FalafelBall

Ok, we are now finalizing our itinerary and it goes something like this:

1 - FRI - Land: CDG Airport 10am. Pick up a car at CDG. Drive to Loire, sightseeing in Loire (Chambord, Chaumont-sur-Loire). Stay in Amboise area.\

2 - SAT - Loire – Villandry, Chenonceaux. Stay in Chinon area.

3 - SUN - South from Chinon to Brantome. Stay in Brantome area.

4 - MON - Périgueux, Condat-sur-Vézère, Collonges-la-Rouge, Carennac. Stay near Rocamadour.

5 - TUE - Visit Rocamadour, Saint-Cirq-Lapopie, Figeac. Stay at the same hotel.

6 - WED - Visit Gouffre de Padirac, Les Jardins du Manoir d'Eyrignac, Sarlat. Stay in Sarlat/area.

7 - THU - Visit Lascaux II, via Plazac to Maison Forte de Reignac. Stay at the same hotel.

8 - FRI - Visit Les Jardins de Marqueyssa, Canoe on the Dordogne river, maybe Domme. Stay at the same hotel.

9 - SAT - Visit La Roque-Gageac, Castelnaud-la-Chapelle, Beynac-et-Cazenac. Stay near Daglan village.

10 - SUN - Via Villefranche-du-Périgord, Biron, Belvès, Limeuil, Sainte-Alvère, Lanquais. Stay in area.

11 - MON - Via Château de Bannes, Beaumont-du-Périgord, Puyguilhem, Sainte-Foy-la-Grande, Saint-Émilion. Stay in area.

12 - TUE - Before noon TGV from Bordeaux to Paris, arrive around 3pm.

13 - WED - Paris Full Day
14 - THU - Paris Full Day
15 - FRI - Paris Full Day
16 - SAT - Paris Full Day
17 - SUN - Depart 12:30am from CDG

Please advise if this makes sense and if you would change anything.
Day 1 - We are only after a 4 hours flight so no worries about jet lag.
Where shall we go through on day 3?
What do you think about days 10-11?

Dukey1

As I recall the chateuax of Chenonceau and Chambord are closer to one another and to Amboise than are others such as Villandry. On Friday and Saturday I would be more inclined to stay in one place and use it as a base for the various chateaux you plan to visit but this is obviously a matter of personal preference.

I would also advise you to, if at all possible, get to these sites, or at least the first one of the day, as EARLY as possible. Chenonceau and Chambord get mobbed.

StuDudley

You are changing hotels quite a bit. Do you really prefer changing hotels often???? For some new surroundings???

I would just stay in 1 hotel while in the Loire - in Amboise or Blois.

On day 3 visit Hautefort Chateau. It is somewhat different from those in the Loire. Just take the autoroute from the Loire to Hautefort - not much of interest in between the Loire & Brantome, IMO.

I would just stay near Sarlat, and not move to Daglan while in the Sarlat/Dordogne River area. Moving to Daglan really doesn't buy you anything.

I assume that on day 11, "stay in area" means the area around St Emilion. If so - stay in St Emilion itself.

Take the TGV from Libourne to Paris. It leaves at 11:52 & arrives at 3:17 - no train change. Driving into Bordeaux is a bit difficult (especially around the train station) and there is really no need to do it.

Stu Dudley

Carlux

4 - MON - Périgueux, Condat-sur-Vézère, Collonges-la-Rouge, Carennac. Stay near Rocamadour.

I hope this doesnt mean that you will stop in Condat. There really is nothing to see - other than a large paper mill.

In fact I wouldnt bother with Perigueux either. You don't have a lot of time, and if you intend to drive in, park, and look around, that will take all morning at least. If you are really interested in Collonges and Carennac (the latter one of the loveliest villages around here) I would concentrate on them, and perhaps add Loubressac or Autoire if you have extra time. In fact, at Carennac you wont be far from Padirac, which you are planning for another day.

I agree that I can't see any point in moving to Daglan area. Any particular reason you want to do this?

Michael

<i>Périgueux, Condat-sur-Vézère, Collonges-la-Rouge, Carennac. Stay near Rocamadour. </i>

Probably too much in one day. We went from Hautefort to Cahors, stopping only in Curemonte and Carennac, and that was a full day. The small roads take time.

StuDudley

Perigueux won't be at its best on a Monday morning when most of the shops will be closed. My wife found some nice shops there - we even bought a nice set of oval amuse bouche glasses. There are some very interesting streets in Perigueux with lovely houses. Pick up a walking itinerary from the TI & follow it (it's in English). Perigueux is difficult to access, even though it is not a really large city. We've really enjoyed our 3 visits to Perigueux - especially on market day.

We missed the paper mill in Condat, but we got some really nice pictures of a church bell tower with 4 bells. Also some lovely cross-beamed buildings. Condat's pretty much a drive in/drive out village, however. Since you will probably drive within 1 K of Condat on the N89, I think it is worth a look/see.

Terrasson (which is also just off the N89) is another interesting village to visit. Their farmer's market estends out on the bridge over the river. Many nice buildings in Terrasson. Same for Turenne - which is close to Collonges. In fact, Turenne is on the cover of my "Most Beautiful Villages in the Dordogne" book. Go up to the chateau/fort for some nice views of the twisting streets.

Stu Dudley

StCirq

<<4 - MON - Périgueux, Condat-sur-Vézère, Collonges-la-Rouge, Carennac. Stay near Rocamadour.>>


Don't understand this. It's probably an impossible day. Why Condat? There's nothing there. And getting in and out of Périgueux plus seeing the old quarter alone will take half a day,leaving you no time at all to get all the way to Collonges-la-Rouge and Carennac (what about Martel?), which are hardly in the same part of the Périgord.

You're really bouncing around all over the place without an apparent understanding of how to group things or how long it will take to get to places. Why Daglan? That's just kind of random. Overall, you need to slow down and stop trying to tick things off a list. I had a house in the Dordogne for probably 6 years before I even got to Beaumont (and I only went to see the dolmen) or Biron. In general, you've got way too much going on every day and won't likely make it to all your destinations. Slow down, stay in fewer places.

I'd eliminate at least 6-10 places from your list and just mellow out and enjoy the region.

StuDudley

- 9:00-12:00 visit Perigueux
- 12:00-12:45 drive to Condat
- 12:45-1:15 visit Condat
- 1:15-2:15 drive Condat to Collonges
- 2:15-3:15 visit Collonges
- 3:15-3:45 drive Collonges to Carennac
- 3:45-4:45 visit Carennac
- 4:45-5:15 drive to Rocamadour area.

Add 30 mins for a sandwich in Perigueux for lunch.

Stu Dudley

Michael

You might want to use http://www.viamichelin.fr/web/Itineraires to determine time and distances, taking into account that the time given by viamichelin is optimal and does not take into account stops. Short fast between Brantôme and Rocamadour is 3+ hours, 4+ hours if taking the scenic route.

tower

FalafelBall, pita and all:

These simple scanned pics may help to familiarize you with the region.

https://picasaweb.google.com/stuartt...eAndLotRegion#

You have received a ton of solid "expert" information. I don't claim to be one, Residents like Carlux and St.Cirq, and a few frequent annual visitors like the other Stu, are the experts. The rest of us come as occasional tourists, whether we like to be labeled as such or not. We can and do, however, share our opinions and experiences which is the overriding purpose of this forum.

Have a nice visit, Falafel...you will! Welcome to Fodors.

stu tower

Enjoy the Loire and Dordogne and vicinity

FalafelBall

Thanks everyone. I appreciate your comments.
We are a young couple and I worry that staying near Sarlat most of the time will consume time getting out and in every day. Why spend so much time and petrol? We don't mind moving around. We don't even plan to book our overnights, so if we decide to stay in Sarlat eventually, we will.

Michael - we're using it already and it's very helpful. It seems to me, by using this map, that we are doing ok with travel times.

Stu Dudley - we are using your Dordogne document and that's where we found Daglan and Condat. We will do the Perigueux itinerary that you recommend in your doc. Re the rest of this day, I see you think it is possible, but would you do otherwise? Will take your advice for visiting Hautefort Chateau and departing from Libourne instead of Bordeaux. And will try to visit Terrasson and Turenne. Thanks!

StCirq -
<<You're really bouncing around all over the place without an apparent understanding of how to group things or how long it will take to get to places. Why Daglan? That's just kind of random.>>

Thanks, you are too kind.

<< In general, you've got way too much going on every day and won't likely make it to all your destinations. Slow down, stay in fewer places.
I'd eliminate at least 6-10 places from your list and just mellow out and enjoy the region.>>

Ok, definitely willing to read what you suggest to eliminate.

Carlux - <<If you are really interested in Collonges and Carennac (the latter one of the loveliest villages around here) I would concentrate on them, and perhaps add Loubressac or Autoire if you have extra time.>>

Sounds good. Will see how I re-plan this some what problematic day.

FalafelBall

Thanks Mr. Tower, got a lot of help here!

StuDudley

>>We will do the Perigueux itinerary that you recommend in your doc. Re the rest of this day, I see you think it is possible, but would you do otherwise?<<

I think you have a good plan. A lot depends on how much of the day you want to spend on the road, visiting villages & cities - instead of "relaxing" at your hotel, having a long lunch, or sitting at a cafe having coffee for an hour or so. When we were young, we could tour from 8AM until 6:30 PM and nibble on cheese & nuts for lunch in the car. Now, we start to get tired around 3:30 (still start at 8:am & often have lunch in the car, or a jambon buerre sandwich). Just get to Perigueux early, and I would perhaps skip Condat and add Turenne if you don't mind getting to Rocamadour a little later (don't visit Rocamadour before 6pm anyway). You can "gage" the time as you go & determine your energy level and whether you are getting tired of sightseeing or not. If you visit the Gouffre de Padirac (you should), you are very close to Autoire & Loubressac and together they won't consume more than about 45 mins of your time to explore them on foot. Visit Martel on the way to Sarlat.

Daglan is cute, but small. We've stayed close toDaglan for all of our 10 weeks in the Dordogne area. But I don't know if there are any accommodations close to Daglan. There are some nice B&Bs in Cenac. I've never had any problems getting in & out of Sarlat and we've stayed there throught June and Sept. Stay near Roque Gageac or Beynac to be in PERFECT location for seeing all the "stuff" without worrying about traffic.

I assume you are going during off season. I would not do your itinerary anytime between now and mid-October without reservations in the Loire and Sarlat area - unless you want to spend a couple of your "valuable" hours looking for accommodations.

Stu Dudley

Carlux

The more I think aout this itinerary, the more I think you are trying to do too much in a short time - and not seeing necessarily seeing the best places.

So, my suggestion would be to skip the western part of your Dordogne itinerary. Brantome is nice, but a long way from the other things you want to see. Perigueux has never had a lot of appeal to me - partly because I've driven around lost and looking for parking, which can take up a lot of time. Given that your plan is to be there on a Monday, it seems really not worth while. A French town/small city on a Monday is remarkably closed up. Shops that are open on Saturday take Sunday/Monday weekends.

Therefore, coming down from the Loire check out Hautefort, definitely worth seeing, even if you don't take the guided tour. From the chateau you look out over the surrounding valleys and there is not an electical wire in sight. (It's planned that way)

Then head down towards Sarlat area. Not sure if you have booked something, but Les Granges Hautes, in St Crepin, north of Sarlat is good, with very nice owners.http://www.les-granges-hautes.fr/ Close to St Amand de Coly, St Genies - infinitely nicer than Condat or even Terrasson. (Not to emention the tiny chateau in St Crepin, our personal favourite)

Then start to think more seriously of what you do want to see, leaving yourself some time to wander into vilages that are lovely, but possibly less well known. After 20 years of living here full time we still come across wonderful little places we have never heard of.

FalafelBall

Thanks Carlux, I think we will take your advise re Monday. Stu Dudley also said Monday is not the best visiting towns.

We will also amend our itinerary a little bit and take it easy. Happy to have gotten all these inputs.