Peter_S_Aus

Or another in Venice - I'm pasting these out of my trip report from January, 18 months ago:
We ate at the Osteria “san Barnaba”, Calle Lunga san Barnaba, Dosoduro 2736. It's small – seats about 16 people, operated by a couple, and the menu is written in Italian only. However, the proprietor speaks excellent English, and steps you through the menu. We had smoked leg of goose as an antipasto, rabbit cooked in a casserole, and calves liver Venetian style, which is a standard here, along with grilled artichoke and a bottle of good local wine. The tab came to about 70 Euro, and this is probably the best meal we have eaten in Venice – it was great. We regret that we did not go there weeks ago, because then we would have visited there again. Closed on mercoledi and giovedi mattina.

I_heart_Venice

A few general rules that I have found work for "tourist-intensive" cities in Italy:
If there are laminated plastic photographs of the plates served posted outside: avoid it.
If there is someone stationed outside hawking the restaurant: avoid it.
If it is within line of sight of a major tourist monument: very iffy, you can probably find better for less.
If you hear more English than Italian: very iffy, you can probably find better for less.
If it has a newly hand-written menu that you recognize as different from when you passed the same restaurant yesterday: probably a good choice.
If it has no menu except the legally required menu/price list outside and is far off the beaten tourist track: probably a good choice.
And only for Venice:
If it has a sign saying "Osteria" or "Bacaro" and looks dark and mysterious (almost foreboding), and outside only has a list of numerous wines by the glass, mostly under €3.00: Bingo!

PeaceOut

I just had to find the name of the cafe I recommended above. From my trip report:

"Ristorante Ottorino, via delle Oche, 12-16r. We enjoyed wine and salads, on the sunny afternoon, with a close-up view of the Duomo. It is on the top of a nice little ‘department’ store."

Two we liked a lot in Rome:
"the Maccheroni Ristorante at Piazza delle Coppelle, 44, phone 06 68307895. It’s very popular with locals and gets very busy. The service is friendly and the atmosphere is lively and interesting. About 47 EUR for two, with one-half liter of house wine."

and

" Il Matriciano, on Via dei Gracchi, 49- 61. (Reservations advised—phone 063213040, or 063212327) It’s perfect for a more special dinner, but certainly not over-the-top. For three people dining, we paid just 103 EUR, which included a liter of house wine. We shared two appetizers, and two of us had veal dishes, one had just spaghetti. We each enjoyed coffee and dessert. It is a very, very friendly and pleasant place."

charnees

PeaceOut, I am puzzled by your reference to Ottorino in Florence. We used to go there and it was on the ground floor in two big rooms -- lovely place, great Tuscan food, mostly Italian customers. Then 2 years ago it was not there!! Now it is on top of a store? It looks like the address is almost the same. Do they serve dinner or only lunches, salads, etc?

PeaceOut

Charnees, I was just there once in May 2006. We were there at noon time, and we had caprese salads and wine. I don't think we even looked at the menu, because we knew what we wanted.

I don't know about dinner there. It's possible they have an indoor restaurant with a full menu, as well as the outdoor cafe for lighter fare. But I don't know. We took an elevator to the roof, so could not see other floors. Sorry I can't clarify.

It did seem like a nice 'department' store, bigger than other shops I'd seen in Italy.

fredplotkin

Carleen, This is Fred Plotkin, writing to you from Rome. Italy for the Gourmet Traveller (published in London this May) will give you many tips and ideas. A few more thoughts: If you come in August, many of the places books send you too will be closed for vacation. So you need to look more carefully. My book will give you some ideas. I want to actively encourage to visit places beyond Venice, Florence and Rome. They will be packed with tourists (they already are). In August I might recommend a stop in Orvieto, en route by train between Florence and Rome. It has one of the greatest cathedrals in a country full of great cathedrals. Food and wine also great. In Veneto, near Venice, visit conegliano straight on a street line from Venice. The town will be quiet, and cool, a break from you you will be dealing with. Have a great trip, Fred

colduphere

I accept we are the outliers here but we cannot believe how much time people spend planning what to put in their mouth. It's food and yeah it represents an aspect of the host country's culture. But geez, find something, eat it and start touring again.

d_claude_bear

I generally agree with colduphere. Unless you are a true foodie and dining is a major reason for the travel, look at posted menus when you are walking around, ask at your hotel (tell them as precisely as you can what you are seeking), or just head out and take a chance. We did all of that it Italy (Florence, Venice, Milan) last April and do it routinely in Paris, where we pick up business cards whenever we pass a restaurant we think we might like to come back to.

kfusto

"But geez, find something, eat it and start touring again."

For some of us, the food and wine are a large part of the pleasures of travel. No need to read these threads if this does not interest you. The title should make it clear what this discussion will be about.

LJ

Fred Plotkin: before we succumb to the 'food-as-fuel' theories, let me say, it is an honour having you join us on this forum. I look forward to your next book! If you ever decide to visit Nova Scotia (Calvin Trillin hasn't said it all...yet!), there is a world of good eating here waiting for your way with words.