27 days for 4 first timers- suggestions on itenerary!
           
Hello! A group of 4 of us will be going to Europe from September 5th to October 6. 27 days in total. We will start out with family in Hamburg, Germany. Most of the travel will be done by car. The rough itenerary is as follows:
Hamburg- 2 days
Amsterdam- 2 days
Belgium- 2 days
Paris- 3days (airplane)
Berlin- 1 day
Prague- 3 days
Munich/ Bavaria- 3 days
Venice- 1 day
Florence/Tuscany- 4 days
Switzerland- 1 day
Barcelona- 4 days
2 days are left for travel. I want to see as much as possible without making the vacation a commute. Any suggestions? Thanks

I think you'd enjoy your trip much more if you don't try to cover so much ground--think of "If It's Tuesday It Must Be Belgium"! You should probably aim for no more than four countries to avoid total exhaustion--every time you change cities and hotels you will lose at least half a day in travel time. You simply cannot get the "feel" of a country when you're there only one or two days, and you'll have no time at all to just sit and relax with a coffee at a café.

I don't think it will be human possible to visit everything.You should use 27 days only to see the Louvre,the Uffizi or the Prado.So i think you should plan a two or a three country travel (however 27 days are a lot of time!).First of all what type of trip,mainly do you want to plan?Relaxing,cultural,gastronomic?Considers that every place in Europe is full of history and it is special so every country should be visited...

Thanks for the advice everyone! I may end up knocking off Spain as it is 10 hours travel time to get there. Possibly Belgium as well. I wanted this vacation to be relaxing, cultural and adventurous. To help me with eliminating a couple, which of these areas are nicest during September-October?

For "first timers" the urge to see as much of Europe as possible is very strong. I would urge you to pare down your itinerary! Allow atleast 1/2 day for travel between each destination. With eleven destinations you will spend around six days just traveling. One day in Berlin, Venice, and Switzerland is just not enough so I would skip these destinations. Also, Barcelona is pretty far afield and I would skip that. If, however, you ar departing from Barcelona, then I would concentrate on Hamburg, Amsterdam, Belgium, Paris, the Rhine area, Switzerland, Southern France, to Barcelona

If you came in Europe at the start of Autumn I advise you to visit the mediterrean country while you should find good weather and temperated days,generally these months in northern europe are really raining.If you want to see a lot of beautiful places see this route:


http://www.viamichelin.co.uk/viamich...;x=22&y=16

Of course you can visit beautiful cities such as Prague Berlin and Paris also.

<I want to see as much as possible without making the vacation a commute. Any suggestions?>

That sounds like WAY too much to attempt IMO. I say this emphatically mostly because you say you are 1st timers to Europe. Some people like to rush around, but your schedule seems barely physically possible, and often people who have not planned a trip to Europe don't realize the geography and logistics.

1 *DAY* for Switzerland... the entire country??? I'm not even sure you can drive across it that quick. I'm writing this with a smile on my face, so please don't take it wrong but either skip it or stay longer. Same for Venice.

You've got 10 places listed, realize that's 10 times you must check in and out of hotels, take a long drive, or a trip to the airport, etc. etc. That will mean every other day you will be in transit, instead of enjoying where you are!

I would concentrate on an area or at least places closer together and delete about 1/2 of the destination from your original itinerary. It's your vacation, not "The Amazing Race"

I think you need to sit down w/ a couple of guide books and decide which 2, or at most 3, countries you want to visit. You can probably squeeze in 5 or 6 cities among those 2 or 3 countries.

Consider - you are planning 11 different locations in 25 days (subtracting your travel days to/from Europe) Each time you move from one place to another you will lose between 1/2 and 1 full day. So at the very least you will use 6 additional days just traveling between places. So that leaves you w/ just 19 days to see places in 9 different countries. And the way you are zig zagging all over you are going into and out of some of those countries 2 or 3 times. This is almost a totally impossible itinerary if you want to do more than just say you were there and not actually see anything.

Now if you did all your inter-city travel by overnight train you could save some of the wasted travel time. But even then you are planning waaaaaaay to many stops. dropping Spain will only help a little bit . . . . .

You've already made the trip a commute, an ordeal imo.
You will be spending much more time in the car than in some stops such as 'Switzerland' and Venice.

Have you already booked your airfare? I'm hoping that you arranged to fly into one city (Hamburg) but to fly home from your last stop so you don't have to backtrack.

I think you should skip
Spain, Amsterdam, and Belgium.
Since Hamburg is a given, concentrate on France, Germany, Prague, and Italy.

Add days onto Paris, Berlin, Venice and Switzerland. If you like, add a couple of days in for the Italian lakes.

That is a disater waiting to happen. You have read too many tour brochures.
Here are some good guidelines:
1. Average at least 3 nites per destination
2.Make your next destination a max of 4 hours travel time.
3. Spend equal time in small towns or rural as you do in cities.

Apply that to your must see locations and rethink your plan.

Also -

Driving from one end of Europe to the other will drain your stamina. Take <i>evening</i> trains from city to city and rent cars to explore the surrounding countryside. Within the capitals, use public transportation. Cars in European cities don't work.

Cut down the itinerary to a maximum of five cities in addition to Hamburg. I might say:

Amsterdam
Paris
Milan
Lucern
Munich

Hi first,

&gt; I want to see as much as possible without making the vacation a commute.&lt;

You have gone beyond that. You are planning an expedition.

Some very good advice above.

Keep in mind that each time you move you lose about 1/2 day.

first- Have we convinced you yet???

If not I suggest you:

1) get a map or Europe &amp; put a dot on each of the places you mentioned and take a look at it from that perspective.

2) find actual driving times between each place and add them up.

3) Then double them to account realistically for unfamiliarity and other contingencies.

Good grief! You will be exhausted and won't really see anything.
Restrict yourelf to just a few cities.
I'd suggest Amsterdam, Paris, Prague and either Florence or Venice.

I'm exhausted just reading your itinerary. Personally, I think the major cities should have a minimum of 3 days, 5 in the case of Paris. Unless you just want to get on a bus tour and drive by things, it takes more than two days to see a lot of cities.

I can promise you this -- you won't see Switzerland in &quot;one day&quot; unless you're on a train going through it without getting off. And that isn't much of a tour.

I'd suggest pinning down the &quot;must do's&quot; a little more, and saving the other stuff for later. I'm not sure if this itinerary is in chronological order, but if it is, it makes no sense to go to Hamburg go all the way to Paris, then see Berlin.

Take a look at a European map and take some time deciding where to go in a geographical sequence that makes good sense.

For example,

Fly in to Amsterdam, and go something like this:

Amsterdam- 3 days
Brussels/Belgium- 1 day (overnight only)
Paris- 5 days
Venice- 2 days
Florence - 2 days
Fly to Munich 2 days
Prague 3-4 days
Berlin - 3 days
Hamburg - 1-2 days
head back to Amsterdam and fly home from there, or skip Hamburg and fly home from Berlin.

That'll give you a few extra days for travel (which you'll need). Take night trains whenever possible to sleep while you travel (Paris to Venice has a 12-hour train that leaves at 8:30 p.m. and arrives in Venice about the 9 a.m. the next morning). If you wake up for the passport check at the border of Switzerland, you can say you saw Switzerland.

Happy travels.

Jules