Diss My List - restaurant recommendations for Florence
Oct 18th, 2011, 02:57 PM
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Diss My List - restaurant recommendations for Florence
We are leaving for Florence in less than a week and I can’t wait. We are staying at an apartment in the City Center for 9 days. We have spent a little time in Florence but really look forward to getting to know the city better. As I do my research on restaurants, I have encountered a conundrum that no doubt, many of you have. How to find the middle ground when reviews for Trattoria Sostanza range from “best meal in all of Italy” to “run, don’t walk from this terrible food” or Il Latini is either “the most fun filled night I had in Florence” or “an Italian Medieval Times equivalent with bad food.” It makes things a tad confusing. I know everyone has slightly different opinions of what makes for a great night out, but here’s what it is for us in Florence. Great food, of course, a fun vibe, no tourist menus, hopefully not thrown in the basement or near the bathroom because we’re not local and we are willing to spend some money but we’ve found some of our favorite meals were the least expensive ones. We are also totally up for travelling over the bridge and down the road for a great out of the way place. My husband can speak a fair amount of Italian and we’re game for most foods. Sooo, from friends, magazines and websites, here is my list so far. Rave, diss or add ones you guys love as I value your opinions. Thanks!
Trattoria Marione
Il Pizzaiulo
Sostanza
Trattoria 4 Leoni
ZEB
Osteria di Giovanni
iO Osteria Personale
Coco lezzone
Osteria del Cinghiale Bianco
Trattoria Dei 13 Gobbi (this one really ran the gamut on opinions)
Trattoria Marione
Il Pizzaiulo
Sostanza
Trattoria 4 Leoni
ZEB
Osteria di Giovanni
iO Osteria Personale
Coco lezzone
Osteria del Cinghiale Bianco
Trattoria Dei 13 Gobbi (this one really ran the gamut on opinions)
Oct 18th, 2011, 08:47 PM
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Whose reviews are you reading? Sostanza gets consistently high marks from posters on Chowhound's Italy board, most of whom either live in Italy or who have traveled there at least a dozen time, and all of whom have food as a major focus of their visits. Many are also cooks.
There have recently been several long threads about Florence eateries, and with lots of follow-up from people who were there within the past 6 months.
http://chowhound.chow.com/boards/58
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/803184
There have recently been several long threads about Florence eateries, and with lots of follow-up from people who were there within the past 6 months.
http://chowhound.chow.com/boards/58
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/803184
Oct 19th, 2011, 03:42 AM
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Well, some of the reasons why the reviews are all over the place is that people's expectations are all over the place.
1. If the restaurant is in a guidebook or on TripAdvisor or here, it is not undiscovered, and there will be Other Tourists. They will hate seeing you there just as much as you hate seeing them there. The big question is whether there will also be Italians. If there are, especially if they are taking Nonna out for her birthday, it is a good sign.
2. You will probably be seated in a foreigners' ghetto, most likely an English speaking ghetto. This because only a few of the staff are likely to speak English, and it is much more efficient to let them serve people who may or may not speak Italian and who may need considerable help with the menu. I don't mind the ghetto or the English speaking staff, but I want an Italian menu because the desscriptions and translations on the English menu are often bizarre.
3. Americans can be a pain in the butt. A woman at the table next to us in Florence complained that the water wasn't cold enough. That was the coldest water they had, and no we don't have ice. They comped her on the bottle, though I would have invited her to leave. It isn't Burger King, and no, you can't have it your way. That's how they do it.
4. The food often doesn't taste the way we expect from dining in Italian restaurants at home. White beans are on a lot of US menus, but I find that Tuscan white beans are often very boring despite being right at their source. Most people on here know that the amount of sauce on pasta is tiny compared to what we are served in the States, but not everyone knows it. In the north, polenta or farro or rice is faar more normal than pasta, and the pasta may not be very good.
5. Customs differ. An Italian-American man (spoke Italian fluently if not grammatically) asked for a spoon to twirl his pasta. The waitress said, "You eat like a child." Maybe she was nasty because he had a Calabrese accent, maybe she was nasty because Italians don't twirl their spaghetti in restaurants, any more than Parisians drink coffee from bowls in public. But not a happy customer.
We had a very nice nice meal at 13 Gobbio with a charming and helpful waiter who actually recommended a cheaper bottle of wine than we planned to buy. The garden room and the one next to it were plentifully salted with Americans and Brits, but we were surrounded with celebrating Italian families as well. Did the food explode in my mouth? Some did, some didn't, but that's Tuscaan food.
1. If the restaurant is in a guidebook or on TripAdvisor or here, it is not undiscovered, and there will be Other Tourists. They will hate seeing you there just as much as you hate seeing them there. The big question is whether there will also be Italians. If there are, especially if they are taking Nonna out for her birthday, it is a good sign.
2. You will probably be seated in a foreigners' ghetto, most likely an English speaking ghetto. This because only a few of the staff are likely to speak English, and it is much more efficient to let them serve people who may or may not speak Italian and who may need considerable help with the menu. I don't mind the ghetto or the English speaking staff, but I want an Italian menu because the desscriptions and translations on the English menu are often bizarre.
3. Americans can be a pain in the butt. A woman at the table next to us in Florence complained that the water wasn't cold enough. That was the coldest water they had, and no we don't have ice. They comped her on the bottle, though I would have invited her to leave. It isn't Burger King, and no, you can't have it your way. That's how they do it.
4. The food often doesn't taste the way we expect from dining in Italian restaurants at home. White beans are on a lot of US menus, but I find that Tuscan white beans are often very boring despite being right at their source. Most people on here know that the amount of sauce on pasta is tiny compared to what we are served in the States, but not everyone knows it. In the north, polenta or farro or rice is faar more normal than pasta, and the pasta may not be very good.
5. Customs differ. An Italian-American man (spoke Italian fluently if not grammatically) asked for a spoon to twirl his pasta. The waitress said, "You eat like a child." Maybe she was nasty because he had a Calabrese accent, maybe she was nasty because Italians don't twirl their spaghetti in restaurants, any more than Parisians drink coffee from bowls in public. But not a happy customer.
We had a very nice nice meal at 13 Gobbio with a charming and helpful waiter who actually recommended a cheaper bottle of wine than we planned to buy. The garden room and the one next to it were plentifully salted with Americans and Brits, but we were surrounded with celebrating Italian families as well. Did the food explode in my mouth? Some did, some didn't, but that's Tuscaan food.
Oct 19th, 2011, 06:11 AM
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I agree with Ackislander, my wife often complained that her red wine was too warm and I always asked for ice for my coca very nicely and in Italian, most of the time they really tried but many don't have an ice machine or it's not working. We have to remember that they cater to Italians not to Americans, I'm just glad that they have coke besides their disappointing mysterious house wine. Served in a large wine glass, coke presents a superb dark color, body and a more refreshing taste than their house wine.
By the time we got to Florence, we were tired of all the inadvertent mediocre Italian food we got at most restaurants, my personal highlight meal in Florence was actually at the Procacci wine bar at Via Tornabuoni 64 where they serve really nice wines along with their famous mini panino tartuffo. It's a small beautiful classic enoteca with a fun crowd and staff.
Another interesting restaurant is Acqua al 2, one/two blocks east of the Bargello museum. They serve pasta 5 different ways, or meat 3 different ways on one plate. Not expensive but fun. www.acquaal2.it
They have branches in San Diego and DC but with totally different concepts. We gave up on finding the great Italian food experience, which can probably be found at Enoteca Pinchiorri at €200 per person without wine or at the lesser Il Cibreo. Since your husband can understand Italian, it may be worth buying the Osterie d'Italia guidebook at any bookstore, this Italian slow food organization recommends good Italian simple restaurants that serve remarkable food at reasonable prices, among others, they recommend the Trattoria Cibreo which is the more affordable and simpler version of Picchi's well known Il Cibreo.
By the time we got to Florence, we were tired of all the inadvertent mediocre Italian food we got at most restaurants, my personal highlight meal in Florence was actually at the Procacci wine bar at Via Tornabuoni 64 where they serve really nice wines along with their famous mini panino tartuffo. It's a small beautiful classic enoteca with a fun crowd and staff.
Another interesting restaurant is Acqua al 2, one/two blocks east of the Bargello museum. They serve pasta 5 different ways, or meat 3 different ways on one plate. Not expensive but fun. www.acquaal2.it
They have branches in San Diego and DC but with totally different concepts. We gave up on finding the great Italian food experience, which can probably be found at Enoteca Pinchiorri at €200 per person without wine or at the lesser Il Cibreo. Since your husband can understand Italian, it may be worth buying the Osterie d'Italia guidebook at any bookstore, this Italian slow food organization recommends good Italian simple restaurants that serve remarkable food at reasonable prices, among others, they recommend the Trattoria Cibreo which is the more affordable and simpler version of Picchi's well known Il Cibreo.
Oct 19th, 2011, 07:10 AM
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Trattoria 4 Leone was the only place we ate in Florence that was really mediocre and unfriendly. We were placed in the "Foreigners ghetto," which was okay, but the waitress was really condescending, complaining about too many Americans that night eating all the specials and suggesting cheesecake for desert because, "all Americans like it." To top it off, she brought my wife the wrong order, they changed the cheese in one dish, and the food was unmemorable. With so many great places in Florence, we wish we hadn't gone there.
We didn't go, but I think that folks like Trattoria il Due G (or something like that). It's near the train station in a pretty nondescript neighborhood, but has an interesting looking menu.
We didn't go, but I think that folks like Trattoria il Due G (or something like that). It's near the train station in a pretty nondescript neighborhood, but has an interesting looking menu.
Oct 19th, 2011, 08:37 AM
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LOVED Sostanza and would return in a heartbeat (and, in fact, my in-laws did last year and still loved it).
LOVED Procacci wine bar at Via Tornabuoni 64.
Really look at the Chowhound posts - they are invaluable and have rarely steered me wrong. You can find my Florence trip report there.
LOVED Procacci wine bar at Via Tornabuoni 64.
Really look at the Chowhound posts - they are invaluable and have rarely steered me wrong. You can find my Florence trip report there.
Oct 19th, 2011, 12:03 PM
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We had a very different experience from uncjat at Trattoria 4 Leone - it was one our best meals, not only in Florence, but of our entire 3 week trip. We had excellent service, with a very kind waitress who was more than willing to engage us in Italian (at our request, in order to practice), the food was outstanding (especially Fiocchetti di pera in salsa di taleggio e asparagi, which is to die for good),and the restaurant was filled with far more Italians than Americans or other foreigners. This could be because we at at 9:00 - if you eat early, you end up with all the other Americans who are used to having dinner at 6:00.
On the other end of our experience Cocco Lezzone was a complete downer. It came highly recommended, not only in some of the review sources we read ("Salvatore Ferragamo's favorite restaurant"), but the Florentine barber my husband went to said it was by far the best place for bistecca fiorentino. Uh, no. Bright fluorescent light (no windows), tepid food, rude waiters. Don't go there.
On the other end of our experience Cocco Lezzone was a complete downer. It came highly recommended, not only in some of the review sources we read ("Salvatore Ferragamo's favorite restaurant"), but the Florentine barber my husband went to said it was by far the best place for bistecca fiorentino. Uh, no. Bright fluorescent light (no windows), tepid food, rude waiters. Don't go there.
Oct 19th, 2011, 12:43 PM
#14
Hi Italy06,
9 nights in Florence - you lucky things. where is your apartment?
I think that were i you, i would concentrate on the restaurants in your own neighbourhood. This is what I did when I was there in May and I found a great one - I ate there two nights in a row. It doesn't feature in any of the guides, or high on TA, but it fitted the bill for me.
there may be some recommendations in the apartment - they would be a good place to start. Personally I would avoid anywhere that is mentioned in a guide - it is likely to be full of other tourists and be inconsistent at best - see all the conflicting opinions above. and avoid anywhere with multi-lingual menus - ditto.
have a great trip!
ps - if you click on my screen name, you can see what I managed to fit into 2 1/2 days in Florence, including restaurants.
9 nights in Florence - you lucky things. where is your apartment?
I think that were i you, i would concentrate on the restaurants in your own neighbourhood. This is what I did when I was there in May and I found a great one - I ate there two nights in a row. It doesn't feature in any of the guides, or high on TA, but it fitted the bill for me.
there may be some recommendations in the apartment - they would be a good place to start. Personally I would avoid anywhere that is mentioned in a guide - it is likely to be full of other tourists and be inconsistent at best - see all the conflicting opinions above. and avoid anywhere with multi-lingual menus - ditto.
have a great trip!
ps - if you click on my screen name, you can see what I managed to fit into 2 1/2 days in Florence, including restaurants.
Oct 19th, 2011, 01:10 PM
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DAX: <i>Another interesting restaurant is Acqua al 2, one/two blocks east of the Bargello museum. They serve pasta 5 different ways, or meat 3 different ways on one plate. Not expensive but fun.</i>
We were just there a few days ago, in fact, and had both the pasta sampler and the steak sampler specials. We liked the place too. Good food, warmly casual atmosphere and impossibly cheap (yet good) house red.
(Note: Tuscany trip report to come, probably next week sometime.)
We were just there a few days ago, in fact, and had both the pasta sampler and the steak sampler specials. We liked the place too. Good food, warmly casual atmosphere and impossibly cheap (yet good) house red.
(Note: Tuscany trip report to come, probably next week sometime.)
Oct 19th, 2011, 01:46 PM
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Thanks all, for your great suggestions and thoughts! I agree Ackislander, people’s expectations ARE all over the place. When I see bad reviews of a restaurant and they include the phrase, “they barely spoke English,” I know to ignore them. Great observations and having grown up in Europe as an Army brat, I was shocked to find out how many Americans and their families never left the military bases because they were so frightened of anything new or culturally different. The differences are one of the biggest reason I think we all love going to foreign countries.
Zeppole – You’re right, most of the reviews for Sostanza have been fantastic and I’m just going to ignore the few that weren’t. I am sure we will love it! And Chowhound is my new best friend.
And annihig, I think you are right – we will wander our neighborhood and find a few places no doubt, that are on no one’s list that I will tell everyone about. What’s the worst that can happen, I have a mediocre meal in one of the most beautiful cities in the world? I can live with that! Our apartment is on Via Della Spada – I can smell the hot chocolate from the Roberto Cavalli café from my window. I will let you know how it is in person.
Thanks again to everyone who gave me some great suggestions, I will report back!
Zeppole – You’re right, most of the reviews for Sostanza have been fantastic and I’m just going to ignore the few that weren’t. I am sure we will love it! And Chowhound is my new best friend.
And annihig, I think you are right – we will wander our neighborhood and find a few places no doubt, that are on no one’s list that I will tell everyone about. What’s the worst that can happen, I have a mediocre meal in one of the most beautiful cities in the world? I can live with that! Our apartment is on Via Della Spada – I can smell the hot chocolate from the Roberto Cavalli café from my window. I will let you know how it is in person.
Thanks again to everyone who gave me some great suggestions, I will report back!
Oct 20th, 2011, 05:38 AM
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One of my favorites in Florence is Dino. Now I haven't been there in awhile, but my memory of my first visit (1989) lingers. When confronted with the deserts, I commented that they "all look so good" but selected just one. They waiter then brought a little "taste" of each dolci! It was the moment I fell in love with Italy!
http://www.ristorantedino.it/english/home.html
This place was just reviewed in the NYTimes:
Ora d’Aria, Via dei Georgofili 11 Rosso, Florence; (39-055) 200-1699; www.oradariaristorante.com. Sleek, modern dining rooms; the one downstairs abuts the wine cellar. Don’t miss: New Wave panzanella salad. Dinner for two with wine, 170 to 200 euros. Open nightly except Sunday; for lunch, Tuesday through Saturday.
http://travel.nytimes.com/2011/10/02...=3&sq=Florence Italy&st=cse&scp=15
I'm headed to Florence in February, so let us know your favorite and your "find!"
Enjoy!
http://www.ristorantedino.it/english/home.html
This place was just reviewed in the NYTimes:
Ora d’Aria, Via dei Georgofili 11 Rosso, Florence; (39-055) 200-1699; www.oradariaristorante.com. Sleek, modern dining rooms; the one downstairs abuts the wine cellar. Don’t miss: New Wave panzanella salad. Dinner for two with wine, 170 to 200 euros. Open nightly except Sunday; for lunch, Tuesday through Saturday.
http://travel.nytimes.com/2011/10/02...=3&sq=Florence Italy&st=cse&scp=15
I'm headed to Florence in February, so let us know your favorite and your "find!"
Enjoy!
Oct 20th, 2011, 07:18 AM
#20
Italy - if you are in the area of the Ristorante Dino, do walk a few 100ms north and have a look round the market there. it's not as big as the Central Market but it's very interesting with a cafe in the centre which serves the most typical florentine dishes at very reasonable prices. get there by 12.30 if you don't want to queue for your places at a shared table.
lots of lovely food there for you to buy to eat in your apartment too!
lots of lovely food there for you to buy to eat in your apartment too!
