Mary Kay Groening

My husband and I are planning a trip in June with 3 other couples. We would like to do Paris and then rent two cars and see Germany, and Italy..and whatever of interest in between. We would be flying out June 6 and returning June 21. Would like input on experienced travelers and what routes and places of interest would give us a good feel for each country...not that interested in big city life. From Paris we would go to Strasbourg..then maybe..Baden Baden (husband has clients there) from there plan to head south, but would like an idea on a place to stay in Germany for a few days(3 maybe) and take day trips from one location. After Germany would like to probably go through Switzerland (need ideas and possible places to stay)..then don't know what the route or driving time is to get to coast of Northern Italy (anyone know about La Spezia)Want to stay in Northern Italy a few days..then back north to Paris.

Rex

This is almost a little bit too ambitious for 15 days, but with some selectivity, you can still plan a great trip.<BR><BR>You're squeezing the time factor to return to Paris; you might do well to consider an open jaw ticket to return from somewhere in Italy, Germany or Switzerland, instead of returning to Paris. And as a corollary, your car rental expense will be much lower if you could take the train to Basel or Strasbourg, and rent a Swiss or German car.<BR><BR>I tackled an itinerary like this a few years ago (without the Paris part on the front end), and I was pleased to find connector flights to get back to the US out of small airports like Lugano, just to give one example (via Paris, if I recall correctly).<BR><BR>Thus, you could go Paris, train to Basel, pick up Swiss car, spend 5-7 days in Black Forest, then 3-6 days (quickly buzzing through? Switzerland? and) the destination of your choice in Northern Italy. I would have recommended Lake Como over the coast, but that's based on my familiarity.<BR><BR>In Germany, the town of Oberkirch is well suited for exploring Northern Black Forest, including Baden-Baden, and even some of Alsace-Lorraine in day trip fashion. Less than an hour from either Strasbourg or Baden-Baden.<BR><BR>Several good restaurant ideas nearby if you do decide on Oberkirch.<BR><BR>Don't cut Paris shorter than three days/nights - - I think you have a fast-paced - - yet still terrific skeleton of an itinerary.<BR><BR>Come back here often with additional specific questions, as your plans evolve.<BR><BR>Best wishes,<BR><BR>Rex<BR>

SA

I agree w/Rex, the amount of time you will spend in a car will be excessive. If starting in Paris (or perhaps Frankfurt) I would include the Mosel &amp; perhaps Maastricht &amp; Luxembourg City. In addition, the open-jaw ticket is a great suggestion. As much as I love Italy, it would be difficult to work in based on the time you have. Select some things that you MUST see &amp; we'll try to help from there. Don't disregard Paris until you've had the chance to experience it.

Russ

I would second SA's advice to travel along the Mosel River. June is a great month for weather and wine fests - Cochem will have its annual &quot;Cochem Wine Week&quot; festival from 6/18-22. Just prior to that, on the 15th, the entire Mosel route between Cochem and Schweich, near Trier, will be closed for the &quot;Happy Mosel&quot; festival, an incredible event that brings thousands to the region for a day of auto-free biking, wine drinking, and general pre-summer fun. If you want to be there at that time, make reservations early and secure a bike to join in the fun. Here are some photos:<BR><BR>www.mosel-reisefuehrer.de/AnzForm/HappyMoselProsp.html<BR><BR>Otherwise, don't plan to drive the region on the 15th!<BR><BR>Here are some other sights you can enjoy along the Mosel:<BR><BR>www.mosel-reisefuehrer.de/moselhighengl/moselhighlightsengl.html<BR><BR>I'd spend a few nights there if possible. Cochem is a terrific town on its own and as a base; other more sleepy but attractive towns include Beilstein, P&uuml;nderich, Bernkastel (a bit overtouristed for its size, but wonderful), Traben-Trarbach, and Bullay.

flygirl

two weeks on that itinerary, you are really pushing it!<BR><BR>I would spend no less than 3 days in Paris. Your other suggestions sound fine, but I would definitely fly home from Milan.

ttt

up, for Mary Kay<BR>

Mary Kay Groening

I truely appreciate any help I can get from the experiences of those who have traveled Europe. Thanks to all for your input. More questions below:<BR> <BR>Regarding open-jaw tickets: Is there a higher ticket price to fly into one location and out of another? Also is there an extra charge for car rental of pick-up in one local and drop off in another?<BR> <BR>Do you think it would be wise to rent cars in different locations and take the train between countries? I don't have a clue on what prices are to do this and I am a little overwhelmed at all there is to research. <BR> <BR>How far in advance should we have the airline tickets booked? Hotels booked? Car Rentals booked?<BR> <BR>Thanks again! Mary Kay

xxx

<BR><BR>Mary Kay,<BR><BR>For open-jaw tickets I believe the general practice for airlines is to take half the cost of the roundtrip fare to each city in the open jaw and add the two together. Example: New York-London RT $300, New York-Rome RT $500, Open jaws New York-London and Rome-New York $150 + $250 = $400.<BR><BR>For rental cars there likely will be an extra charge if the car is dropped off in another country and may be an additional charge if the car is dropped off in another city within the same country. You will need to check with each car rental company you contact for their policies and charges. <BR><BR>As for whether it would be wise to rent cars in different locations and take the train between countries, I would say it depends on the distance to be traveled, whether you think you may want to stop and smell the roses in-between (since a car allows you greater opportunity to do that), and how much you like, or dislike, driving. <BR>

SA

I would certainly explore the trains. In your case you'll be dealing w/2 cars &amp; unless your doing the Mosel, many of the places you mentioned can easily be reached by train. Rex is also correct that Germany is probably the best country to rent a car in. Last year we flew in &amp; out of Brussels, trained to Cologne, rented the car &amp; explored the Rhine &amp; Mosel. For what you are wanting to do, the Mosel would be great &amp; there are many inexpensive pensiones along the way that are very inexpensive.

Rex

Hard to improve on the answers from xxx, but since you wrote to me, and I promised to answer you here, I'll add a bit.<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;Regarding open-jaw tickets: Is there a higher ticket price to fly into one location and out of another?&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>My general experience os that there is little or no added expense. Most likely to be no added expense if you are flying transatlantic non-stop both directions - - for example, USAir into Paris and back out of Munich. Even when there is some modest increase over the sum of the two halves, it is still cheaper than backtracking to the original Europe gateway city - - and of course, it it saves time not to backtrack.<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;Also is there an extra charge for car rental of pick-up in one local and drop off in another?&gt;<BR><BR>Again, already well answered - - almost never a drop charge withIN a country; almost always a drop charge (and often a high one) to pick up and drop off in different countries. That's why I recommend border town pick up and return; you can usually get a Gerna car OR a French car in Strasbourg, for example - - and then plan your drop-off accordingly.<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;Do you think it would be wise to rent cars in different locations and take the train between countries?&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>Yes, this often works well. Example: an itinerary in France and Italy might pick up in Paris and drop off in Nice, then take the train into Italy, pick up in Milan, for example, and drop off in some other city in Italy.<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;I don't have a clue on what prices are to do this and I am a little overwhelmed at all there is to research.&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>It is a big responsibility to plan, especially to have the expectations of the other three couples placed on you. Does any of the other couples have some experience traveling in Europe?<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;How far in advance should we have the airline tickets booked? Hotels booked? Car Rentals booked?&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>You will probably find the best fares for June in the period from January to March. It would be worth your while to get on Expedia or Travelocity &quot;Fare Watcher&quot; or both. You might also seek the advice of &quot;Don&quot; the cheap flights forum of www.eurotrip.com<BR><BR>There is merit in starting to write to hotels now; one advantage is that you can ask that they send you brochures in the mail. You may find this very useful in laying out your &quot;decision points&quot; to the other couples. Car rentals can be comfortably booked 2 to 8 weeks ahead.<BR>

ca[p

<BR>I would be surprised if train travel were cost effective for your group. Train fares for 8 adults vs two car rentals for, say, 14 days ... even with an extra charge for out-of-country drop offs, I bet the cars will be much less expensive, and better for exploring small towns. <BR><BR>And yes, open-jawed is not usually more expensive than otherwise.