Good morning all,
This is my first post, so I hope it goes well. My family is planning a 10+/- day trip for the upcoming summer(May,June 2017). We are looking for route advice,duration of trip, things to do to help guide our adventure and anything else helpful for our planning. My family will consist of myself, my wife, our young son (will be 1yr old for the trip, great traveling so far) and a grandmother. We all enjoy the city(museums,historical structures, dinning, breweries ect.)as well as the outdoors (hiking,biking,rafting, geocaching).My wife and I have travelled Europe before in a similar fashion, but we didn't have our son at that time(Advice on traveling with a little one welcome also). So! We would like to explore as much of England(start From london) driving up to Scotland(not sure where to). We have read pretty so-so, to avoid completely comments about the drive, which is why we're reaching out for advice. We are open to taking the train if it has advantages. Keep in mind we actually enjoy driving and plan on keeping it light, about 4 or so hours per day). We would like to mix in some of everything(mountain biking especially,lake district and somewhere in Scotland) and some local happenings (any festivals, sports event (football match) or things of that nature) into the trip. For some events we will be able to leave baby with grandma for a few hours(mountain biking). We don't want to rush to too many places and would like a place where we spend more than 1 night exploring sprinkled in here and there if possible. After the drive up and around Scotland we are thinking of flying back to London to prepare for our journey back home (USA). We would like to have a day in London at the start, and a day before we depart to explore London. So, we need some help with to find some highlights or can't miss places along the way to help guide us. Hope that wasn't too much info, but enough to allow for some great advice we can incorporate to our first family trip. Thanks for your time.

Welcome to Fodors. Please clarify -- does the 10-ish days include time in London?

If so, driving up to Scotland and exploring bits of England en route would really be too rushed. Say 3 full days/4 nights in London, eat up half a day whether you fly or take the train to Edinburgh, 1.5 days/2 nights in Edinburgh, a couple of days/3 nights driving maybe through the Trossachs or Borders and returning to LHR the evening before you fly home will totally fill 10 days. And that is ONLY if you have 10 days on the ground in the UK (meaning a 12-13 days trip in total)

OR -- you could skip Scotland and spend half your time in London and half in part(s) of England -- the Cotswolds, or to York and back or something like that. You could drive to the Cotswolds > Bath > and back to LHR. Or you could take a train to York then rent a car and tour around the Moors or Dales, then train back to London the evening prior to flying home.

(A hint -- it really helps if you use paragraph breaks - like this . . .

. . . so it is easier to read on a screen. To get breaks do a double return)

Hi. Thanks for the reply. I will add breaks, typing on my mobile so it appears a little awkward.

We can have a total duration of about 13 days. Our destination really is Scotland, but tickets to London were cheaper and we thought driving through England would be a nice way to explore some of the culture. The London days are optional, we had been before and wanted to spend a little more time. But we can try and schedule flights to give us half days ect. to allow some London time.

As far as stops, we don't have a set number, but seems like the drive is about 9 hours direct, so we figured at least 3 or 4 -4ish hour pushes would do the trick and not be too stressful.

Like I mentioned we are very flexible and just want to get the best cross country experience we can (planes trains, and or auto), or determine its not really feasible and plan another itenirary.

Thanks.

a route from London to Edinburgh pretty much encompasses the whole of England so of course there is plenty to see.

you could explore the Cotswolds, the Shropshire Hills, the Peak District, the Yorkshire Dales, the North York Moors, the Lake District, the North Pennines, Northumberland, the Scottish Borders, endless stately homes, gardens, castles, coastline and beaches

if you want to focus on cities then the train is best

if you like outdoor activities then head to the Lake District and stay there for a few nights.

the thing is when you think of England what images does it conjure up and what do you want to see? - Some people have literary interests e.g. the Brontes and visit Yorkshire, others head to Liverpool because of the Beatles, Alnwick Castle for Harry Potter, Hadrian's Wall, medieval cathedrals and so on

you need to tell us what you want to see before thinking of a route

if you don't know what you want to see then you need to more research otherwise everybody will throw random suggestions at you

the stock response is to visit York but that may not appeal to you - or does it??

OK great -- 13 days total nets you 10.5 days on the ground. If Scotland is the main focus -- do Scotland.

You could fly into LHR and book a flight 3 or 4 hours later up to EDI. Spend the first 3 nights in Edinburgh both recovering from jet lag and exploring that wonderful city. Then rent a car a work out a 5-6 day driving tour returning to either GLA or EDI the afternoon/evening before your flight home, fly down to LHR, stay the night and fly home.

Even w/ 6 full days driving around Scotland you will have to be very selective which areas you cover -- the typical trek up to Inverness, over to Skye, down through Glencoe and back to the airport . . . OR - fly up to Inverness and work your way down to Edinburgh and fly to LHR (or in reverse into Edinburgh, meander up to Inverness and fly down to LHR from there) . . . OR up the east coast through Fife, and the Castle Trail/Deeside and fly from Aberdeen to LHR.

You really don't have time to drive the length of England (if you actually want to see/do anything much en route) plus see much of Scotland.

(I lived in England near the Cotswolds for 5 years and travel to England and or Scotland 2 or 3 times every year -- and there are no wrong choices - there are literally hundreds of places you could go in both countries. But you have less than 2 weeks so I'd concentrate on your 'must see' Scotland)

the thread didn't top . . . TTT

Yeah . . .

You need to dial back a bit. Your hobbit will be (1) incontinent, (2) constantly adjusting to new surroundings, (3) fully dependent upon you and wife, (4) essentially mute (by 12 mos. they can pronounce some words [badly] and gesture, not hold colloquies on European tax policy), therefore your trip needs to account for him, not you.

This is really simple: you cannot travel with a protohuman the same way you travel with your wife. It's actually easier to travel with a newborn or a sub-7 month old (up to 8 or 9 at best, that's the "potted plant" stage) than it is to travel with a semi-ambulatory klutz that screeches and babbles at random intervals. The newborn will cling to you and wife and not care about the surroundings. The potted plant will just look around and make noise. The toddler wants to explore.

What you need to consider is the HUB AND SPOKE approach. It means that there's a stable place for junior to sleep (say 2-3 destinations - London, York, Edinburgh) and you and wife can drag him around to wherever you're set on wandering for the day. At 12 months, you are (or will be) beyond the time for traipsing around England and Scotland with one-night stopovers with the miniyou in the back of the car.

BigRuss - we did a 3 week trip to North America when our DD was just one [she had her first birthday on Cape Cod to be precise] and though we made a lot of mistakes, we - and she - lived to tell the tale. And we had a blast. so no need to over-dramatise the situation, IMHO.

Where I do agree with you is the "hub and spoke" approach. and the hubs need to be places where you can find enough to do if child is ill/fractious/needs to sleep in etc.

So personally I would think London - Edinburgh - York - not necessarily for equal amounts of time and not necessarily in that order.

I like BigRuss's so-called over- dramatizing. It makes me smile and is not that far from the realities of traveling with children. Parents traveling with young children for the first time need to be aware of the situations that may well occur. Forewarned and prepared will be an advantage. Arguably, some children are better travelers than others and may well adapt to the parents travel style. Others not so much.

I also agree with the "hub- spoke" approach and, as both BigRuss and annhig mentioned, London- York- Edinburgh is a good combination.

I'm not overdramatizing.

Every statement I made is true and accurate. Just because I don't write in soothing tones and use anodyne phrases that suit annhig's tastes doesn't mean I'm inaccurate or even being "dramatic."

To the OP: facts are facts. Your semiperson requires MORE effort at 12 months than during the cry-eat-poop-sleep phase. As a newborn, the child needs a few things and your issue is adjusting from single to married-no-kids to married-with-pregnant-wife to a minimal routine. The world gets bigger and more complex as the wee tacker ages.

London york edinburgh would be a great tro. All by train except a flight back to LHR the night before flying out. Or reverse it and fly straight up to Edinburgh - train to York - train to London and spend the last 4 or 5 days there

Here is an excellent website for Scotland. It'll give you suggestions for breweries, mountain biking and special events and just about everything else. . www.visitscotland.com

I still have nighmares about travelling with daughter when she was that age. She got bored just sitting in the car as she couldn't see much and there was a limit what you could do to keep her entertained.

Are you sure your 1 year old will enjoy "We all enjoy the city(museums,historical structures, dinning, breweries ect.)as well as the outdoors (hiking,biking,rafting, geocaching)." What activities geared to him - paddling on a beach paddling or playing in the sand?

Travelling with a 1 year old also takes a LOT LONGER than you might expect. With 13 days on the ground, you need to be realsistic as to what is practicable.

I also secong janisj's comments about flying from Heathrow to Edinburgh and concentrating on Scotland. A lot of the drive from London to Edinburgh is pretty boring. In your time scale you haven't got enough time to stop and explore on the way. Sofarsogood's suggestion of 'you could explore the Cotswolds, the Shropshire Hills, the Peak District, the Yorkshire Dales, the North York Moors, the Lake District, the North Pennines, Northumberland, the Scottish Borders, endless stately homes, gardens, castles, coastline and beaches' would be fine if you had three weeks to do it....

>> would be fine if you had three weeks to do it….<< . . . and that would be before you made it to Edinburgh.

I did smile about this bit >>(will be 1yr old for the trip, great traveling so far)<< . . . which means he is now about 6 months old. How well an infant travels isn't necessarily an indication what things will be as a toddler.

He isn't teething or crawling or walking yet -- things will change a LOT.

I agree with BigRuss. I just had our 16 month old granddaughter visit for a week, along with her two siblings and parent. At 12 months, (similar to 16 months) sitting in a car seat for 4-6 hours per day will be torture for him and therefore, for you. How do you plan to feed him? British food is different than American food and seasonings are different. All you need is a child throwing up and having diarrhea everyday and night. (My 16 month old was sick for 3 days with aforementioned ailments). How do you find Doctors to treat him? Got cash for payments? Where will he sleep? Where do you buy diapers? My recommendation is to leave the little feller with the not traveling grandparents and enjoy the two weeks off. You are opening a can of whoop ass that you cannot control.

who says this child is going to be sat in a car for 4-6 hours a day?

yes food is a bit different but staples are pretty much the same - milk, bread, cereal, fruit - and almost every type of accommodation will provide a cot and a high chair. if it doesn't, you book one that does.

And any supermarket/chemist will sell nappies, wipes, a range of baby food, etc. We even have doctors and any hotel/B&B will be able to point you in the right direction [and the likelihood is that you won't have to pay, but if you do, that's what travel insurance is for].

goodness me, people travel with their kids all the time; all it needs is a bit of common sense.

You most certainly don't need to leave your some at home, but you do need to slow way down and not do a constantly moving road trip.

I agree w/ annhig but a few issues:

>>who says this child is going to be sat in a car for 4-6 hours a day? <<

He definitely will if they go w/ the initial plan of driving the length of the country and visiting Scotland.

>>almost every type of accommodation will provide a cot and a high chair<<

Hotels yes, but B&Bs less so -- in reality many B&Bs won't accept infants/toddlers

>>milk, bread, cereal, fruit -<< all good -- except milk <i>does</i> taste different in the UK.

>>except milk does taste different in the UK.<< IMO it tastes better, but definitely different

Thanks for the input. We definitely will not by any means keep our in a seat for 4 hour stretches. That was a driving total for the day with multiple stops in between. Seems like Google makes small work of what is a much longer drive. Google said about 8hr. We are in the very early stages of planning, plenty of time to make adjustments. I was just really curious about the driveablity. So it seems like our best bet will be heading to Scotland as directly as possible and exploring from there before heading back to London for our return trip.Thanks again for the advice.