Do the Spanish like Americans?
Oct 24th, 2007, 06:24 AM
#101
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Most Americans, have a hard time believing you would want to leave the greatest country on earth. We have been 'brainwashed' into believing this. Most of our relatives left Europe, it must be a horrible place to live. You hear everyday propaganda about the lazy socialists in Europe with their high taxes. In Europe, you have television shows where people leave their home country to establish lives elsewhere, I have seen UK and German versions called Leaving Deutschland for example. In the US, such a show would never exist.
Assimiliation is relative. We have an inherent human need to identify with a group of people that is why in America everyone is an CountryX-American.
Assimiliation is relative. We have an inherent human need to identify with a group of people that is why in America everyone is an CountryX-American.
Oct 25th, 2007, 12:05 AM
#102
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This is a very interesting thread...
It looks like many things have a different meanings in America...
For instance, Wekiva, you say one of the couples in your group was Spanish, as their parents were from Mexico. Well, they are Spanish-speakers, but they are NOT Spanish. Thats like saying that Jamaicans are English or Haitians French.
wou
You say people was correcting her all the time and that you would think they would appreciate her speaking something "close" to their language....Amazing opinion!!
Do you "appreciate" foreigners in the USA speaking something CLOSE to English? I'm sure you don't... Why the double standard?
Every time I've been to an English-speaking country, I've been corrected and people has been sometimes unpatient when I didn't understand something. I didn't consider it rude, it was my fault and I thoughgt it was good for me, that's the way to learn.
It looks like many things have a different meanings in America...
For instance, Wekiva, you say one of the couples in your group was Spanish, as their parents were from Mexico. Well, they are Spanish-speakers, but they are NOT Spanish. Thats like saying that Jamaicans are English or Haitians French.
wou
You say people was correcting her all the time and that you would think they would appreciate her speaking something "close" to their language....Amazing opinion!!
Do you "appreciate" foreigners in the USA speaking something CLOSE to English? I'm sure you don't... Why the double standard?
Every time I've been to an English-speaking country, I've been corrected and people has been sometimes unpatient when I didn't understand something. I didn't consider it rude, it was my fault and I thoughgt it was good for me, that's the way to learn.
Oct 25th, 2007, 05:40 AM
#103
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I'm going to come to wekiva's defense.
First of all, in the US it's not uncommon to refer to Spanish-speakers (such as Mexicans) as "Spanish." As far as I know, no one is offended by it, but maybe others can enlighten us about that. In any case, if you don't know what's customary in a country, I don't think you should be lecturing someone about it.
Point two. Apparently the Spanish are a lot more picky about their language than, say, the Italians, who seem quite willing to stumble along with you as you try to get the plural/masculine/feminine figured out.
Last point: Yes, we do appreciate it when someone tries to speak "close to English" (whatever that is). If someone with limited English skills who obviously wasn't an American approached me to ask a question or converse, I'd be respectful of that person's attempts to converse in the language. Americans (like the French) get a little testy when someone EXPECTS them to converse in another language while in the US.
First of all, in the US it's not uncommon to refer to Spanish-speakers (such as Mexicans) as "Spanish." As far as I know, no one is offended by it, but maybe others can enlighten us about that. In any case, if you don't know what's customary in a country, I don't think you should be lecturing someone about it.
Point two. Apparently the Spanish are a lot more picky about their language than, say, the Italians, who seem quite willing to stumble along with you as you try to get the plural/masculine/feminine figured out.
Last point: Yes, we do appreciate it when someone tries to speak "close to English" (whatever that is). If someone with limited English skills who obviously wasn't an American approached me to ask a question or converse, I'd be respectful of that person's attempts to converse in the language. Americans (like the French) get a little testy when someone EXPECTS them to converse in another language while in the US.
Oct 25th, 2007, 06:49 AM
#104
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J999 9 said
"in the US it's not uncommon to refer to Spanish-speakers (such as Mexicans) as "Spanish." As far as I know, no one is offended by it, but maybe others can enlighten us about that"
J, at least here in California it is a MAJOR bone of contention. I have seen many T shirts that say something like "I am not Spanish, or I am not Hispanic, I am Mexican, I am NOT Euopean etc etc ."
I have not seen this specifying any other Latino group other than Mexican, but in all fairness that is not to say they don't feel that way.
I personally am very proud of my Spanish heritage. But I am not Mexican.
I cannot speak for those that are offended. But I have spoken to many who are quite firm about the distinction. But it is clearly a big issue.
Additionally, in my work I am frequently required to ask customers for mandatory information re one's ethnicity (yes I know this will start another tangent). In any case the response to the question using the work "Hispanic" provokes all kinds of passionate replies. Some customers have asked me to scratch out "Hispanic" and write in "Mexican". Interestingly, so far these are never the first generation individuals that request this. Many do not even speak "Spanish" well.
But I agree that ot is sometimes interchanged. BYW the Spanish may be shocked to see what is being served here on the west coast in Mexican restaurants labled "Spanish Rice"
"in the US it's not uncommon to refer to Spanish-speakers (such as Mexicans) as "Spanish." As far as I know, no one is offended by it, but maybe others can enlighten us about that"
J, at least here in California it is a MAJOR bone of contention. I have seen many T shirts that say something like "I am not Spanish, or I am not Hispanic, I am Mexican, I am NOT Euopean etc etc ."
I have not seen this specifying any other Latino group other than Mexican, but in all fairness that is not to say they don't feel that way.
I personally am very proud of my Spanish heritage. But I am not Mexican.
I cannot speak for those that are offended. But I have spoken to many who are quite firm about the distinction. But it is clearly a big issue.
Additionally, in my work I am frequently required to ask customers for mandatory information re one's ethnicity (yes I know this will start another tangent). In any case the response to the question using the work "Hispanic" provokes all kinds of passionate replies. Some customers have asked me to scratch out "Hispanic" and write in "Mexican". Interestingly, so far these are never the first generation individuals that request this. Many do not even speak "Spanish" well.
But I agree that ot is sometimes interchanged. BYW the Spanish may be shocked to see what is being served here on the west coast in Mexican restaurants labled "Spanish Rice"
Oct 25th, 2007, 07:09 AM
#105
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amsdon: Thanks for the info. I admit that my observations were East Coast-centric. I've heard "Spanish" used here as a catch-all many times, with no offense taken. However, the situation may be different on the West Coast, for a variety of reasons.
Oct 25th, 2007, 07:31 AM
#106
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Hihi! What a super discussion. I wonder: how does Spanish people like Norwegians?????
Sorry, people "over there". Spanish people read your newspapers, see your hollywood films, and probably know some of your politics as well. They even speak your language.
Some people will like you for beeing an american, someone will love you for it. Someone will not care, and make their opinion upon your person.
Well - thats called life. It sucks - your gonna love it!
Sorry, people "over there". Spanish people read your newspapers, see your hollywood films, and probably know some of your politics as well. They even speak your language.
Some people will like you for beeing an american, someone will love you for it. Someone will not care, and make their opinion upon your person.
Well - thats called life. It sucks - your gonna love it!
Oct 25th, 2007, 07:41 AM
#107
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I know you were asking a rhetorical question regarding the Norwegians but here is an asnwer and not sure it is a current one. Scandanavians were called suecas due to there blonde hair. The connotation was that they were party people.
More than suecas I am curious as to the Spanish opinion toward all the Brit pensioners.
More than suecas I am curious as to the Spanish opinion toward all the Brit pensioners.
Oct 25th, 2007, 08:52 AM
#108
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"Do you "appreciate" foreigners in the USA speaking something CLOSE to English? I'm sure you don't... Why the double standard?"
argos364
When you ask a question don't immediately follow up the question with your own answer and conclusion.
I work in a quaint town with a wonderful park that I walk thru each day at lunch. At least once a week I am asked for directions and quite often it's from a tourist in broken English. First of all I'm impressed that they know any English at all as I am positive I don't know a single word in their language. And second...the last thing I would consider doing when they ask "Where is de train station"...is pronounce loudly....WHERE IS THE....THE...THE TRAIN STATION (a good example to what happened to us several times in Spain). No double standard here at all argos364.
argos364
When you ask a question don't immediately follow up the question with your own answer and conclusion.
I work in a quaint town with a wonderful park that I walk thru each day at lunch. At least once a week I am asked for directions and quite often it's from a tourist in broken English. First of all I'm impressed that they know any English at all as I am positive I don't know a single word in their language. And second...the last thing I would consider doing when they ask "Where is de train station"...is pronounce loudly....WHERE IS THE....THE...THE TRAIN STATION (a good example to what happened to us several times in Spain). No double standard here at all argos364.
Oct 25th, 2007, 09:15 AM
#109
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If my opinion is worth anything... usually nice brit pensioners are much better than brits red like shrimps and drunk (they live together in places like Benidorm).
And "suecas" didn't mean only party people...more like "extremely attractive and kinda exotic women" (didn't matter if they were swedish, scandinavian , brits ..just blondes
!
I think Americans are, in general, used to think about "melting pots". So they say often "European", "Asiatics", "Hispanic" but such things don't exist. I don't get offended (not at all, I don't think it is said purposedly to harm me) but I think it's a mistake. I am Spanish, but I don't have anything in common with a Mexican except the language, and even that, on its daily uses, it's more different than American English is from British English. So if I go to the States and someone tell me "Mexican", I am not offended, Mexico for me is as respectable a country as any other else, but it is a mistake..because I am not.
And "suecas" didn't mean only party people...more like "extremely attractive and kinda exotic women" (didn't matter if they were swedish, scandinavian , brits ..just blondes
! I think Americans are, in general, used to think about "melting pots". So they say often "European", "Asiatics", "Hispanic" but such things don't exist. I don't get offended (not at all, I don't think it is said purposedly to harm me) but I think it's a mistake. I am Spanish, but I don't have anything in common with a Mexican except the language, and even that, on its daily uses, it's more different than American English is from British English. So if I go to the States and someone tell me "Mexican", I am not offended, Mexico for me is as respectable a country as any other else, but it is a mistake..because I am not.
Oct 25th, 2007, 09:31 AM
#113
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I am afraid your description is qutite up to date, about the suecas
Norwegians abroad selebrate the fact that alcohol is 80% off, compared to the norwegian monopoly (yes: we are not allowed to by wine or spirits in other shops, only restaurants and bars)
Some of my friends had been to Tenerife, when they came back, they did not even know the name of the city
Norwegians abroad selebrate the fact that alcohol is 80% off, compared to the norwegian monopoly (yes: we are not allowed to by wine or spirits in other shops, only restaurants and bars)
Some of my friends had been to Tenerife, when they came back, they did not even know the name of the city
Oct 25th, 2007, 09:37 AM
#115
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Pray tell, when will American tourists stop thinking they are contestants in a charm contest. Go to Europe, Asia, Africa, South America and enjoy everything you'll want to see and experience. Just show a modicum of the respect your parents taught you, and good behavior, and you may win one of the awards.
I frankly don't think any tourists coming to our America give such concerns even the most casual thought. Shhheeeeesh!
Stu T.
I frankly don't think any tourists coming to our America give such concerns even the most casual thought. Shhheeeeesh!
Stu T.
Oct 25th, 2007, 11:06 AM
#116
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After 20+ visits to Spain, I have never ever met one single person correcting me in an unfriendly manner.
By no means I try to imply that it did not happen to the posters who said it happened to them. I am just honestly suprised.
And my command of Castellano is more "básico" than anything else.
Since I try to get better, I do not mind a friendly advice, though.
By no means I try to imply that it did not happen to the posters who said it happened to them. I am just honestly suprised.
And my command of Castellano is more "básico" than anything else.
Since I try to get better, I do not mind a friendly advice, though.
Oct 25th, 2007, 02:20 PM
#119
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LOL, Comfy !!
First, I don't have Paladin for breakfast.. I don't want to grow fattier
Second...there's no confusion about the definition..in Spanish language sueco or sueca are nationals (masculine and femenine) of Sweden.
On the 60's, when Scandinavians and Brits began to come here as tourists, people called all them "suecos/suecas" because they seemed all blonds, tall and beautiful, comparing to the Spaniards who were by then, very short and black hair. It was just ignorance from people that in 40 years had never seen a foreigner.
First, I don't have Paladin for breakfast.. I don't want to grow fattier
Second...there's no confusion about the definition..in Spanish language sueco or sueca are nationals (masculine and femenine) of Sweden.
On the 60's, when Scandinavians and Brits began to come here as tourists, people called all them "suecos/suecas" because they seemed all blonds, tall and beautiful, comparing to the Spaniards who were by then, very short and black hair. It was just ignorance from people that in 40 years had never seen a foreigner.
Oct 25th, 2007, 02:27 PM
#120
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Candy, "If Mohammad can't go to the mountain, let the mountain come to Mohammad", in other words, if you don't come to Lisbon maybe we can go to Castelon for Christmas break to eat some Paella Valenciana.
