after the first night and complained to the dept. head. My first French teachers in regular university (French I and II) were from Switzerland and Egypt, and both were excellent.

Margaretlb

As Christina's post points out, sometimes it's the luck of the draw. The Berlitz course I took at the Rector Street location only had three students. The instructor was from paris and the first night he asked if we wanted to learn to speak French or how to order coffee. We chose speak French. We ended up with an intensive grammar course. My daughter who was studying high school 3rd year French at the time, couldn't believe the irregular verb conjugations we were using. Bottom line is, I can read French pretty good (as far as historical markers,directions). The problem with my particular AF class was the many ESL students, most of whom were other romance language natives and our very Parisian teacher spent alot of time on correcting their pronunciation. Although she was an experienced teacher, she wasn't very good at keeping a student from dominating her time. Also, the classroom was too small for the class as it was held at the Lighthouse for the Blind while the AF building was under renovation. And gee wiz, why was my class $600? Maybe because it was supposed to be an intensive? My experience was pretty disappointing but I did get a good restaurant recommendation from Madam: L'Os Moelle in the 15th.

MissZiegfeld

Thank you for the comments, everyone!!