Discoveries in Hamburg and Munich
Nov 9th, 2009, 11:01 AM
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Discoveries in Hamburg and Munich
It's been about a month since I returned from four nights in Hamburg and five in Munich. Both cities are beautiful, each in it's own way, but equally delightful.
Hamburg: I could feel the economy in high gear in Hamburg. From the swank shops near Neuer Wall (Hermes - oo la la - you have to go there just to look at the China) to the continuous traffic at the port, the place oozes mercantile power. It's actually pretty difficult to get a photo in any area of Hafencity without a building crane looming above the canals. I loved it. It rained a bit, was windy a bit, cold a bit, sunny a bit and very walkable. Public transport is easy and cheap but I still haven't figured out how to orient myself once I emerge from the metro (for another forum).
Hotel: We stayed at the Grand Elysee on Rothembaumchausee, for 209 Euros and were very satisfied. Our room was comfortable and clean, you get all the mod cons, two restaurants, a grand lobby, a helpful friendly staff. It was a short walk to Binnenalster and the Planten un Blomen park. I'd definately stay there again.
Restaurants: We ate at Fischmarket with friends and thought the food was OK, the ambience marred by the fact that all the patrons were other tourists (for me, never a good sign), and the service was dreadful. After ordering wine and a starter, a plate with various selections of Sushi starters, our waitress insisted that the one starter wouldn't be enough for us. There ensued a bit of a back and forth about that but she was insistent so we all figured the portions must be miniscule. Therefore we ordered a second array of the traditional starters. When the starters arrived, we realized we should have stuck to our guns because each starter plate was a meal in itself! Oh well, not to worry. Our waitress then brought our wine (we ordered two bottles, one red another white) to our table ALREADY OPENED!! I've never seen that anywhere in the world. Not only that but she brought the WRONG wine. The red was correct but the second bottle was also a red, not the white my husband ordered. He told her that and she argued AGAIN. Oh no, she was adamant that we ordered the one she brought and that was the one she insisted we accept. We should have sent both back and demanded unopened bottles, but regardless, this time my husband let her have it, she sulkingly brought the white wine we ordered (I don't remember if it was also open). My husband demanded another wait person who was wonderful and the rest of the evening went well. We were very embarrassed because our friends were OUR guests. Unlike just about everyone else on the planet, I won't go back.
A traditional German restaurant we loved was Brodersen on Rothenbaumchaussee. Our concierge suggested this place which was on a residential street close to our hotel. What a delightful experience we had. The place is cozy and fills up with a mix of locals and tourists. We ate schnitzel and potato soup and potato salad and it was great. The staff are just plain happy. Yes, really happy. Our waitress laughed, joked and oh, how I wish we had taken our friends there! The food was inexpensive - about 15 euro for a dinner plate - and the wine was just what we ordered
I'd definitely return.
We had a quick, cheap, good meal at Ponti on Gansemarkt. We were caught in a downpour and took refuge there. The place was packed with all sorts of people and fit the bill at the time. I'd return for a good cheap meal.
Stadbaekerei in Gansemarkt had out of this world pastries but be warned, the lines can be long.
To be continued...
Hamburg: I could feel the economy in high gear in Hamburg. From the swank shops near Neuer Wall (Hermes - oo la la - you have to go there just to look at the China) to the continuous traffic at the port, the place oozes mercantile power. It's actually pretty difficult to get a photo in any area of Hafencity without a building crane looming above the canals. I loved it. It rained a bit, was windy a bit, cold a bit, sunny a bit and very walkable. Public transport is easy and cheap but I still haven't figured out how to orient myself once I emerge from the metro (for another forum).
Hotel: We stayed at the Grand Elysee on Rothembaumchausee, for 209 Euros and were very satisfied. Our room was comfortable and clean, you get all the mod cons, two restaurants, a grand lobby, a helpful friendly staff. It was a short walk to Binnenalster and the Planten un Blomen park. I'd definately stay there again.
Restaurants: We ate at Fischmarket with friends and thought the food was OK, the ambience marred by the fact that all the patrons were other tourists (for me, never a good sign), and the service was dreadful. After ordering wine and a starter, a plate with various selections of Sushi starters, our waitress insisted that the one starter wouldn't be enough for us. There ensued a bit of a back and forth about that but she was insistent so we all figured the portions must be miniscule. Therefore we ordered a second array of the traditional starters. When the starters arrived, we realized we should have stuck to our guns because each starter plate was a meal in itself! Oh well, not to worry. Our waitress then brought our wine (we ordered two bottles, one red another white) to our table ALREADY OPENED!! I've never seen that anywhere in the world. Not only that but she brought the WRONG wine. The red was correct but the second bottle was also a red, not the white my husband ordered. He told her that and she argued AGAIN. Oh no, she was adamant that we ordered the one she brought and that was the one she insisted we accept. We should have sent both back and demanded unopened bottles, but regardless, this time my husband let her have it, she sulkingly brought the white wine we ordered (I don't remember if it was also open). My husband demanded another wait person who was wonderful and the rest of the evening went well. We were very embarrassed because our friends were OUR guests. Unlike just about everyone else on the planet, I won't go back.
A traditional German restaurant we loved was Brodersen on Rothenbaumchaussee. Our concierge suggested this place which was on a residential street close to our hotel. What a delightful experience we had. The place is cozy and fills up with a mix of locals and tourists. We ate schnitzel and potato soup and potato salad and it was great. The staff are just plain happy. Yes, really happy. Our waitress laughed, joked and oh, how I wish we had taken our friends there! The food was inexpensive - about 15 euro for a dinner plate - and the wine was just what we ordered
I'd definitely return. We had a quick, cheap, good meal at Ponti on Gansemarkt. We were caught in a downpour and took refuge there. The place was packed with all sorts of people and fit the bill at the time. I'd return for a good cheap meal.
Stadbaekerei in Gansemarkt had out of this world pastries but be warned, the lines can be long.
To be continued...
Nov 9th, 2009, 11:25 AM
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Hamburg continued - The Kunsthalle was fabulous and it took up most of one day. I love museums, and always linger over all that beauty in one place. St. Petrikirche and Jokobikirche were lovely and not as ornate as many other churches I've visited in Europe. I was amazed at the rebuilding effort since WWII, which has created a dynamic cityscape with old next to new next to rebuilt. I could be wrong, but I felt the heart of the city is the port. It's massive and active and people are strolling everywhere.
We traveled to Munich on the ICE, which was fast, comfortable, and quiet. I bought the tickets a couple of months before leaving and got a special deal. Two first class tickets with assigned seats for 125 Euro. Second class is just fine, but this was a good deal.
Gotta go and will continue Munich when I get the chance...
We traveled to Munich on the ICE, which was fast, comfortable, and quiet. I bought the tickets a couple of months before leaving and got a special deal. Two first class tickets with assigned seats for 125 Euro. Second class is just fine, but this was a good deal.
Gotta go and will continue Munich when I get the chance...
Nov 10th, 2009, 10:12 AM
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Sorry to hear about the bad dining experience, which I hope did not ruin it for you. Normally service was where Fischmarkt really excelled in my experience - either something went terribly wrong there (which it almost seems, as apparently the second waiter was better), or their standards have slipped (and I don't remember it being overrun with tourists either). Thanks for the heads up - I'll take a look at it the next time I am in town. Hope the rest was good enough to compensate.
Nov 13th, 2009, 06:26 PM
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Thanks for your report, especially interested in what you had to say about Hamburg, since we have a trip planned there this summer. Is public transport in Hamburg by zones? Do you remember what it cost to ride the trams? Thanks very much.
Nov 13th, 2009, 11:08 PM
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- http://www.hvv.de/en/index.php?
- It is by zones (called "Ring").
- There are no trams (anymore and yet as a demented coalition resolution has led to the redevelopment and planned re-introcdction of certain tram lines that will waste precious space for cars, but that is of no concern for you), but a wide choice of
- S-Bahn trains (above ground trains in general, portions are underground).
- U-Bahn trains (the supposed equivalent to a subway, but actually large portions of it are above ground, too.)
- Buses.
- Ferries on the river Elbe (Alster boats not incl).
-Costs are marginal.
- A single trip will cost between EUR 1.30 (a few bus stops in the inner center only) and EUR 7.20 (but that would take you some 60 km outside the city). In most cases single fare will be EUR 2.70.
- A daypass for use after 09.00 h a.m. is EUR 5.30 (so it pays off with a return trip to one destination already) if you stay within the city and its closer suburbs.
- A day pass for up to 5 travelling together is EUR 8.95 for use after 09.00 h a.m. if coinfined to almost all of the city and its closer suburbs.
- A 3-day pass will set you back EUR 15.60.
- A Hamburg Card will cost you EUR 8.50 for a day and EUR 18.90 for 3 days and entitles you and up to 3 kids 6 - 14 years to free travel and discounts at sights, restaurants etc.
http://www.hamburg-tourism.de/en/sea.../hamburg-card/
- Kids under 6 years have free travel, over 14 pay full fare. In between there are reduced fares.
- It is by zones (called "Ring").
- There are no trams (anymore and yet as a demented coalition resolution has led to the redevelopment and planned re-introcdction of certain tram lines that will waste precious space for cars, but that is of no concern for you), but a wide choice of
- S-Bahn trains (above ground trains in general, portions are underground).
- U-Bahn trains (the supposed equivalent to a subway, but actually large portions of it are above ground, too.)
- Buses.
- Ferries on the river Elbe (Alster boats not incl).
-Costs are marginal.
- A single trip will cost between EUR 1.30 (a few bus stops in the inner center only) and EUR 7.20 (but that would take you some 60 km outside the city). In most cases single fare will be EUR 2.70.
- A daypass for use after 09.00 h a.m. is EUR 5.30 (so it pays off with a return trip to one destination already) if you stay within the city and its closer suburbs.
- A day pass for up to 5 travelling together is EUR 8.95 for use after 09.00 h a.m. if coinfined to almost all of the city and its closer suburbs.
- A 3-day pass will set you back EUR 15.60.
- A Hamburg Card will cost you EUR 8.50 for a day and EUR 18.90 for 3 days and entitles you and up to 3 kids 6 - 14 years to free travel and discounts at sights, restaurants etc.
http://www.hamburg-tourism.de/en/sea.../hamburg-card/
- Kids under 6 years have free travel, over 14 pay full fare. In between there are reduced fares.
Nov 14th, 2009, 11:41 AM
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hsv: Thanks very much for such a comprehensive reply. I wonder if you know if there is a weekly or monthly pass available. We'll be in Hamburg for five weeks. Thanks again. I will have to check out some of your websites that you so thoughtfully provided.
I wonder if you know if there is a weekly or monthly pass available. We'll be in Hamburg for five weeks. Thanks again. I will have to check out some of your websites that you so thoughtfully provided.
Jan 15th, 2010, 07:36 AM
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E-Gads! Time accelerates during the holidays. Sorry about the delay and here it goes.
Who wouldn't love Munich? The transportation system zips you everywhere you need to go, the city is lively and interesting, and has a good mix of locals and tourists. On our first day there, the weather was mild with rain but by the time we left it was snowing! Locals were shocked by snow so early in the year.
We started out in a hotel booked by a colleague of my husband, the Hotel Leopold on Leopoldstrasse. Tripadvisor gives this hotel a lot of rave reviews and for the life of me I can't figure out why. It was dreadful. I'm always suspicious of "quaint family owned hotels." They can go either way and this one went south fast. The staff was professional except the lady who worked in the restaurant during breakfast. She was an unpleasant grouch. The shabby, cold, not-too-clean room we had was on the top floor and there wasn't an elevator. For us, that isn't a problem, we're fit and adventurous, but for some it might be. We could not get wifi in the room and a pile of dirty linens stayed in the hallway for the two nights we were there. There was a smell of something very moldy. The breakfast buffet was inedible. The fruit on the rotten side, scrambled eggs tasted nasty, breads and pastries day-old. The coffee was fine, but the aforementioned waitress begrudgingly brought warm milk for it WHEN I could find her. On the upside, the location, on Leopoldstrasse, was just what we like. Not on the main tourist drag but close enough to access the sites easily. There were plenty of restaurants, cafes, bars, shopping and normal Munich goings on. A better hotel in the same area would be great.
After two nights we moved to the Hilton Park Hotel. Yeah, I know, corporate business hotel, the same wherever you go, but what a welcomed relief. Clean, organized, great breakfast and located in the beautiful English Garden. The bus stops right outside the hotel, so access to the city was easy. We get points there and I got a last minute online deal
On our first night in town our Munich friends took us to an Italian restaurant, Limoni Ristorante on Amelianstrasse. Wow, what a great restaurant. The ambience is modern cool, the service exemplary and the food prepared perfectly. I don't remember exactly what we ordered but the four of us loved each and every dish. I had lunch a couple of times in a restaurant hovering above and with views of Marianplatz - Glockenspiel Cafe. The food is very good (warm strudel to die for) and it's a lively, crowded, fun place. We went to the Lowenbraukeller with friends. It was a truly Bavarian experience. Large platters of all sorts of German meats, potato salad and saurkraut. Of course, they have fabulous beer and it seemed that everyone in the place was German except my husband and I. You go to these places for the experience, not fine cuisine. Other restaurants we ate at were museum cafes, a couple of bars on Leopoldstrasse and we grabbed a bite at the food court in the train station. All were good and service always cordial.
more about the sites later...
Who wouldn't love Munich? The transportation system zips you everywhere you need to go, the city is lively and interesting, and has a good mix of locals and tourists. On our first day there, the weather was mild with rain but by the time we left it was snowing! Locals were shocked by snow so early in the year.
We started out in a hotel booked by a colleague of my husband, the Hotel Leopold on Leopoldstrasse. Tripadvisor gives this hotel a lot of rave reviews and for the life of me I can't figure out why. It was dreadful. I'm always suspicious of "quaint family owned hotels." They can go either way and this one went south fast. The staff was professional except the lady who worked in the restaurant during breakfast. She was an unpleasant grouch. The shabby, cold, not-too-clean room we had was on the top floor and there wasn't an elevator. For us, that isn't a problem, we're fit and adventurous, but for some it might be. We could not get wifi in the room and a pile of dirty linens stayed in the hallway for the two nights we were there. There was a smell of something very moldy. The breakfast buffet was inedible. The fruit on the rotten side, scrambled eggs tasted nasty, breads and pastries day-old. The coffee was fine, but the aforementioned waitress begrudgingly brought warm milk for it WHEN I could find her. On the upside, the location, on Leopoldstrasse, was just what we like. Not on the main tourist drag but close enough to access the sites easily. There were plenty of restaurants, cafes, bars, shopping and normal Munich goings on. A better hotel in the same area would be great.
After two nights we moved to the Hilton Park Hotel. Yeah, I know, corporate business hotel, the same wherever you go, but what a welcomed relief. Clean, organized, great breakfast and located in the beautiful English Garden. The bus stops right outside the hotel, so access to the city was easy. We get points there and I got a last minute online deal
On our first night in town our Munich friends took us to an Italian restaurant, Limoni Ristorante on Amelianstrasse. Wow, what a great restaurant. The ambience is modern cool, the service exemplary and the food prepared perfectly. I don't remember exactly what we ordered but the four of us loved each and every dish. I had lunch a couple of times in a restaurant hovering above and with views of Marianplatz - Glockenspiel Cafe. The food is very good (warm strudel to die for) and it's a lively, crowded, fun place. We went to the Lowenbraukeller with friends. It was a truly Bavarian experience. Large platters of all sorts of German meats, potato salad and saurkraut. Of course, they have fabulous beer and it seemed that everyone in the place was German except my husband and I. You go to these places for the experience, not fine cuisine. Other restaurants we ate at were museum cafes, a couple of bars on Leopoldstrasse and we grabbed a bite at the food court in the train station. All were good and service always cordial.
more about the sites later...
Jan 15th, 2010, 10:16 AM
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Museums. I love museums and took in Nueue Pinakothek, (lovely, small, some fine artwork and a very good restaurant), Alte Pinakothek (give yourself a lot of time - wow), The Munich City Museum (many oddball exhibits, presents the history of Munich well and charming), The Residenz (I found it mildly interesting - you do a lot of walking) and my very favorite, The Kunsthalle. Actually the Kunsthalle is more of a gallery than a museum (IMHO) and they had a fabulous exhibit of Alfons Mucha artwork. Although everything was in German, which I don't speak, four? rooms filled with Mucha made this the most memorable site I visited in Munich.
Munich has some lovely churches. I enjoy the "ABC" tours and find churches a fine place to rest my feet, review my guide book/notes, and meditate on what I've seen and how I feel. St. Peter's is remarkable and the photos showing how devastated the church was after WWII just inside the entrance, made me appreciate how beautifully restored it was. The entire city as well. Frauenkirche, St. Michael's and Damenstift churches are all beautiful and well worth a quick stop. I was disappointed that Asamkirche was closed. However, the streets around there aren't as touristy and a lot of fun.
With four full days in Munich, you can't miss the Glockenspiel do it's thing in Marienplatz. For me it isn't something worth waiting for, but obviously many people love to watch the mechanism. The streets in old town are fun to walk, and the Vitualien Market is wonderful. I took tons of photos of the vendor's stands and people buying whatever was sold. I wander a lot and Central Munich is easy to walk. In warmer weather I would have walked more but it was so cold that I used buses and the metro, both cheap and will take you anywhere.
One thing that stood out in central Munich was the shopping. The streets were filled with shoppers each day we were there. I mean crowded. I must say the shopping was great fun. I bought a beautiful watch in a shop on a small street on our way to the Nueue Pinakothek. I've never seen one like it and get compliments all the time. Also, I bought two candelabras in the Karstadt Department Store, which I had shipped home. Mostly you read about Dallymayr's Delicatessen for buying lovely food stuff but there's more to shopping in Munich than that. Finding that quality and quantity of shops was something I didn't expect.
Oh, one more thing. I found my notes and at Limoni I ate a mixed sushi appetizer, Cod and Lentils for a main course but didn't write down the dessert. The food isn't traditional Italian at all.
We had a fabulous time in Munich and would return in a heartbeat. The people are easy to start up a conversation with, warm and friendly, and there's a lot to do with easy access. Thank you Fodorites for the advice you gave me before our trip. This is always an important resource for my research before traveling anywhere. You're the best.
Munich has some lovely churches. I enjoy the "ABC" tours and find churches a fine place to rest my feet, review my guide book/notes, and meditate on what I've seen and how I feel. St. Peter's is remarkable and the photos showing how devastated the church was after WWII just inside the entrance, made me appreciate how beautifully restored it was. The entire city as well. Frauenkirche, St. Michael's and Damenstift churches are all beautiful and well worth a quick stop. I was disappointed that Asamkirche was closed. However, the streets around there aren't as touristy and a lot of fun.
With four full days in Munich, you can't miss the Glockenspiel do it's thing in Marienplatz. For me it isn't something worth waiting for, but obviously many people love to watch the mechanism. The streets in old town are fun to walk, and the Vitualien Market is wonderful. I took tons of photos of the vendor's stands and people buying whatever was sold. I wander a lot and Central Munich is easy to walk. In warmer weather I would have walked more but it was so cold that I used buses and the metro, both cheap and will take you anywhere.
One thing that stood out in central Munich was the shopping. The streets were filled with shoppers each day we were there. I mean crowded. I must say the shopping was great fun. I bought a beautiful watch in a shop on a small street on our way to the Nueue Pinakothek. I've never seen one like it and get compliments all the time. Also, I bought two candelabras in the Karstadt Department Store, which I had shipped home. Mostly you read about Dallymayr's Delicatessen for buying lovely food stuff but there's more to shopping in Munich than that. Finding that quality and quantity of shops was something I didn't expect.
Oh, one more thing. I found my notes and at Limoni I ate a mixed sushi appetizer, Cod and Lentils for a main course but didn't write down the dessert. The food isn't traditional Italian at all.
We had a fabulous time in Munich and would return in a heartbeat. The people are easy to start up a conversation with, warm and friendly, and there's a lot to do with easy access. Thank you Fodorites for the advice you gave me before our trip. This is always an important resource for my research before traveling anywhere. You're the best.
Apr 18th, 2010, 04:41 PM
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thanks for the report Jahlie. We are thinking about a Munich trip for September. Do you think there is plenty to do there for a week? Planning to stay for about 10 days with several day/side trips planned.
Apr 26th, 2010, 03:09 PM
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Depending on what you like to do, how fast you get that done and what's going on in Munich at the time, Munich could take up part of a week. Four days was just right for us. If you don't want to change hotels and move around too much, there are some day trips you can take from Munich, like Neuschwanstein or Dachau. However, depending on where else you plan on going you might be able to see those on the way.
How are you traveling? Car, train? Where else are you going? September will be a beautiful time of the year in southern Germany - you might want to find out if there are any festivals or events to take in. That's usually a lot of fun.
Whatever you do, you'll have a fabulous time.
How are you traveling? Car, train? Where else are you going? September will be a beautiful time of the year in southern Germany - you might want to find out if there are any festivals or events to take in. That's usually a lot of fun.
Whatever you do, you'll have a fabulous time.
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